New Screen Lamination = Total Redesign?

[Johnf1285]

So I've been thinking about the rumors from KGI Securities about the new screen lamination issues ever since we first learned about it. If the glass is going to be laminated to the actual LED panel, then chances are we are looking at a redesigned model.

What is everyone's thoughts on this?

Will Apple continue to use some sort of uni-body set up?
Will the screen be easy to remove, or even more difficult (no more dust between glass and LED )?
Will the internals be on an even further lock down from the user?

 

[Johnf1285]

I for one think that the following is going to happen:

1. Apple is going to offer a full redesign along the lines of MacBook Pro > MacBook Pro with Retina

2. The screen is going to have the glass fully laminated to it. There will not be a matte option. The screen will be installed to the unibody chassis similarly to how it is now, but that it may only be held in with powerful magnets. With the screen most likely being slimmer, its very possible that it could mount this way. The other scenario is that its glued in or extremely difficult to remove.

3. No more ODD, flash storage across the board. This will allow Apple to make the transition on their desktop models, but to also champion Thunderbolt storage as a viable option for TB's worth of data. I'm in favor of this. I've had a few dead hard drives on an iMac because they just roast in there. I don't want to deal with it again, especially if this new screen technology results in harder access to the machines internals.

4. Access to the inside of the iMac might be very restricted. I am not sure how I feel about this. I guess we will see.

Well, those are my thoughts. Would like to hear from everyone else!

 

[edry.hilario]

New design for sure

 

[Lynn Belvedere]

I'm hoping for a new design with a significantly smaller bottom bezel.

 

[Reaktor5]

The only thing I wouldn't mind is the removal of the chin and make the bezel around the screen a little smaller. I'm not sure how Jonathan Ive could create a radical change from the current model but if there was anyone who could, it would be him.

 

[Johnf1285]

Yeah I agree. I bet we get something that looks more like the current Thunderbolt Display. I would love for the iMac to bring back hard corners and edges as opposed to the smoothed out edges on the rear. Also, remove the Apple logo from the front and have it say iMac or say nothing, we already have a giant one on the rear!

 

[turtlez]

cooked hard drives?? oh man I am having 2nd thoughts about iMac now. I must get a new computer soon and I don't mind if it is redesigned or not. If these heat issues are really that bad I hope they move to non moving part design completely.

 

[A Hebrew]

cooked hard drives?? oh man I am having 2nd thoughts about iMac now. I must get a new computer soon and I don't mind if it is redesigned or not. If these heat issues are really that bad I hope they move to non moving part design completely.

'Cooked Harddrives' are hardly an issue unless you do some crazy intense stuff for a crazy long time each day.

If they fail, your warranty should cover it.


I hope Apple keeps the iMac with a Hard Drive, too many people require the storage space for their primary computer to use flash storage.

If you are afraid of the hard drive frying, which will more than likely not happen, just buy an SSD and upgrade it.

 

[turtlez]

'Cooked Harddrives' are hardly an issue unless you do some crazy intense stuff for a crazy long time each day.

If they fail, your warranty should cover it.


I hope Apple keeps the iMac with a Hard Drive, too many people require the storage space for their primary computer to use flash storage.

If you are afraid of the hard drive frying, which will more than likely not happen, just buy an SSD and upgrade it.

Would you consider working in high resolution photoshop documents, indesign documents very intensive? I know what you mean by being limited in hard drive size if it went to flash but I know I would rather use an external drive for storage vs having an internal fry and lose all my data.

 

[A Hebrew]

Would you consider working in high resolution photoshop documents, indesign documents very intensive? I know what you mean by being limited in hard drive size if it went to flash but I know I would rather use an external drive for storage vs having an internal fry and lose all my data.

No.

 

[deconstruct60]

I for one think that the following is going to happen:

1. Apple is going to offer a full redesign along the lines of MacBook Pro > MacBook Pro with Retina

Unlikely. The iMac isn't going to a higher price point of a discontinued product to move into. Retina options, even if possible, would significantly increase costs. The iMac is already priced relatively high. Saddling it with a Retina display across the board would only make it more uncompetitive.

