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Series 4 Wi-Fi annoyance - private address

J

Jim Lahey

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Apr 8, 2014
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Hi. Hoping someone can help me with this. My series 4 watch keeps reverting to private wi-fi address. I have explicitly set it to not use a private address because I need it to have a fixed MAC, but it has a mind of its own and thinks it knows better what I want. This is extremely irritating and is causing problems on my network.

For various reasons I have my Wi-Fi radios spilt into two separate 2.4Ghz and 5.0Ghz bands. The phone uses the 5.0Ghz and the watch uses the 2.4Ghz, but the phone 'knows about' the 2.4Ghz network and the watch has no problem connecting to it. All I want is for the watch to not keep changing the MAC address just because the wind changed direction.

What am I missing? Or is this just yet another Apple bug?
 
The simplest solution would be to set up your wi-fi networks to recognize the watch's private MAC addresses. There will be two addresses, one for each network (2.4 GHz and 5 GHz) and each will be fixed to that network. The watch will generate a different private address for each network it encounters, so it must be seeing your split network as two distinct networks.
 
Hello and thanks for your reply. I'm not really sure I understand what you mean, though. The watch is seemingly making up a new MAC address randomly whenever it feels like it. It reverts to using a private address even though I've set it not to (the toggle goes green again of its own accord). The watch is not aware of the 5.0Ghz network at all, as it's unable to even connect to 5.0Ghz, so that shouldn't be a factor.

I suppose I will try having the iPhone also connected to the 2.4Ghz and see if that stabilises things. I don't really need the higher speed 5.0Ghz on that device anyway. Honestly it feels like yet another bug, but that's Apple all over these days :(
 
I forgot that the series 4 does not have 5GHz. I believe the watch makes up a new MAC address for each new network it sees. But then, it should retain that address for that same network when it sees it again. So, you can turn off Private Address for one network, but when a new network comes along, it is turned back on by default for that network. Is there still a problem if you just leave Private Address enabled?
 
If I leave private address enabled then the watch is randomly assigning itself a new MAC seemingly at least once per week. It's only ever connected to the same 2.4Ghz network. If I disable private address it soon reenables itself with no user input and then does the same. Basically the toggle doesn't work. Just another issue in a catalogue of bugs I'm having with all my Apple devices recently. Very annoying.

Anyway thanks for your help. Much appreciated ?
 
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When are you trying to turn off the private address? If its MAC is block it should try switching to its hardware MAC if that is blocked too it could get weird if thats when you are trying to turn off the Private Address setting.

Although I do have a network that I have auto-join turned off on my Watch and it never connects too it. I'm not sure if thats an options or something you could explore.
 
I turn off private address in the settings app on my watch and all is fine, then a few days later it decides it wants to turn it back on again. The toggle goes green entirely of its own accord and it changes MAC address. Not sure what else to say. Has to be a bug.
 
Jim Lahey said:
Honestly no. Not on this occasion. Reporting bugs to Apple is becoming a full time job. Not sure I can be bothered anymore.
Click to expand...

This seems a pretty niche bug. I can totally see this getting missed in the face or larger issues. I’d report it if it’s important to you.
 
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Thanks, you’re probably right. I will monitor it for a while and see if I can pinpoint any patterns or triggers. Failing that I’ll wipe it and start afresh as per a previous suggestion. If it’s still occurring after that then I’ll report it to Apple.
 
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Jim Lahey said:
Hello and thanks for your reply. I'm not really sure I understand what you mean, though. The watch is seemingly making up a new MAC address randomly whenever it feels like it. It reverts to using a private address even though I've set it not to (the toggle goes green again of its own accord). The watch is not aware of the 5.0Ghz network at all, as it's unable to even connect to 5.0Ghz, so that shouldn't be a factor.
Click to expand...

I suspect that the WiFi setting “handoff” between iPhone and Watch is in fact the issue. That is, the iPhone is connecting to a different network than the Watch, but keeps on re-telling the Watch to connect to that network, and that somehow overwrites your settings.

I’d bet any of moving the iPhone to the 2.4GHz network, merging the networks, or upgrading the Watch would resolve the issue. It is likely a bug of sorts, but a niche edge case that is hard to prioritize.

