Power of AI producing code

[maflynn]

This is crazy.

In 15 minutes Dave Plummer had an AI create a basic interpreter that compiled and ran on macos and a pdp11.

And you wonder why Microsoft has laid off developers and are using AI instead.

 

[Abazigal]

On Mastodon, I am also hearing of complaints of AI producing code that is generally of low quality, and a lot of time then needs to be spent to clean it up. Or how an app had to be taken down from the App Store because the developer created it using AI, but as a result, lack the technical expertise to troubleshoot subsequent bugs that arose.

I fear it's a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul. You save time in one area, only to have to pay back somewhere else. At the end of the day, the organisation isn't necessarily better off overall.

 

[JSRinUK]

I did an AI comparison “coding test” a little while ago - using mostly free models, but also some local models. My takeaway is that things are improving fast. When I next embark on a coding project, I’ll sign up to Claude Opus first (unless something comes along that beats it).

 

[bogdanw]

Ars Technica - "We asked four AI coding agents to rebuild Minesweeper—the results were explosive"
https://arstechnica.com/ai/2025/12/the-ars-technica-ai-coding-agent-test-minesweeper-edition/

 

[maflynn]

On Mastodon, I am also hearing of complaints of AI producing code that is generally of low quality, and a lot of time then needs to be spent to clean it up.

I think you're missing the point a bit.

Consider the video, if Dave Plummer set out to write his own basic interpreter from scratch, how long would that take - I don't think he stated that. It would probably orders of magnitude longer.

At this point you can basically ask AI to code for anything, and in a large part that's why MS laid off so many developers. I agree with your assessment on quality however, the code quality is inferior to a senior developer doing this for 20 years. Yet consider how quickly we've gotten to this point, just a couple of years.

I use AI to write various powershell scripts, its a lot quicker for me to do that, and then tweak/fix them as needed.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I'd be way less sour on AI if it were being constrained to things it's actually great at.

The forced rollout everywhere, on ordinary people, with zero concern for where it's a good fit and any concern at all about accuracy or negative externalities is REALLY off putting.

Things like MS Copilot being jammed into LG TVs (last weeks news) with no way to remove it.

No thank you.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Sort of ironic this just popped up

 

[JSRinUK]

I'd be way less sour on AI if it were being constrained to things it's actually great at.

The forced rollout everywhere, on ordinary people, with zero concern for where it's a good fit and any concern at all about accuracy or negative externalities is REALLY off putting.

Things like MS Copilot being jammed into LG TVs (last weeks news) with no way to remove it.

No thank you.

It’s difficult not to feel that these companies are becoming desperate to justify their AI.

I got an email recently from Microsoft saying that 365 Family was going up in price by about 30% (£105) - just a fortnight before I’m due to renew. Yeah, I’m slow, I don’t really use it much these days but two weeks isn’t enough to move everyone away so I was reluctantly ready to pay the increase for one more year.

Today I get an email from them saying I can “upgrade” to 365 Premium for 50% off the first year (£89) - bringing it closer in line with what I’d expected to pay.

The primary difference between “Family” and “Premium” is, I think, “more copilot AI”.

So they bump up the price, then lure you to the “more AI” offering, which you’re going to go for, then claim that everyone wants AI. No, we just don’t want 30% increase in price!

It’s insidious.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I think you're missing the point a bit.

Consider the video, if Dave Plummer set out to write his own basic interpreter from scratch, how long would that take - I don't think he stated that. It would probably orders of magnitude longer.

At this point you can basically ask AI to code for anything, and in a large part that's why MS laid off so many developers. I agree with your assessment on quality however, the code quality is inferior to a senior developer doing this for 20 years. Yet consider how quickly we've gotten to this point, just a couple of years.

I use AI to write various powershell scripts, its a lot quicker for me to do that, and then tweak/fix them as needed.

The problem is the layers around the core project. If you have AI kludge something together, but know in depth what it is doing and why, then you are able to fix it. (This is me with Python and SQL.)