The screen will be installed to the unibody chassis similarly to how it is now, but that it may only be held in with powerful magnets. With the screen most likely being slimmer, its very possible that it could mount this way. The other scenario is that its glued in or extremely difficult to remove.

Glue? Heck no. Lots of screws would easily work, just like they work on the unibody MacBooks.

3. No more ODD, flash storage across the board. This will allow Apple to make the transition on their desktop models, but to also champion Thunderbolt storage as a viable option for TB's worth of data.

Crippling storage capacity does not champion Thunderbolt. It would only drive the $/GB price into uncompetitive range right now.

If tossing the ODD there is more than enough space for both inside the iMac. Tossing the ODD for "nothing" would be a huge bonehead move for a desktop. It isn't going to be that much thinner without the ODD. Simply merging the glass and LCD panel is enough to put a "even thinner" claim out there.

I've had a few dead hard drives on an iMac because they just roast in there. I don't want to deal with it again, especially if this new screen technology results in harder access to the machines internals.

Being "too thin" is one reason why components are being roasted in certain usage conditions inside an iMac. The "too thin for its own" good is a design flaw that is doubtful to push even harder.

Frankly roasting SSDs isn't that much different than roasting HDDs. SSD don't deal well either to having their internal components cooked.

 

[Johnf1285]

Unlikely. The iMac isn't going to a higher price point of a discontinued product to move into. Retina options, even if possible, would significantly increase costs. The iMac is already priced relatively high. Saddling it with a Retina display across the board would only make it more uncompetitive.




Glue? Heck no. Lots of screws would easily work, just like they work on the unibody MacBooks.




Crippling storage capacity does not champion Thunderbolt. It would only drive the $/GB price into uncompetitive range right now.

If tossing the ODD there is more than enough space for both inside the iMac. Tossing the ODD for "nothing" would be a huge bonehead move for a desktop. It isn't going to be that much thinner without the ODD. Simply merging the glass and LCD panel is enough to put a "even thinner" claim out there.



Being "too thin" is one reason why components are being roasted in certain usage conditions inside an iMac. The "too thin for its own" good is a design flaw that is doubtful to push even harder.

Frankly roasting SSDs isn't that much different than roasting HDDs. SSD don't deal well either to having their internal components cooked.

Great counter points.

I did want to point out that many SSD's can handle around 70c as their maximum operating temperatures. An advantage in the iMac as I have seen some spinning disks in the range of 60-62c under ordinary operating conditions, although not idle (non intensive load - subjective, I know).

Very exciting as we begin to take our wait into September!

 

[CalmEnvy]

What I really want is for the new iMac to lose the chin and look more like the Thunderbolt display. However instead of having the small Apple logo on the iMac like the Thunderbolt display it would say "iMac" on the bottom. It would look a lot nicer if you have a 27" iMac combined with a 27" Thunderbolt display and have them look exactly the same then how the iMac looks now.

 

[deconstruct60]

Great counter points.

I did want to point out that many SSD's can handle around 70c as their maximum operating temperatures. An advantage in the iMac as I have seen some spinning disks in the range of 60-62c under ordinary operating conditions, although not idle (non intensive load - subjective, I know).

Samsung 830

" ... Environmental Specs

32ᵒF to 140ᵒF Operating Temperature ..."
http://www.samsung.com/us/computer/memory-storage/MZ-7PC128N/AM-features


140F == 60C


Hitachi 400M (enterprise drives but to illustrate the point):

" Environmental (operating)
Ambient temperature 0 to 60ºC "
http://www.hgst.com/solid-state-drives/ultrastar-ssd400m

Toshiba MKx001GRZB ( enterprise drives, but to illustrate the the point):
".. Temp - Operating 0° to 55°C (32° to 131°F) ..."
http://storage.toshiba.com/storagesolutions/enterprise/mk4001grzb#

[ The new eMLC models at http://storage.toshiba.com/storagesolutions/enterprise have a similar 55C cap. ]

Intel's 910 SSD PCi-e card ... 55C.
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/solid-state-drives/solid-state-drives-910-series.html


There are several ( OWC's Mercury 6G , Intel's 520, and Crucial m4 ) that put a 70C cap on operating ambient temperature. But it rather curious that when data fidelity is at a premium, but the other parts of the machine are probably running hot, the temperature range goes down.