(I’ll say that the 5GHz support in newer Watches is an underappreciated feature, incidentally.)
 
Janak Parekh said:
I suspect that the WiFi setting “handoff” between iPhone and Watch is in fact the issue. That is, the iPhone is connecting to a different network than the Watch, but keeps on re-telling the Watch to connect to that network, and that somehow overwrites your settings.

I’d bet any of moving the iPhone to the 2.4GHz network, merging the networks, or upgrading the Watch would resolve the issue. It is likely a bug of sorts, but a niche edge case that is hard to prioritize.

(I’ll say that the 5GHz support in newer Watches is an underappreciated feature, incidentally.)
Click to expand...

Thanks. I’ve disabled Handoff in the Watch app on iPhone and will see if there’s any change. If that’s what you mean. I think I mentioned up thread that I suspected putting the phone on the 2.4Ghz network might fix it. I don’t really want to do that unless I have to but we shall see. Thanks again all for your help. Appreciated as always ?
 
Jim Lahey said:
Thanks. I’ve disabled Handoff in the Watch app on iPhone and will see if there’s any change. If that’s what you mean. I think I mentioned up thread that I suspected putting the phone on the 2.4Ghz network might fix it. I don’t really want to do that unless I have to but we shall see. Thanks again all for your help. Appreciated as always ?
Click to expand...
What happens if you completely turn off your phone? Is the watch able to connect to your wi-fi?
 
This is getting interesting ... Yesterday I upgraded to IOS 15.3 on my phone and WOS 8.4 on my series 6 watch. This morning I checked my router logs and noticed that my watch's private address for that network has changed. I'm going to dig a bit deeper.
 
From Apple Support:
In some cases, your device will change its private Wi-Fi address:

  • If you erase all content and settings or reset network settings on the device, your device uses a different private address the next time it connects to that network.
  • Starting with iOS 15, iPadOS 15, and watchOS 8, if your device hasn’t joined the network in 6 weeks, it uses a different private address the next time it connects to that network. And if you make your device forget the network, it will also forget the private address it used with that network, unless it has been less than 2 weeks since the last time it was made to forget that network.
I don't know which of these conditions applies to my case, but something definitely happened when I upgraded the OS yesterday.

(Sorry to keep following up my own posts.)
 
GeekyGrannie said:
What happens if you completely turn off your phone? Is the watch able to connect to your wi-fi?
Click to expand...

Yes the watch can still connect to its 2.4Ghz network if the phone is powered off. Although in doing so it defaults back to private address again. In effect, the toggle on my watch is pointless.
 
OK, so you can't leave Private Address toggled off because it turns back on for no reason you can discern and you can't leave it toggled on because the private address it generates keeps changing. That is truly puzzling. When I turn Private Address on for a particular network it does seem to change the generated address at times, but when I turn it off, it stays off. I'll watch it closely for a few days and see if anything weird shows up.
 
GeekyGrannie said:
OK, so you can't leave Private Address toggled off because it turns back on for no reason you can discern and you can't leave it toggled on because the private address it generates keeps changing. That is truly puzzling. When I turn Private Address on for a particular network it does seem to change the generated address at times, but when I turn it off, it stays off. I'll watch it closely for a few days and see if anything weird shows up.
Click to expand...

Affirmative. Well, sort of. I could leave private address turned on and it would probably be ok for six weeks or so and then I'd have to configure the MAC again in my router. This whole private address thing is a known foible on managed networks. That's why you can disable it so the MAC stays static, old school style. It's just that mine won't stay disabled no matter what I do :mad:

I have now discovered that if I leave it to to its own devices it will randomly re-enable private address and generate a new MAC at intervals. I would estimate weekly but you couldn't set your watch by it, pun intended. However, it's important to note that the watch is often not connected to Wi-Fi at all, as it seemingly priorities Bluetooth when the iPhone is nearby. In this scenario, if I manually force it to connect to the 2.4Ghz Wi-Fi, it always overwrites my toggle, enabling private address, and in turn generates a new MAC.

