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dukebound85

macrumors Core
Original poster
Jul 17, 2005
19,218
4,342
5045 feet above sea level
Here is the story:

For Christmas 2003, my father had purchases a Sony KDF60XBR950 Rear Projection TV for a cool $6k.

The TV had died in July 2008. My father had called Sony and was told that we were on our own. At that point, we googled issues with the TV and found that it may have been the G1 Board or a faulty thermal fuse. We also had to replace the lamp door due to it being melted. We attempted to swap it out and in the process, we kept on googling issues.

Apparently there is an extended warranty on this set. Sounds pretty straightforward no? Here are the links
http://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/news-item.pl?&news_id=261&mdl=KF60WE610
2003 Models: KF42WE610, KF50WE610, KF60WE610, KDF60XBR950, KDF70XBR950
2004 Models: KF42WE620, KF50WE620, KDF42WE655, KDF50WE655

It has come to our attention that a limited number of Grand WEGA rear projection televisions (models listed above) may exhibit warping to the lamp access door. In rare cases, some additional components may also become damaged as a result.

Sony would like to assure its customers that this issue has been evaluated extensively and that there are no product safety concerns caused by this issue.

As part of our commitment to quality, Sony will reimburse owners of eligible models in the United States who paid out-of pocket expenses on or before May 9, 2008 for an estimate or repair service related to this specific lamp door issue. To receive reimbursement, please follow the exact directions on the claim form for reimbursement; all claims must be postmarked by August 31, 2008. See the claim form for complete terms and conditions.

Additionally, through March 31, 2011, Sony will repair the lamp access door and any other components damaged as a result at no charge for any of the covered televisions. Customers who experience this issue should contact Sony at (888) 649-7669 to schedule a repair. Sony will only provide free repair to covered televisions that exhibit this specific condition.

All other terms of the Sony limited warranty continue to apply. Sony utilizes a network of hundreds of qualified independent third-party servicers to perform in-home television warranty service. Sony, through its Authorized Servicer Network, will repair your set within 30 days of your initial contact. For diagnosis, warranty service, or if your set is not repaired within 30 days, please contact Sony at (888) 649-7669.
Emphasis mine.

Upon finding this tidbit of info, my father called SONY and after much complaining was able to get a manager. Keep in mind they were telling us we were out of luck. Eventually, we got a service man to come out here.

The servce tech verified what we had told him and that the unit had melted itself and was a fire hazard due to a design flaw by SONY. This bodes well with extended warranty info that we had found. He then says SONY would most likely or replace it as it was deemed unrepairable by him.

A couple days past and we get a call from SONY offerring us a discount on a new tv. Keep in mind we paid 6k for a top of the line model. Their offers ranged from about 525 for a Bravia 55inch to 80 bucks for a 46 in low end model. Obviously, this does not jive with what their warranty said, whcih I will restate

Additionally, through March 31, 2011, Sony will repair the lamp access door and any other components damaged as a result at no charge for any of the covered televisions. Customers who experience this issue should contact Sony at (888) 649-7669 to schedule a repair. Sony will only provide free repair to covered televisions that exhibit this specific condition.

All other terms of the Sony limited warranty continue to apply. Sony utilizes a network of hundreds of qualified independent third-party servicers to perform in-home television warranty service. Sony, through its Authorized Servicer Network, will repair your set within 30 days of your initial contact. For diagnosis, warranty service, or if your set is not repaired within 30 days, please contact Sony at (888) 649-7669.

The SONY rep says that that is the best they can do since they no longer have the part to repair it. That is NOT our problem that they can repair the TV due to a lack of parts. Also, this is almost TWO YEARS after we had first called them, when the warranty says that it will be taken care of for no charge within 30 DAYS.

We have tried calling the number various times and have been denied multiple times to talk to their manager (unbelievable right?) of various occasions. In our latest call, SONY said the offer was only good for 7 days from the initial offer.....THEY MADE NO MENTION OF THIS WHEN WE WERE FIST INFORMED.

Upon further research, we find this on a Sony TV Forums for people who have this same issue
ATTENTION all owners of models KF-42WE610, KF-50WE610, KF-60WE610, KDF-60XBR950, KDF-70XBR950, KF-42WE620, KF-50WE620, KDF-42WE655, and KDF-50WE655:

This is a reminder that your TV has a known failure related to lamp overheating, causing warping, melting, scorching, cracking, etc. of the lamp door and other adjacent parts in the TV. This can eventually render your TV inoperable, and it could be a safety issue.

