No new displays?

[MBX]

it seems?

what a bummer. if you look at this page it features the cinema display at the bottom (http://www.apple.com/macpro/design.html) which suggests that there'll be no new cinema displays.

i guess it will be another MAC-, no not MAC, but iPhone/Tablet-World. No pro stuff

 

[GAS]

That doesn't suggest there won't be an update. It's just a link at the bottom of the page to the current displays.

 

[Beardy man]

No, can't see them upgrading the displays for a while now. It would irritate all the people who might order new MP's with display from today on the strength of the todays announcement.

Displays and MP's are a bit of two part set really. If the displays were going to be updated in the near future it would have been today.

Shame as I'll be buying a new MP soon and a 30" ACD, was hoping for an iSight and possibly LED backlight - or at least a price drop. Still, will wait another week just to see what happens ;-)

Might have to look at the new Dell stuff.

 

[dante@sisna.com]

I don't foresee new displays aimed at the professional print and digital digital design market for some time.

Apple already uses S-IPS panels in all its displays. These panels are superior to lower cost TN and PVA/MVA panels used in lessor grade displays.

As MacRumors User, TimeStamp, has articulated, there are higher gamut, brighter, and more contrasty S-IPS panels in production now but I believe Apple knows the core user of its displays is the graphic artist, photographer, print producer, and perhaps broadcaster.

These are not large markets any longer. Apple is content to rest on its technology "laurels" in this area. Which is sad.

I personally think Apple should fork their display line towards 1) Consumer and 2) Pro -- in the pro area I would like to see a Print Oriented display basically identical to what they offer now (cause they are excellent) and a web/broadcast display with a high gamut S-IPS panel.

I doubt this Pro Fork will happen. I do think you will see a consumer panel very soon to go along with Apple TV, etc.

The ACD 30" is a sharp, excellent display with great "out-of-the-box" SWOP color accuracy. And it is SWOP certified. If you are a print designer or photographer and ever fall victim to a client lawsuit against you regarding color, you at least have SWOP certification to use in court -- this is by no means a blanket insurance policy as SO MANY other skills are needed for accurate color reproduction, but it shows professional intent and many judges seem to be swayed by these labels.

I know, I went through this twice. Lost the first time and won the second.

Just my thoughts.

 

[ProMod]

Dante, you seem very informed about these displays after following several of your posts.

I currently have a MBP 17" from August 07. The display is great, but as my workload has increased I am looking at the 23" ACD for ergonomics and productivity. I am a designer, with my workload balance being about 80% print, 20% web.

I have been looking at the 23" for a while, but waiting until MWSF to see what happens. With today's announcement of the new Pro's with no new display, I feel we will not see an update, as you said earlier.

You have stated that the current 30" is great for print. How does the 23" stack up, assuming you have had experience with it as well? Should I go ahead and pull the trigger even if we don't see a new model/price drop at MWSF?

 

[dante@sisna.com]

Dante, you seem very informed about these displays after following several of your posts.

I currently have a MBP 17" from August 07. The display is great, but as my workload has increased I am looking at the 23" ACD for ergonomics and productivity. I am a designer, with my workload balance being about 80% print, 20% web.

I have been looking at the 23" for a while, but waiting until MWSF to see what happens. With today's announcement of the new Pro's with no new display, I feel we will not see an update, as you said earlier.

You have stated that the current 30" is great for print. How does the 23" stack up, assuming you have had experience with it as well? Should I go ahead and pull the trigger even if we don't see a new model/price drop at MWSF?

My brother is a professional newspaper and magazine photographer who displays his images in both print and web formats.

I am a print, web and broadcast producer.

Both my brother, other I know, and I, have the ACD 23".

It is regarded as more consistent than the ACD 30 in terms of color consistency across the screen width.

The gamut of the ACD 23" is turned for SWOP (Standard Web Offset Press) Print standards. This display is "Spot On" for this Gamut. It has a great combination of brightness, contrast, screen coating and gamut for print.

It is an S-IPS display with great sharpness.

It is not a wide gamut S-IPS panel like the Dell 24." However, unless you calibrate a wide gamut display down for print, the color of these wide gamut units is often unrealistic for print.

Anandtech has excellent articles on this topic: they have taken many wide gamut S-IPS displays with newer panels than the ACD 23 and have calibrated them for print use. By all means they do great, but often have higher gamut differences between adjacent colors (called Delta E) than a calibrated ACD does.

Bottom line: the ACD is an excellent monitor for the money if you can get if for a refurbished or education price of $799. At retail of nearly $900, it is expensive and lacks features such as HDCP (for DRM protected Blue Ray and HD content), multiple inputs, etc, but its image quality FOR PRINT is excellent.

