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OS X Disaster

B

bigboy99

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Nov 12, 2005
407
0
Sarasota, FL
Something very strange has happened to my G4 Powerbook. The entire contents of the Utilities App folder disappeared and was moved to a folder in Applications named {?{. I copied the apps all back to the Utilities Folder. Now Finder will no longer quit, so a hard shut down is necessary. Disk Warrior will not load, stopping in Step 5 with a reading of data. I recently upgraded to 10.4.9.

I've repaired permissions & verified the HD with the install disk. Still no love.

What to do?
 
Fun kee. This is so reminiscent of my XP experiences. At least I made it 18 months without the reinstall movie. If I could only get DW to load I'd have a fighting chance, but no such luck. I can't even reinstall 10.4.8 as the installer tells me the disk is not eligible or some such message.
 
If you haven't tried this already, restart on the DiskWarrior CD, instead of trying to run it from your HD. What version do you own?
 
Nermal said:
If DiskWarrior is falling over then it's likely that an archive install won't help.

Are you running DW from the CD or from inside OS X? Try it from CD if you haven't already.
Click to expand...

A & I won't work? Please explain. I've been running DW from the CD.
 
Back up your data.


bigboy99 said:
A & I won't work? Please explain. I've been running DW from the CD.
Click to expand...


An Archive & Install simply replaces your system folder with a new one. By the sounds of things, your problem lies at a hardware level. On that note, it's not verifying the disk permissions we're interested in so much as verifying the disk, but it sounds like you've done both already.

Could it be possible your Disk Warrior disc is scratched? Is there an external drive you could try booting from? Have you got any third party RAM?
 
mad jew said:
Back up your data.

An Archive & Install simply replaces your system folder with a new one. By the sounds of things, your problem lies at a hardware level. On that note, it's not verifying the disk permissions we're interested in so much as verifying the disk, but it sounds like you've done both already.

Could it be possible your Disk Warrior disc is scratched? Is there an external drive you could try booting from? Have you got any third party RAM?
Click to expand...

Data is backed up. The disk has also been verified as problem free. It definitely looks like corrupted files, so why wouldn't an A & I work? Everthing else is working fine except that finder will not automatically shut down. I have to use force quit.

Is there a way to go back to 10.4.8? I tried to use the combo install pack but it wouldn't work.
 
bigboy99 said:
Been running it from the CD. Version 3. something.
Click to expand...

Two thoughts. First, check with the Alsoft site to make sure you've got the latest version. Seems like they're forever tweaking this application. Second, if you're having problems running DiskWarrior off a CD, then the idea that something is wrong with OSX on your HD is pretty much a non-starter. BTW, the other good way run DiskWarrior is on another Mac with the HD of Mac you're trying to troubleshoot mounted in Firewire Target Disk Mode. Try this if you have access to another Mac.
 
bigboy99 said:
...so why wouldn't an A & I work?
Click to expand...


The fact DiskWarrior isn't working implies either there's a hardware fault or the DiskWarrior disc is scratched/broken. An Archive & Install or downgrading to 10.4.8 will not help the situation and in some cases could make it worse if it puts extra strain on the failing component (whichever bit that may be). I agree that Target Disk Mode is an excellent spot to start troubleshooting your Mac from. If you don't have a Firewire cable, then try running DiskWarrior on another Mac to see if it's a problem with the actual disc. Good luck. :)
 
I tried the repair/rebuild feature in Drive Genius, and the OS is back to "normal" operation. Disk Warrior still will not run, although it installed fine and works okay on my external drive.

A & I seems to require considerable post process tweaking. I'm not clear whether or not my applications will still be there (including plists/library registrations, etc.) or if I need to reinstall them again (ala XP).

I'm hoping to limp along until X 10.5, but just in case...
 
An Archive & Install will give you the option to keep all your preferences, settings, apps and files. However, I really don't think it'll help. Whatever option you choose, back everything up with the pessimistic assumption your computer could lose all its data.
 
After defraging/rebuilding/repairing/etc. the OS seemed stable. Then, this AM the wireless networking frooze, I rebooted (twice), but everything came back very wrong. The dock had moved, most app icons were missing, most of my mail was gone, a real mess. I'm trying to restore from Backup, but don't have a clue what's gone wrong.

I don't think the issue is hardware related. Should I keep fiddling around or bite the bullet? A & I or clean install?

Ouch!
 
I believe you've been advised by several experience people now that you've very likely got a hardware problem. I know that can be difficult to accept, but that's the bullet you really should be biting now.
 
I don't care which bullet I bite, as long as it's the correct one.

The experts are sitting at their screens guessing (which I know is what I asked for), but both Disk Utility and Drive Genius agree that there are no HD problems.

I am unable to diagnose a hard drive problem, so what other hardware should I consider?
 
Just a quick note: if it were a drive problem and you did a reinstall (archive or otherwise), that could place enough strain on the failing drive to tip it over the edge and possibly make it worse. Of course, this doesn't matter so much if everything's backed up but it's still not desirable.

Have you tried swapping out the RAM yet?
 
IJ Reilly said:
RAM and motherboard, in that order. A bad Airport or bluetooth card are also possibilities.
Click to expand...

Can you recommend a diagnostic utility to check the RAM? I use airport, and a wireless Mighty Mouse, but have no idea how to check these devices. There doesn't seem to be any obvious issues with either one, though.
 
mad jew said:
Just a quick note: if it were a drive problem and you did a reinstall (archive or otherwise), that could place enough strain on the failing drive to tip it over the edge and possibly make it worse. Of course, this doesn't matter so much if everything's backed up but it's still not desirable.

Have you tried swapping out the RAM yet?
Click to expand...

Do you mean just reverse the 1G chips?
 
I was able to restore all information from Backup. Everything seemed normal again. I did a repair (there were a few errors), a rebuild and a permissions fix. I left for a few hours, and when I returned the "do a reboot" (in several languages) message box was present. After rebooting the message telling me that there had been an "OSX failure" appeared. I reported it to Apple, and all seems to be okay for now.

Other than this almost Windows-like behavior this Power Book has been pure enjoyment. I do appreciate the input from around the world in trying to suss out this problem.
 
How is your RAM set up? If possible, take a chip out at a time to see if the problems keep happening. You have a dodgy piece of hardware in there somewhere, and RAM is the easiest to check. There are apps out there that'll check RAM for you, but they're pretty pathetic and often overlook failing RAM, so taking a single chip out at a time is a better method. :)
 
RAM is two 1GB chips. The physical aspect of this is fairly simple, but as the symtoms are usually rare (although major) and random. I could be at this for a long time limping along on 50% of my memory.

The single issue that seems to be at the source is using Sleep with Airport. This has been a recurring source of having to hard reboot. I had two apps that might have been conflicting, Cocktail and Energy Saver. I deleted Cocktail and thought I'd see what happened, but am almost afraid to try and duplicate the situation in case I can't get back to square one again.

I've used Carbon Copy Cloner to save the current state of affairs, and might try Super Duper! as another backup choice, as well. Apple Backup worked well today, too. Do you have a personal preference?
 
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