Sony USA has an extended warranty alert for the problem:
Limited Extended Warranty for Certain 2003 and 2004 Televisions Exhibiting Warping of the Lamp Access Door

And Sony Canada has an offer alert for the problem:
Notice for 2003 and 2004 Model Year Grand WEGAâ„¢ Televisions

Previously, these alerts expired on March 31st, 2010, but Sony recently extended it to March 31st, 2010. I recommend that all owners take a look at their lamp doors (go through the procedure you would do to replace the lamp without actually unplugging it). If there is any sign of warping, melting, scorching, cracking, etc. on the lamp door itself or any surrounding parts, you should report it to Sony. It may already have happened, but you are unaware of it.

If you find evidence of the problem, and you are concerned that there is a potential safety issue, please file an Incident Report with the Consumer Product Safety Commission.

In the US, I recommend insisting that Sony replaces your TV with one of EQUIVALENT SIZE and FEATURES WITHOUT CHARGE. Cite the following information (I am not an attorney, so this is legal information--not legal advice...consult an attorney for the latter):

The federal Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (Title 15 of the United States Code, Sections 2301-2312) states the following.

Section 2304(a)(1): "{S}uch warrantor must as a minimum remedy such consumer product within a reasonable time and without charge, in the case of a defect, malfunction, or failure to conform with such written warranty..."

Section 2301(11): "The term 'replacement' means furnishing a new consumer product which is identical or reasonably equivalent to the warranted consumer product."

Section 2304(d): "Remedy without charge. For purposes of this section and of section 2302(c) of this title, the term 'without charge' means that the warrantor may not assess the consumer for any costs the warrantor or his representatives incur in connection with the required remedy of a warranted consumer product..."

Section 2304(a)(4): "{I}f the product (or a component part thereof) contains a defect or malfunction after a reasonable number of attempts by the warrantor to remedy defects or malfunctions in such product, such warrantor must permit the consumer to elect either a refund for, or replacement without charge of, such product or part (as the case may be)..."

Read more: http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=36634&forum=34#ixzz0lb2OslzH

We are at a loss of what to do. Sony is not standing by what their own effing warranty tells them they need to do. Essentially we have been told to take the offer or **** off. This seems to bein DIRECT VIOLATION to their own warranty and that case.

My dad also found that other owners of this tv model have formed class action lawsuits over this.

What can we do? We are thinking of calling up Clark Howard or Tom Martino (talk show consumer advocates)

I am finding this UNBELIEVABLE

In VERY stark contrast to Apple and even MS where Apple repalced a dead logic board for FREE on an out of warranty machine and gave me a free batt when my laptop was out of warranty since it was bulging and MS who has given us numerous replacement 360s

I hate SONY and will never buy their **** again

Any advice is very welcome. We feel that a replacement tv at no cost for a similar size is not too much to ask for)
 
I would have been all over that Bravia for $525. Seems like a reasonable offer if they are in fact unable to fix your 7-year-old TV. I don't see how this has taken you 2 years to reach this point, unless you just set it aside for a long period of time before trying to get it fixed.

I'd say you should evaluate how much your time is worth. You can probably easily get them to give you the deal on the Bravia again. And I'd bet you can find someone to give you at least a couple hundred bucks for your old TV. Then you'll be done with this problem, only out a couple hundred dollars, and moving on with your life with a much better TV. It's either that or waste more time suing them and probably getting the same result.
 
I would have been all over that Bravia for $525. Seems like a reasonable offer if they are in fact unable to fix your 7-year-old TV. I don't see how this has taken you 2 years to reach this point, unless you just set it aside for a long period of time before trying to get it fixed.

I'd say you should evaluate how much your time is worth. You can probably easily get them to give you the deal on the Bravia again. And I'd bet you can find someone to give you at least a couple hundred bucks for your old TV. Then you'll be done with this problem, only out a couple hundred dollars, and moving on with your life with a much better TV. It's either that or waste more time suing them and probably getting the same result.

I agree.

No offense, but the TV is over 7 years old and even in great condition would not be worth anywhere near the $6,000, not even on Craigslist.

I would have taken the $525 and considered it a fair trade.

On the other hand, I has a Sony FE series laptop that had the backlight go out in under a year. Sony sent a tech to my dormroom to fix it. About 3 months later I had similiar issues again. I sent in the laptop and they did about $850 dollars worth of repairs to it; new backlight, keyboard, etc... the works. Sony never really gave me that much trouble for the repairs
 
The problem might lay in the fact that the tech said the TV was unrepairable by him. How could Sony cover the repair costs if it's beyond repair?

For a 7 year old TV, those offers they gave seemed quite fair. AFAIK, the Bravia is the top of their current line.

If you're not happy with anything they've offered then it seems that the class action suit would be the best bet. Who knows how much you'd actually get out of that though?
 