I would buy one after MacWorld if you need it.

The size difference between a 23 and 24 is not really significant. A 24 has the same pixel density spread out over a slightly larger panel.

Thumbs up for the ACD!

Note: a lot of people disagree with me on this point and that's fine.

 

[timestamp]

The 24" Dell (2407WFP-HC) is not an IPS panel. It is a PVA:

Here is the panel:
24"WS Samsung S-PVA (LTM240CS01)
source: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/

In terms of color, the ACD would be a better option. I believe most of the additional gamut coverage is achieved through the newer backlighting.

And dante, I don't disagree with you in regards to the ACD. I still feel they are excellent displays and in fact am planning to go with a 30" ACD myself (still trying to decide among others).

I will be waiting til Macworld though, to see what happens.

 

[palmerized]

I don't think they need to update them. Maybe throw an iSight in to the top, similar to the iMac or laptop lines. They have the perfect sizes covered, they're decently priced (now) and are feature rich.

The other thing, they haven't updated the case/form factor of their pro line in years. The Mac Pro is still similar to the G5 case, and the new MacBook Pro's are the same as the G4's. I think they've perfected the design there's no need to change them. And since these are all pro machines, you change one you have to change them all -- no?

 

[ProMod]

Thanks for the quick and informative reply, Dante. I almost feel bad, because most of what you wrote is what I have read in many of your previous posts! Your needs and hardware are very similar to mine, so I wanted to get a personal response from you.

I understand the Delta E. I think it bests sums up why the ACDs are great for pro use and not so great for the average consumer. Technology seems to be getting more and more about 'smoke and mirrors', with all the 'features' of the other monitors falling in this category. Manufacturers seem to be pumping up brightness and contrast at the expense of true color. The same can be said for HDTV's, and many more technologies outside of the display realm.

I would actually prefer the 1900x1200 resolution on a 23" screen vs. a 24" because of the increased pixel density. After using this hi-res 17" display, pixel density (rather the lack thereof on other displays) has become something I am very sensitive to!

Based on everything I have researched, and largely on your recommendation, I will buy a 23" ACD after MW regardless of what happens.

 

[ClassicBean]

I don't think they need to update them. Maybe throw an iSight in to the top, similar to the iMac or laptop lines. They have the perfect sizes covered, they're decently priced (now) and are feature rich.

The other thing, they haven't updated the case/form factor of their pro line in years. The Mac Pro is still similar to the G5 case, and the new MacBook Pro's are the same as the G4's. I think they've perfected the design there's no need to change them. And since these are all pro machines, you change one you have to change them all -- no?

Well, if a new display will get you going on my website, I'm all for it.

 

[Beardy man]

I still feel they are excellent displays and in fact am planning to go with a 30" ACD myself (still trying to decide among others).

I will be waiting til Macworld though, to see what happens.

@Timestamp
I'm also looking at a 30" after MW but I must admit to concerns about green sparkles and magenta lines. Reading the Apple discussion pages they do seem to be a bit too common for my liking. I'm aware that most people posting to the discussions pages are people with problems rather than "Mine's fine" types but it's still a nagging doubt in my mind especially as Apple seem to be still in denial and, for me, it is a LOT of cash to lay down.

I'm hoping the new chipset plus the 8800 card might be a "cure". Anybody got any insight - there is NO iSight ;-) as to what the scale of the problem might be? I accept here won't be any new ADC's at MW but a price cut would be nice! - worth waiting just to see what happens next week as the MP's with 8800's are on a months wait anyway.

Cheers

 

[timestamp]

@Timestamp
I'm also looking at a 30" after MW but I must admit to concerns about green sparkles and magenta lines. Reading the Apple discussion pages they do seem to be a bit too common for my liking. I'm aware that most people posting to the discussions pages are people with problems rather than "Mine's fine" types but it's still a nagging doubt in my mind especially as Apple seem to be still in denial and, for me, it is a LOT of cash to lay down.

I'm hoping the new chipset plus the 8800 card might be a "cure". Anybody got any insight - there is NO iSight ;-) as to what the scale of the problem might be? I accept here won't be any new ADC's at MW but a price cut would be nice! - worth waiting just to see what happens next week as the MP's with 8800's are on a months wait anyway.

Cheers

Yeah, there are numerous issues with the Apple displays in my experience. You can get lucky though.

Look at it this way. When I got my 23" I had a bunch of problems. I went through 4+ monitors. I finally got a good one, but I lost a lot of time going through that. I called Apple up and they shaved some money off for my inconvenience.

So in my opinion, play the exchange game if you have issues and aren't happy. And if it goes too long, have them knock a chunk off when you are finally satisfied.