Should you use your MBP more like a portable device?

[212rikanmofo]

With my old 2015 12" Macbook, I mostly use it plugged into an electric outlet. I would say about 90-95% of the time. But then my battery can't even hold a charge for no longer than 1-2 minutes. My cycle count shows 523, not sure how accurate that is though. But with the battery status in my menubar showing "Service Recommended" really disappointed me with how fast the battery failed on me. It started happening right after my factory warranty expired and I didn't want to spend the extra money getting it replaced. At this point, I have lost trust with batteries in apple products.

Which leads me to my next question. I have a new MBP 14 on the way. In order to prolong the battery life, should I be using it more like a portable device such as an iPhone/iPad meaning using it mostly unplugged and only plug it in when necessary such as doing CPU/GPU intensive tasks? Or have the battery technology improved overall in the newer macbooks? I would hate to run into this problem again. I really wish Apple would make the batteries easily replaceable like on their PowerBook G4's. I also hate not being able to easily upgrade the memory and storage as well. If they bring back these features, it would by far be their best laptop ever. They've come close with the new MBP 14/16 and are definitely going in the right direction with more function over form this time.

 

[dagored]

First part of your second paragraph. YES!

 

[DMG35]

First of all, batteries have come a long way since 2012 and there is a lot more too it than just the battery itself. Apple, with their own M1 chips, has now been able to give us extremely powerrful laptops that have bettery battery than any other laptop on the market. You should have confidence that your new 14" battery life is going to far exceed your expectations.

Secondly, yes, they are meant to be portable devices. You don't need and won't have to keep it plugged in all the time as the battery is going to last you much much much longer than what you are currently used to. Unplug it and untether yourself. Your battery life is going to be great and you will love your 14" MacBook Pro.

 

[WriteNow]

I really wish Apple would make the batteries easily replaceable like on their PowerBook G4's.

That would be nice. Not just to make replacing a worn out battery easier, but also there probably are people who don't have ready access to an electric outlet who could benefit from being able to quickly exchange a discharged battery with a fully charged battery. (Admittedly, battery life is so good now that this is nothing more than unpleasant memory for many who once had to swap batteries regularly. But I'd have to think there are people out there who'd find this useful, even with today's longer hour battery lives.)

 

[GumaRodak]

Buy a desktop imo

 

[MrGunnyPT]

I use my 14" as a desktop and whenever I'm not at home I just take it from my TB3 Dock and put it in my bag and go... Been doing this since my 2013 13" and I never had any issues.

Honestly having the best of both worlds is the best.. I eventually plan to get a iMac but not until it supports 2 external displays.

 

[Wando64]

I think you have been unlucky.

In spite of what some people might say, there is no solid evidence that keeping an Apple laptop plugged in all the time will damage the battery.
I don't think there is any evidence the other way either though.

All I can offer to your experience of a failed battery is my experience of a battery that is still doing fine on my Early 2015 MBP kept plugged in most of the time.
Both experiences are anecdotal.

 

[macintoshmac]

With my old 2015 12" Macbook, I mostly use it plugged into an electric outlet. I would say about 90-95% of the time. But then my battery can't even hold a charge for no longer than 1-2 minutes. My cycle count shows 523, not sure how accurate that is though. But with the battery status in my menubar showing "Service Recommended" really disappointed me with how fast the battery failed on me. It started happening right after my factory warranty expired and I didn't want to spend the extra money getting it replaced. At this point, I have lost trust with batteries in apple products.

Which leads me to my next question. I have a new MBP 14 on the way. In order to prolong the battery life, should I be using it more like a portable device such as an iPhone/iPad meaning using it mostly unplugged and only plug it in when necessary such as doing CPU/GPU intensive tasks? Or have the battery technology improved overall in the newer macbooks? I would hate to run into this problem again. I really wish Apple would make the batteries easily replaceable like on their PowerBook G4's. I also hate not being able to easily upgrade the memory and storage as well. If they bring back these features, it would by far be their best laptop ever. They've come close with the new MBP 14/16 and are definitely going in the right direction with more function over form this time.

You are truly overthinking this.

 

[fa8362]

You are truly overthinking this.

Par for the course here...

 

[smirking]

At this point, I have lost trust with batteries in apple products.