However, Toshiba pretty much invented Flash storage. Samsung is one of the largest makers out there. They aren't pushing over 60C. Those are likely also the SSD vendors you'll find inside of a iMac with an Apple label on them.

We'll see over the long term how well those +10C rated drives hold up over 3-5 year lifespans. IMHO, it is flawed to use SSDs as an excuse not to design adequate cooling into the iMac. For example, the ODD space could be used for both a SSD and more ventilation to achieve both. There is no good reason to push the SSD component right up to the border of its operating environment as a common operating context.

 

[Johnf1285]

I agree completely. the iMac should have sufficient cooling for every component under full load. SSD or HDD

 

[mojothemonkey]

"Screen lamination" does not mean retina.

They have not been secret about going with a new anti-glare technology. It's unclear if this means matte, like in the old (and glorious) days when a night light didnt reflect out half your screen. Even if it's not matte, lamination on glass reduces glare significantly. As far as I know, Apple would be among the first to do an IPS display, laminated directly to the surface element, at the 27" size. [[edit: it's not Apple doing it, but one of their OEM builders, probably LG, but you never know]]

So... don't read into "lamination issues" any more than is warranted.


As far as redesign, the hardware specs (more standard cpu, ram, gpu, SSD standard for your $; USB standard; a couple of TB ports) are all pretty much a given. The 680M GPU is what I and many others are really after. The optical drive is take-it-or-leave-it. Personally, I wouldnt mind it, but its not a dealbreaker if its gone. A simple USB external CD-DVD burner can be bought for $15 and takes up almost no room in a drawer for the 99.9% of the time you're not using it.

Since I plan on mounting this bad boy to a reticulating or cantilever arm (wall mount to pull forward and to the side for use), I'll be happy with any weight reduction. In theory, the drop in nm processes for the cpu and going full ssd means less heat generated overall and SHOULD allow for less weight in heatsinks and maybe other parts. (quality heat sinks are usually copper and among the heaviest pieces in a computer)

I wouldnt mind retina, since that would mean they'd knock the price down for the non-retina displays and let the savvy among us get the discount and let the marketing-hypnotised drones take the hit to the wallet for the tech they could only appreciate (at actual viewing distance) if they sat with their nose on the screen.

And as far as looks go, lets face it - it doesn't look bad as is. It's practically all screen and tries to stay out of the way of the display. It might be more of an evolution, just slimming up the profile all around as they get more efficient with the design process and exploit the cooler hardware.

 

[Johnf1285]

No retina that's for sure. Maybe late 2013 if we are lucky, more like 2014 IMO.

 

[segovius]

Personally don't believe there'll be retina and not that bothered - what I do want (need) is some form of glare reduction either by the new lamination process or a matte option.

If this happens though does anyone think the same process would be applied at the same time to the Cinema Display?

 

[Johnf1285]

Personally don't believe there'll be retina and not that bothered - what I do want (need) is some form of glare reduction either by the new lamination process or a matte option.

If this happens though does anyone think the same process would be applied at the same time to the Cinema Display?

I bet it will. Depending upon the redesign, it would be nice if Apple released two sized Thunderbolt Displays that were the same height and screen size of each iMac model. It would be nice to pair up an identical monitor to the iMac.

 

[Heyref]

Much as I hope for an announcement about a new iMac next week, I doubt we will hear it. With all of the rumors and leaked parts photos for the iPhone and iPad, the only thing we have heard about the iMac is that there are "issues" with the (presumably) laminated display. There have been no leaked photos of screen bezels, case backs, or any other part. If they were planning a September or even October release, you would think they would be in production now.