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Retina Thunderbolt displays

SDAVE

SDAVE

macrumors 68040
Original poster
Jun 16, 2007
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Let's get a countdown as to when Apple will release a 4k monitor and what you would like to see in there.

I would like to see:

1. 24" + 30" (to keep it a simple line up). 16:10 Aspect ratio
2. 2 Thunderbolt ports (either could be used for daisy changing)
3. 6 USB 3.0 Ports
4. 1 FW800 Port
5. Headphone out w/ optical
6. Line in/Mic in w/ optical
7. Charging cable for portable Macs (which we already have)
8. Glossy/Antiglare options (Apple needs the latter as soon as possible)
9. This one will definitely not happen, but it would be so great to have the laptop receive power via the TB port, so it's just one cable.

A retina external display is inevitable.

P.S. I hate the word retina.
 
jcpb said:
Why stop at 4K? 8K would be equal parts insane and awesome.
Click to expand...

8k is too far down the line. Manufacturers are closer to 4k and the new rMBP is a good idea as to where Apple is headed as far as Macs go. ML will be fully ready for HiDPI.
 
SDAVE said:
Let's get a countdown as to when Apple will release a 4k monitor and what you would like to see in there.

I would like to see:

1. 24" + 30" (to keep it a simple line up). 16:10 Aspect ratio
2. 2 Thunderbolt ports (either could be used for daisy changing)
3. 6 USB 3.0 Ports
4. 1 FW800 Port
5. Headphone out w/ optical
6. Line in/Mic in w/ optical
7. Charging cable for portable Macs (which we already have)
8. Glossy/Antiglare options (Apple needs the latter as soon as possible)
9. This one will definitely not happen, but it would be so great to have the laptop receive power via the TB port, so it's just one cable.

A retina external display is inevitable.

P.S. I hate the word retina.
Click to expand...

I personally think FireWire will be dead by the time they decide to release a Retina Thunderbolt display.

Plus I don't see Apple going so far as to charge 4k, or even 8k, for anything they make. Anything like a monitor is not worth more than 2k at most. I think it would be a terrible business move for them to do such a thing as their competitors will have the best of them. At least that's the way I see it.
 
Destroysall said:
I personally think FireWire will be dead by the time they decide to release a Retina Thunderbolt display.

Plus I don't see Apple going so far as to charge 4k, or even 8k, for anything they make. Anything like a monitor is not worth more than 2k at most. I think it would be a terrible business move for them to do such a thing as their competitors will have the best of them. At least that's the way I see it.
Click to expand...

4k/8k is a resolution

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4K_resolution

The rMBP is above 2k (Film, which is above HD 1080p video).
 
1. 24" + 30" (to keep it a simple line up). 16:10 Aspect ratio - Would be nice, especially the 16:10 ratio
2. 2 Thunderbolt ports (either could be used for daisy changing) -I can't see how this is technically possible with Thunderbolt since there is only cable 1 going in. I am not 100% sure, but I don't think you will ever see this.
3. 6 USB 3.0 Ports - You will never get that many, but 2-4 would be great
8. Glossy/Antiglare options (Apple needs the latter as soon as possible) - Anti-glare would be nice. It's the one thing I hate about my 24" ACD, especially having to look at my pretty face in the shiny black bezel.
9. This one will definitely not happen, but it would be so great to have the laptop receive power via the TB port, so it's just one cable. - not technically possible at this point in time; maybe in the future.
 
SDAVE said:
Let's get a countdown as to when Apple will release a 4k monitor and what you would like to see in there.

I would like to see:

1. 24" + 30" (to keep it a simple line up). 16:10 Aspect ratio
2. 2 Thunderbolt ports (either could be used for daisy changing)
3. 6 USB 3.0 Ports
4. 1 FW800 Port
5. Headphone out w/ optical
6. Line in/Mic in w/ optical
7. Charging cable for portable Macs (which we already have)
8. Glossy/Antiglare options (Apple needs the latter as soon as possible)
9. This one will definitely not happen, but it would be so great to have the laptop receive power via the TB port, so it's just one cable.

A retina external display is inevitable.

P.S. I hate the word retina.
Click to expand...

I'd love just to have a thunderbolt 2560x1600 res screen. And as much as 30" would be a beautiful monster of a display, I think 27" is the sweet-spot as one does not need to physically move their head in order to view everything on the screen. And as much as I'd love to have an anti-glare option, I just don't see it fitting in with the apple aesthetic and therefore will never be built =(

I don't care who builds it, just build it! (Although I'd LOVE a Wacom screen like this =p)
 
I'm sure the new TBD will utilize the same "less" glossy screen that the rMBP uses so I'm guessing there will be no choice for a Glossy/Antiglare option.

FireWire is dying so I don't see that technology being used in any products going forward that are being redesigned. If a user still needs Firewire there is a USB to firewire adapter.
 
edk99 said:
I'm sure the new TBD will utilize the same "less" glossy screen that the rMBP uses so I'm guessing there will be no choice for a Glossy/Antiglare option.