You won't have better luck elsewhere and if you do, it's luck. All batteries fail. Some just fail sooner than others. I've bought expensive OWC brand replacement batteries and some of the cheap generics you can get on eBay. My best and worst experience was with the OWC ones. The generics were somewhere in between.

Your laptop is over six years old. Some people have managed to still have viable batteries after that much time, but it's common for them to be pretty dead by then.

 

[Christopher Kim]

Posted this on another thread also, but prior to getting my new 14" M1 Pro (10/16/32gb/1tb), I was using a 2016 13" MBP about 50/50 as a "laptop" and in closed-clamshell mode. For 18mos during the pandemic, I was working from home fully, and my MBP was doing 99% closed-clamshell. My setup is Thunderbolt 3 cable into a TB3 dock, with an Apple Magic Keyboard / Trackpad, and my monitor & peripherals are all connected to the dock.

My understanding of the Mac laptop batteries:
- So pre-2016 re-design, anecdotally feels like Apple used different batteries that had no issues being plugged in all-the-time. Lot of examples of ppl with 2011-2015 MBPs that plugged in all the time and had no battery expansion / degradation issues
- Since 2016 re-design (and maybe your 2015 12" Macbook also used the same one), many more anecdotes that those ppl who kept plugged in 100% would have pre-mature battery issues, expanding, degradation of battery health that was quite different than typical relationship with number of cycles (eg. low cycle count would still have battery health already in the low-80s%)

Given that, what I did once going 99% closed-clamshell is every time I was done my workday, I would put my MBP to sleep and then unplug my TB3 cable (so not plugged in). Then when I started up again in the morning, I'd plug the TB3 cable back in. Whenever I needed the computer during weeknights (eg. on sofa or in bed), or over the weekend, I would generally use on battery "as a laptop", not connected to dock, to give it some use on battery as a portable device.

Whether this does anything to keep battery longevity or not, I was happy to do it, as it was very minimal effort on my part, and seemed to make sense that it could potentially be beneficial. I've had no battery issues while doing it this way (not claiming that's proof of course, but just FYI).

I think it remains to be seen whether the batteries in the new 16" and 14" M1 Pro/Max laptops also have potential issues when plugged in most of the time, or not. But given any such issues wouldn't really become apparent for a couple years, I'm going to keep up my routine regardless. Like I said, very small effort on my part given my workflow, so even if it doesn't help / make a difference at all, I'm ok with it. And it very well could help!

 

[smirking]

- So pre-2016 re-design, anecdotally feels like Apple used different batteries that had no issues being plugged in all-the-time. Lot of examples of ppl with 2011-2015 MBPs that plugged in all the time and had no battery expansion / degradation issues

Not true. I've had multiple early battery failures including two swollen batteries with my 2009 and 2010 MBP Unibodies. So much of this is luck. People are seeing things where there is none.

 

[Christopher Kim]

Not true. I've had multiple early battery failures including two swollen batteries with my 2009 and 2010 MBP Unibodies. So much of this is luck. People are seeing things where there is none.

Agree it's pretty luck-driven. I've just read a lot of stories of especially 2011-2015 MBPs who were plugged in 100% of the time, and had no battery issues. Whenever there are posts like the OP here asking, often see people with these vintage MBPs saying not to worry about it. Maybe the 2009/2010s were different as well?

 

[jsamuels]

Batteries will degrade over 6 years regardless of being plugged in all the time or not. I think you've gotten pretty good usage. I just replaced the battery on my standby 2014 MacBook Air to give it some extra legs before its retirement. I don't worry at all about my new MBP - plugged in or otherwise. It's a tool so I use it.

 

[wilberforce]

There are several things that degrade the lifespan of Li-ion batteries, and this is just the physics of it, no way getting around it. All of the following reduce lifespan:

Maintaining the battery fully charged
Deeply discharging the battery
Keeping the battery at elevated temperatures
Fast charging the battery
Number of charge cycles
Age

The problem is that all these things are also highly desirable for getting the most capacity and usefulness out of the battery.

So reasonable compromises have to be made. For example, Apple now programs the charge cycle to minimize the amount of time it is charged above 80%. Best would be to always keep the battery near 50% charge, but that would be a total nuisance to manage, and essentially negate the whole purpose of having a battery in the first place (which is to be not tied to a power source all the time).

