Security expert says Microsoft should cut IE's links to Windows

[Keniff]

Have you ever used it (years ago, right)?
I know I have, before Safari/Firefox were released and oh man, I HATED it!
I always felt I had a buggy piece of s**t (that was made for another buggy piece of s**t) on my Mac!
But back then, there weren't many choices for Browsers.

Anyways, this news piece (below) caught my eye and it reminded me of my reasons to never want to use Windows.

*feeling smug*

http://www.computerworld.com/Windows_is_s**t

 

[Sesshi]

That piece of op-ed from ApplefanboyWorld* as it is now fails to take into account all sorts of issues, such as what browser you do ship with Windows (Safari? Hell no. Firefox? Opera will have a fit. Opera? Hell no.).



*+ comedy Linux curmudgeon

 

[Queso]

Don't ship any with it. Instead ask the user what they want at installation, then either download it automatically as part of the setup, or stick a shortcut icon to the download on the desktop that they click on later once the computer has an Internet connection. If the computer has Internet during installation the menu list is updated before being displayed, otherwise they get a choice of either three or four.

 

[és:]

Don't ship any with it. Instead ask the user what they want at installation, then either download it automatically as part of the setup, or stick a shortcut icon to the download on the desktop that they click on later once the computer has an Internet connection. If the computer has Internet during installation the menu list is updated before being displayed, otherwise they get a choice of either three or four.

I think that's a good shout.

 

[Zombie Acorn]

How about we let Microsoft ship with whatever browser they want? Its not like they rip your face off after you switch to firefox. I can't remember the last time Ive used safari or internet explorer except to get to the mozilla site and quickly switch it out.

 

[és:]

How about we let Microsoft ship with whatever browser they want?.

It's a security suggestion.

 

[Darth.Titan]

The article does not recommend removing IE from a standard Windows install at all. It just recommends Windows making it a standalone browser that is not tied into the Windows update process, and updating the browser independently and more frequently for security patches.

I believe the article makes an interesting point, but it would probably require a major redesign effort on MIcrosoft's part.

 

[jzuena]

Don't ship any with it. Instead ask the user what they want at installation, then either download it automatically as part of the setup, or stick a shortcut icon to the download on the desktop that they click on later once the computer has an Internet connection. If the computer has Internet during installation the menu list is updated before being displayed, otherwise they get a choice of either three or four.

And Macs would do the same, right? No Safari preloaded and you choose one of 3 or 4 on first startup? In the vein of "we eat our own dog food", if its good for Microsoft to have to give browser choice it must be good for Apple to have to give it as well. The only Linux distribution I've installed recently was Ubuntu and if I remember correctly it did offer the choice of Firefox or Konqueror.

"But IE sucks and Safari is great" won't cut it, since I'm sure you could find a bunch of Windows fans that would say the opposite.

 

[Darth.Titan]

While this argument is entertaining, it is still completely missing the point of the article.

 

[Queso]

And Macs would do the same, right? No Safari preloaded and you choose one of 3 or 4 on first startup? In the vein of "we eat our own dog food", if its good for Microsoft to have to give browser choice it must be good for Apple to have to give it as well.

I 100% agree. If Microsoft do this so should Apple. 3 or 4 would be cutting it on OSX though. Are there actually that many browsers on Macs?

 

[Zombie Acorn]

While this argument is entertaining, it is still completely missing the point of the article.

Regardless of the point of the article, security concerns or not, its Microsoft's product and they shouldn't be forced to do anything they would rather not. If I want to cut holes in my shoes and offer an inferior product to consumers I should be allowed to.

 

[atszyman]

The article does not recommend removing IE from a standard Windows install at all. It just recommends Windows making it a standalone browser that is not tied into the Windows update process, and updating the browser independently and more frequently for security patches.

I believe the article makes an interesting point, but it would probably require a major redesign effort on MIcrosoft's part.

Does this make me a security expert? I've stated numerous times since, somewhere around 1998 or so that IE needed to be a standalone app, and Office needed to get rid of it's close ties to Windows as well. They should be treated as third party apps and have no deeper ties to the OS than any other third party application.

 

[Sesshi]

Don't ship any with it. Instead ask the user what they want at installation, then either download it automatically as part of the setup, or stick a shortcut icon to the download on the desktop that they click on later once the computer has an Internet connection. If the computer has Internet during installation the menu list is updated before being displayed, otherwise they get a choice of either three or four.

Fine for you and me maybe, but what about the typical 'I click on the big e' buyer?

 

[Queso]

Fine for you and me maybe, but what about the typical 'I click on the big e' buyer?

The menu idea will work best if the program icon is displayed with the name. If they want a big blue e to be installed they choose a big blue e off the menu. If they want more than one they can install more than one. There can even be an option to install all displayed for those feeling adventurous. As long as they use the program icons so people know which represents the browser they normally use it's quite workable.

 

[atszyman]

The menu idea will work best if the program icon is displayed with the name. If they want a big blue e to be installed they choose a big blue e off the menu. If they want more than one they can install more than one. There can even be an option to install all displayed for those feeling adventurous. As long as they use the program icons so people know which represents the browser they normally use it's quite workable.

The article isn't talking about not installing IE. They'll still be able to do that, but right now IE is so closely tied to the OS, that any vulnerability in IE can become a system wide security issue. If IE were it's own stand alone application independent of Windows, it wouldn't have as much access to the OS, and it could be patched on it's own as security flaws are discovered.

 

[Queso]

The article isn't talking about not installing IE. They'll still be able to do that, but right now IE is so closely tied to the OS, that any vulnerability in IE can become a system wide security issue. If IE were it's own stand alone application independent of Windows, it wouldn't have as much access to the OS, and it could be patched on it's own as security flaws are discovered.

That's already becoming less of a problem as versions go on though. Windows does need better sandboxing definitely, but there have been huge improvements since the IE6 SP1 days when security was non-existent.

The best way to secure computers completely is to diversify the components used for generic communication. As people mix and match the attack surface lowers as a result.

 

[atszyman]

That's already becoming less of a problem as versions go on though. Windows does need better sandboxing definitely, but there have been huge improvements since the IE6 SP1 days when security was non-existent.

The best way to secure computers completely is to diversify the components used for generic communication. As people mix and match the attack surface lowers as a result.

I would agree, but I almost think a browser has to be installed by default. Too many people who have no clue, still on dial up or other slow connections, who just want to plug it in, put in the information and be able to browse the internet ASAP. Of course it would probably only benefit Mac sales since now, "Windows boxes don't even come with a browser installed!"

 

[mithrilfox]

Please tell me this isn't some new discovery for experts?

Gosh, I knew this since the first time I saw ANY connection between IE and the Windows OS... what a HORRIBLE idea.

Who is the rocks-for-brains idiot who thought this garbage up at Microsoft? He shouldn't be fired, he should be publicly egged.