Left alone, it will automatically connect and disconnect itself from the Wi-Fi network whenever it chooses without issue and without swapping MAC, but very often it will do the MAC swap, and it's a lot more frequent than once every six weeks. Think I will just end up configuring my network to suit the watch and be done with it. I will update the thread if anything changes. Meanwhile of course I will get notifications if anyone contributes further to this discussion :cool:

ETA: I have caved and just enabled private address. This means from time to time I will have to add/edit the new MAC into my router config. Hopefully only every six weeks or so. Imperfect solution but I've decided this is not important enough to invest any more time in. There are options left on the table to try but each is a compromise in itself and it's not worth the hassle. Maybe it'll resolve itself when I upgrade to Series 8 or whatever with 5.0Ghz capability :oops:
 
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Bit of an update on this for those who may have a passing interest. I recently disconnected the iPhone from the 5.0Ghz radio and now have both the watch and phone connected exclusively to the same 2.4Ghz network with private address disabled as per my preference. So far it has not automatically re-enabled itself, and the MAC has thus remained static. Fingers crossed it stays this way?

Downside of course is my iPhone now doesn’t get anywhere near saturating my internet bandwidth on a Speedtest, but honestly I never use it for anything that demands those speeds anyway, so for now this seems the best solution until either Apple fixes the bug (unlikely) or I upgrade to a 5.0Ghz capable Apple Watch (not happening anytime soon).

TLDR; Both the phone and watch need to be on the same network otherwise Private Address toggle-off is broken. This may sound obvious but the literature only states that the phone must be aware of the network that the watch is using, not that they must both be connected to it.
 
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Jim Lahey said:
Bit of an update on this for those who may have a passing interest. I recently disconnected the iPhone from the 5.0Ghz radio and now have both the watch and phone connected exclusively to the same 2.4Ghz network with private address disabled as per my preference. So far it has not automatically re-enabled itself, and the MAC has thus remained static. Fingers crossed it stays this way🤞

Downside of course is my iPhone now doesn’t get anywhere near saturating my internet bandwidth on a Speedtest, but honestly I never use it for anything that demands those speeds anyway, so for now this seems the best solution until either Apple fixes the bug (unlikely) or I upgrade to a 5.0Ghz capable Apple Watch (not happening anytime soon).

TLDR; Both the phone and watch need to be on the same network otherwise Private Address toggle-off is broken. This may sound obvious but the literature only states that the phone must be aware of the network that the watch is using, not that they must both be connected to it.
Click to expand...
Don't know if this will be an alternative solution for you, but you could just broadcast the 2.4GHz and 5GHz bands on the same SSID. Your phone will still likely connect using 5GHz, and the watch will connect using 2.4GHz; yet it'll appear as one network/one MAC address to worry about.

I used to keep my SSIDs different for the two bands, but it caused other problems and just became more of a hassle than it was worth. I eventually decided to broadcast them both on the same SSID and just let the devices figure out which band to use instead micromanaging them. Most of my devices still connect to the 5GHz band, and will switch to 2.4GHz if it detects that would be better, such as when I get farther away from the router or going through multiple floors/walls.
 
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BigBlur said:
Don't know if this will be an alternative solution for you, but you could just broadcast the 2.4GHz and 5GHz bands on the same SSID. Your phone will still likely connect using 5GHz, and the watch will connect using 2.4GHz; yet it'll appear as one network/one MAC address to worry about.

I used to keep my SSIDs different for the two bands, but it caused other problems and just became more of a hassle than it was worth. I eventually decided to broadcast them both on the same SSID and just let the devices figure out which band to use instead micromanaging them. Most of my devices still connect to the 5GHz band, and will switch to 2.4GHz if it detects that would be better, such as when I get farther away from the router or going through multiple floors/walls.
Click to expand...

Thanks but I want to be able to definitively determine which band each device connects to. I had issues with my Apple TV choosing 2.4Ghz even though it's about ten feet away from the router and in line of sight.
 
was private address enabled in the 2.4 in the phone settings before? (not the watch app on the phone, the settings for the phone itself)
wondering if the setting was "syncing" from the phone to the watch.


the watch will naturally use the lowest power radio available, and power off the others, so as long as your phone is close then the watch will only have the bluetooth radio powered on, if it doesn't see bluetooth for a bit, then it turns on wifi. Same applies to cellular, it will only power that on if it can't find bluetooth or wifi.

so depending on the size of your house, and how far you're able to get from your phone when you set it down. The watch might not switch to wifi that often.
 
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