Now, let's take "vibe coding" a game or app or even a basic interpreter. Now where is the supporting documentation of each function? Where is the ability to optimize or troubleshoot any issues? Where is true outside the box thinking? Like why remake an existing interpreter? There is a severe lack of anything new from the world of AI, as it literally just looks at existing data and regurgitates.

All of this is to say that we are headed toward a dark time for the next couple of years where those in charge try to replace EVERYTHING with AI, instead of just using it to hire like 20% or 30% less employees vertically. We have already seen a severe degradation in quality across all corporations. And no one is left who knows how to fix anything.

Oh and none of this is sustainable. Every picture created or code generated prompt answer requires outsized resources. Like 100x resources. All of which means your $20 a month AI subscription needs to honestly be $300 a month or more to make even a small profit. See more here:

(From Adam Conover)

Eventually, when the AI bubble pops, then AI will end up being used as it should--as an assistant to a human only, and very little job loss will actually occur.

 

[Abazigal]

I think you're missing the point a bit.

Consider the video, if Dave Plummer set out to write his own basic interpreter from scratch, how long would that take - I don't think he stated that. It would probably orders of magnitude longer.

At this point you can basically ask AI to code for anything, and in a large part that's why MS laid off so many developers. I agree with your assessment on quality however, the code quality is inferior to a senior developer doing this for 20 years. Yet consider how quickly we've gotten to this point, just a couple of years.

I use AI to write various powershell scripts, its a lot quicker for me to do that, and then tweak/fix them as needed.

The issue isn’t your average Tom, Dick or Harry being able to generate a working version of minesweeper at the press of a button. The problem is what that means for the future of employment.

Junior coders and software developers are where we get the senior developers from. They need to start somewhere in order to pick up the requisite experience and skills.

If Microsoft (and every other software compare) lays off their junior staff, or raises the bar for hiring them, rationalising that their job can be done using AI, who then is going to be around in the near future to assume these more complex roles once the older generation starts retiring? Or are we expecting AI to improve to the point where it can replace them too?

It’s also still early days, and it’s possible that we are simply not seeing the long term repercussions at Microsoft yet. The problems at Twitter didn’t pop up overnight when Elon Musk took over either.

 

[maflynn]

Junior coders and software developers are where we get the senior developers from. They need to start somewhere in order to pick up the requisite experience and skills.

In all honesty, I really don't see programming as a career option in 2025 (and beyond). I was a programmer for much of my career, and I get what you're saying but and its a big but. Businesses see that with one LLM they can replace the majority of the development staff. Any kids graduating college with a CS degree has to be very nervous in this day and age.

I've been a programmer on the business side, and that has all but dried up, partly due to the shift to enterprise applications that you don't customize, over home built applications and now AI replacing what little development occurs in house.

As I said, MS has already laid off thousands of developers and yet the development work continues, while I'm sure existing employee's workloads increased (as is typical after layoffs), I'm fairly certain much of the work is now being done by AI over at Redmond.

 

[Abazigal]

As I said, MS has already laid off thousands of developers and yet the development work continues, while I'm sure existing employee's workloads increased (as is typical after layoffs), I'm fairly certain much of the work is now being done by AI over at Redmond.

This does sound deeply concerning. What then do you think is the future of software development? Like surely companies still need to hire experienced personnel to vet the code that is being written (even if it's generated by AI), right? Question then is - where is tmr's experienced software developer supposed to start out as? Unpaid interns? Just quietly hone their skills on the side in the hopes that an opening becomes available later?

That's why I am concerned that all this immediate laying off of employees is just another short-sighted attempt to boost the stock price today, at the expense of the long-term sustainability of your company.

 

[maflynn]

What then do you think is the future of software development?

There really isn't any future imo. There's no way to justify spending 100,000 to 200,000 dollars on a college education for a job that is largely disappearing.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I disagree completely and still program right now as a career. Microsoft is a perfect example as to why it won’t work.