More info, instead of just anecdotes:

BU-808: How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries

BU meta description needed...

batteryuniversity.com

 

[wilberforce]

Not true. I've had multiple early battery failures including two swollen batteries with my 2009 and 2010 MBP Unibodies. So much of this is luck. People are seeing things where there is none.

Agree, I had a badly swollen battery in my 2015 MBP after about 4 years of being plugged in most of the time. I think Apple monitors the battery health better now, and manages the charge profile/rate better now, which should improve things.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Honestly, unless you plan on taking the device with you 70-100% of the time you may be better served with an iMac and an iPad.

As others have said the laptop battery needs to be discharged from time to time to stay healthy; and batteries degrade over time no matter how well maintained they are.

Even for me, I used my MBP on the go 98% of the time and still had a swollen battery after 4 years. I replaced it and two years later I can feel it starting to swell again.

If you plan on keeping it plugged in all the time or even most of the time you'll save money with the new iMacs and an iPad.

 

[212rikanmofo]

Yeah I had also experience the swollen battery issue on my previous Apple laptops as well. And it would warp the case and end up damaging other parts of the machine. This is why I really hate non-replaceable batteries. At least with those if you suspect that the battery might be swelling up, you can at least take it out. Having everything permanently non-removeable is really a PITA when you have battery issues. They need to bring back user swappable batteries again.

 

[bill-p]

With my old 2015 12" Macbook, I mostly use it plugged into an electric outlet.

This is your problem. Battery degrades faster when forced to be at near full capacity all the time. But you also don't want the battery to be empty for too long either. The sweet spot is somewhere in between.

So you don't want to run your battery to empty but you must allow it to stay around 50% capacity if longevity is the goal.

But having said that...

Having everything permanently non-removeable is really a PITA when you have battery issues.

This is not quite true. Apple does replace the battery out of service. Here's the price chart:

Personally, I'd just buy AppleCare+. Comes out to about $99 per year and if the battery dies within this time period, it's also replaced free of charge. Also covers accidental damage.

 

[Killbynumbers]

Buy a desktop imo

Can't use a desktop in bed.

 

[kingtj1971]

I think you have been unlucky.

In spite of what some people might say, there is no solid evidence that keeping an Apple laptop plugged in all the time will damage the battery.
I don't think there is any evidence the other way either though.

All I can offer to your experience of a failed battery is my experience of a battery that is still doing fine on my Early 2015 MBP kept plugged in most of the time.
Both experiences are anecdotal.

I'd say I've seen plenty of first-hand evidence that leaving laptops constantly on docks, charging from wall power, leads to premature battery failure. I worked for two different companies who issued these to every employee and we saw battery life decay to practically nothing for entire offices full of them that were all roughly the same age.

That said? This issue has been addressed much more aggressively with newer laptops, whether Windows or Mac. The new Lenovo Yoga I use at work has battery management software and it will occasionally stop the charging process so the battery can be run down to 40% charge or so before charging it back up, while you use it throughout the day. And Apple does battery management now in iOS and in OS X to prevent charging a battery up to 100% except for times when you're most likely to need it.

I wouldn't be that worried about it on anything current -- but not because "constantly leaving batteries charged 100% while on AC power doesn't hurt them". It's because they manage all of this for you now so that won't happen.

 

[dead flag blues]

I hope to never have a desktop (or deskside) computer ever again.

 

[DeltaMac]

Can't use a desktop in bed.

Oh, really?
I have a customer who is paralyzed, bedridden, and uses an iMac on a bed-table.
And, uses it to make a living from computer graphics and web design.
He does not seem to have a problem...

 

[GumaRodak]

If desktop isnt an option, then i would just use the machine as you wish…
If you care about this and that and worry about things like battery, which is replaceable, then you dont use it 100%.
If its hooked to AC all the time, the smart charging will learn it and charge the battery to only 80%. From time to time drain the battery to 10% and charge again to maintain good battery health..

 

[smirking]

There are several things that degrade the lifespan of Li-ion batteries, and this is just the physics of it, no way getting around it. All of the following reduce lifespan:
...
Fast charging the battery

The fast charging warning is out of date... sort of. Modern battery charging algorithms allow for fast charging when the battery is depleted. It won't cause much stress to the battery to fast charge if it's an empty can. The algorithm begins to slow down the charging progressively after you exceed somewhere around 50% and the last 10% can take quite a while to charge if you're charging to 100%.