FireWire is dying so I don't see that technology being used in any products going forward that are being redesigned. If a user still needs Firewire there is a USB to firewire adapter.
Click to expand...

I totaly agree. There are two ways to look at the thunderbolt to firewire dongle apple is planning on releasing. You could look at it as a "phasing out" of sorts, or you could look at it as a "macbook air is too small so here's a firewire solution." If the latter is the case, and Apple refreshes the thunderbolt display this year, I'd say it'll sport a firewire port. If they don't refresh it this year but instead refresh it next year, then I'd be willing to be that the firewire port will be conveniently missing.
 
Also the option to have an external GPU so when you connect your laptop via TB to the display it will use the external GPU to power the monitor.
 
maybe i am wrong but wouldnt a real 27 inch retina be extremely expensive to make right now. to expensive to be practical for mass consumption anyway.

I wanna see it like everyone else. I just dont think apple could pull it off costwise.
 
Yes, it would be very prohibitively expensive today. Also the TB 1.0 spec does not have the bandwidth to rival modern PCI Express video cards. I do not know how future TB versions compare with future PCI though. I too would like to see both of these things.
 
Lance-AR said:
Yes, it would be very prohibitively expensive today. Also the TB 1.0 spec does not have the bandwidth to rival modern PCI Express video cards. I do not know how future TB versions compare with future PCI though. I too would like to see both of these things.
Click to expand...

On that note, a single channel of Thunderbolt doesn't have enough bandwidth to drive a 4K display, and if Apple used both channels... Well, that would just be a regular Cinema Display since there would be nothing left for TB devices anywhere else on the chain ;)

I'd expect to see a Retina TB Display around 2014, since Intel's hinted that the first speed boost for TB will come along at that time.
 
How is the bandwidth usage of the 4k display calculated. I'm convinced a Pegasus Promise R6 is starved for bandwidth after chained behind two TBDs but haven't seen the math to prove it.
 
Yes to everything you wrote. But I would like to add a built in super-drive. Though I don't think that will ever happen, it would be nice. It would be just like an iMac, just without the computer.
 
Lance-AR said:
How is the bandwidth usage of the 4k display calculated. I'm convinced a Pegasus Promise R6 is starved for bandwidth after chained behind two TBDs but haven't seen the math to prove it.
Click to expand...

Thunderbolt's not that efficient.

For starters, PCIe and DisplayPort data cannot share a channel, so if you have both types of devices plugged in, then 1 channel is used exclusively by PCIe data and the other channel carries only DisplayPort data. So if you had a TBD and 3 R6's, the TBD would have a channel all to itself while the 3 R6's would be forced to share the other channel.

On top of that, a single PCIe device can only use 1 channel (a DisplayPort device can use both, as long as there are no PCIe devices on the chain) - so if all you have is an R6 connected directly to your Mac, it'll consume all of the bandwidth on one channel, but the other channel will go completely unused.

As for the bandwidth usage of a 4K display, it depends on a number of factors, but if we go with QFHD (3840x2160) and typical monitor specs, then the bandwidth needed is 3840 x 2160 x 60 (Hz, your refresh rate) x 32 (bit color) with 8b/10b encoding = ~15 Gbps, which is more than the 10 Gbps a single channel of Thunderbolt can provide.
 
Two things I'd like to see are...

- SuperDrive built in, why not? I still use mine from time to time.
- Option with a built in GPU. Imagin coming home from the office with your MacBook Air and having a Nvidia 680m waiting on you! I really wouldn't be surprised to see this soon.

I don't see the point in making a stationary display super thin. Make it as thick as an iMac and give us more power and the legacy technology, for now.
 
Faize said:
Thunderbolt's not that efficient.

For starters, PCIe and DisplayPort data cannot share a channel, so if you have both types of devices plugged in, then 1 channel is used exclusively by PCIe data and the other channel carries only DisplayPort data. So if you had a TBD and 3 R6's, the TBD would have a channel all to itself while the 3 R6's would be forced to share the other channel.

On top of that, a single PCIe device can only use 1 channel (a DisplayPort device can use both, as long as there are no PCIe devices on the chain) - so if all you have is an R6 connected directly to your Mac, it'll consume all of the bandwidth on one channel, but the other channel will go completely unused.

As for the bandwidth usage of a 4K display, it depends on a number of factors, but if we go with QFHD (3840x2160) and typical monitor specs, then the bandwidth needed is 3840 x 2160 x 60 (Hz, your refresh rate) x 32 (bit color) with 8b/10b encoding = ~15 Gbps, which is more than the 10 Gbps a single channel of Thunderbolt can provide.
Click to expand...

That's the best I've ever seen anyone explain it (far better than my explanations). I think it's a dumb design. So far Apple has never provided 10b drivers. The Quadro 4800 running Leopard was the only option that ever worked.
 
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