Orico or Yottamaster?

[skaertus]

I am searching for a DAS solution to replace my 14 TB external HDD. I currently have a dual setup with an M4 Mac mini and a Dell XPS desktop both sharing a 5K monitor and the same Logitech mouse and keyboard. The DAS will provide a lot of storage for all my needs.

I am trying to decide between these two options (please note that, as I live in Brazil, options here are very limited):

• Orico DS500-C3: It supports up to 5 HDDs (90 TB total). It is easy to insert the HDDs, with no need of screws (which is a big plus for me). However, it does not support RAID. It has a transfer speed of 5 Gb/s. It is cheaper.
• Yottamaster Y-Focus FS5C3: It supports up to 5 HDDs (90 TB total). The installation of HDDs require screwing. It supports RAID and has a transfer speed of 10 Gb/s. Also, it looks more robust and seems to have better cooling. But it is more expensive.

Which should I go with? Any experience with them? Will I notice the speed difference?

 

[PaulD-UK]

OK, firstly Yottamaster USB-C drives don't support hardware RAID, only using MacOS software RAID modes.
Only their USB-A USB 3.0 enclosures do hardware RAID.

Secondly, they both use JMicron chipsets, and these a known to have disconnection problems when connected to Macs.
However there is a workaround to improve stability, and that is to connect a Thunderbolt 3 dock to the Mac, and connect the USB enclosures to the dock.

If you are sharing the disks with Windows, then running ex-FAT or another Windows format is generally not a good idea if the drives are connected to the Mac permanently.
It's better to use HFS+ for drives connected to a Mac, and only use exFat when you need to transfer files to a Windows PC.

 

[woodbine]

“However there is a workaround to improve stability, and that is to connect a Thunderbolt 3 dock to the Mac, and connect the USB enclosures to the dock.“
That is so interesting, I have docks that have been problematic with my old Mac mini, but now my MPB M1 is hooked up to a thunderbolt hub, I’ve not noticed any disconnect issues.
I thought it was just chance!

 

[Fishrrman]

PaulD wrote:
"Secondly, they both use JMicron chipsets, and these a known to have disconnection problems when connected to Macs."

Paul, do you which controller chipsets are preferable for Mac usage?
On both thunderbolt and USB...?
(kind of like in the firewire days, folks were best off using enclosures with the Oxford 911...)

Thanks in advance...

 

[PaulD-UK]

Both Thunderbolt and USB host ports should be ‘Class Compliant’, with drivers built into the OS.

This applies to the host computer, the device enclosure controller and the internal components with firmware inside the enclosure.
So there are three layers of potential incompatibilities.

So it's difficult to be specific about what works with Apple silicon, and what doesn't.
All three layers might interact and cause drop-outs.

And the particular cable might also introduce incompatibilities, or not have all the wires connected...
Especially cheaper cables that don't have an ID chip in them that the computer can identify.
More expensive cables will identify their capabilities to the computer...

And, finally, if there is an adapter connected at either end, or an extension cable, that will prevent the ID chip being read...

Intel and Apple are the only Thunderbolt 3+ chipset manufacturers, with ASMedia joining them with USB4.x, which uses TB4/5 protocols.

It would seem that there is some fundamental incompatibility with Apple silicon’s adherence to best-in-class TB4/5 performance, and Apple’s USB 3.x Class compatibility, as implemented by the rest of the tech industry pre 2020…

If they could easily fix it they have had the time.
If fixing the problems with legacy USB hardware would compromise TB4/5 performance then…
It doesn’t get fixed…
That’s my guess.

With TB (and USB4+) the external device chip connects to the host computer using PCIe. Which Apple has taken care to implement faultlessly.

With a TB3 dock the USB host controller chip is moved from the computer to the dock.
So the dock takes over control of the dock’s USB 3.x ports, and in practice will be much more compatible with older USB enclosures etc.

BUT, TB4/5 hubs/docks work differently, and ‘tunnel’ USB 3.x signals from the Mac’s host controller to the dock’s USB 3.x ports.
So incompatibilities can still happen…

So only a TB3 dock works to remove USB 3.x problems.

There are no TB3 ‘hubs’ as TB1/2/3 only supports two TB (in/out) ports.
Only TB4/5 supports ‘hubs’, with 1 in/3 out ports (max).

There were two generations of TB3:

Alpine Ridge (JHL6540) supports one full speed TB3 (+ alt-mode DP1.2 video), and multiple USB 3.x channels, so allowing docks with more USB ports.
But the available bandwidth may not allow the full 10Gbps to any individual one of the ports.

Titan Ridge (JHL7440) was introduced in 2018, and supports one full speed TB3 (+ alt-mode DP1.4 x 2), and for USB 3.x allows the full 10 Gbps bandwidth, but with only one channel of bandwidth, with hubs to support multiple USB 3.x ports.

The best example of an Alpine Ridge dock is the Caldigit TS3+, which can share more USB 3.x bandwidth if you are not using high TB bandwidth. It can only support one monitor.

Most two monitor TB3 docks are Titan Ridge, and all the USB 3.x ports share 10 Gbps, even if the TB3 downstream port has a NVMe SSD working flat out.

USB 2 has its own wires in USB-C connections, so is separate in all cases.

The original post was about RAID, and this has only limited ’class compliance’.
If bespoke drivers are needed you MUST have manufacturer’s support.

Edited to add info.