They said they would repair it in the warranty statement up until March 31, 2011....

Looks at top right of MacBook screen...

It is Mon, April 19, 2010...

In other words it is not past March 31, 2011 and they are refusing to repair or replace it.

If they offered a top of the line TV for free due to not being able to follow through with their warranty statement then fine, but to charge because "they ran out of the part."

Maybe they don't have extra money to spend on a tv, maybe they have plenty but the fact of the matter is Sony is not living up to a written warranty statement. It's black and white and the point is they are defaulting.
 
They said they would repair it in the warranty statement up until March 31, 2011....

Looks at top right of MacBook screen...

It is Mon, April 19, 2010...

In other words it is not past March 31, 2011 and they are refusing to repair or replace it.

If they offered a top of the line TV for free due to not being able to follow through with their warranty statement then fine, but to charge because "they ran out of the part."

Maybe they don't have extra money to spend on a tv, maybe they have plenty but the fact of the matter is Sony is not living up to a written warranty statement. It's black and white and the point is they are defaulting.

Exactly. I am at a loss for what to do. What can you do when their customer service doesn't want to accomodate you? We are just asking that they fulfill the warranty

A 6k tv should last more than 4.5 years of use

Should we pursue small claims?
 
Well you said there are a few (many?) class action lawsuits over this issue. I guess you could join up with that. I don't know that much about small claims court and if it applies to warranties. If you have a lawyer friend, talk to them about what you should do.

If not then hopefully someone with better knowledge will wonder in here because frankly I see the wrong doing but I'm not sure how to fix it.
 
Exactly. I am at a loss for what to do. What can you do when their customer service doesn't want to accomodate you? We are just asking that they fulfill the warranty

A 6k tv should last more than 4.5 years of use

Should we pursue small claims?

If you are so sure that you have the legal high ground, then by all means pursue it.

However, I'm fairly certian that you'll spend more than $6,000 on total costs (court, court time, gas, phone bill, perhaps loss of earning potential if you're forced to take time off from work to meet a court date, etc...) and in the end, at best, you'll either get the tv fixed, again- not anywhere near the original investment of $6k, or Sony will give you a tv that is comparable to the broken one, again- not anywhere near the $6k.

While your situation is unfortunate, it's a no win, cut your losses now.
 
all we want is a working tv

we dont care if its the same tv repaired or a free replacement

we do not think however, we need to pay for one, even if discounted

In that case you need to either keep calling them or file a lawsuit. For me that would be a lot of time wasted for minimal gain, but it may be worth it to you. Odds are you'll spend more on a lawsuit than you would gain.
 
If it only lasted 4.5 years, I'd expect a free replacement too. I'd try calling the company again. When they tell you to call the company directly, and tell that person hat your complaint is against CS, and that's why you're not calling them.

I don't know how possible this is, but look it up.
 
Any advice is very welcome. We feel that a replacement tv at no cost for a similar size is not too much to ask for)

If this is what you want, it'll take a little doing, but it should be possible.

First, make sure you have all your papers, a pen, computer, and such ready to go near a comfortable chair and a phone that has a speaker and/or headset (also make sure the phone will have the battery life to last for at least a few hours of talk time; if not, then have a replacement ready). From personal experience, I also recommend using a land line.

Call Sony's customer service number and start up the chain and follow the following rules:

1) Don't get angry at anyone, even if you are fuming inside (I've been there with AT&T before, trust me). To release stress squeeze a stress ball or something. Always, ALWAYS remain calm and polite.

2) Don't ever hang up the phone until you've gotten what you set out to get. Your call isn't done until that new TV has been promised.

3) Everyone has a boss. Even if someone tells you they don't, they're lying. Keep going higher if necessary. Eventually, you will reach a level called "retention" or "customer relations." It's their job to keep you happy and they have pretty wide latitude. You just need to find them first, because their numbers are never public info.

4) Make the agent's job easier. If you're polite and have all the info ready to go, they'll feel better about helping you. Thank them in the beginning and end, even if they were simply a transfer point between other agents. Seriously, honey will get you very far; that can't be emphasized enough.

Remember, there is someone at the company that can help you. Hold onto that, because you will likely be transfered dozens of times. Just remember to be polite, persistent, and insistent, and you'll eventually get what you need.


If you choose to go another route, then talking to a consumer reporter is probably a good start, but they typically will put more weight behind you when the problem is widespread and concentrated in time.

In case the reporter doesn't show interest, you could do either small claims or class action lawsuit. Small claims would be faster and easier since you wouldn't need a lawyer and only minimal paperwork. Plus there's a good chance Sony won't send a rep, which means that you'll end up getting a summary judgement. Just make sure that Colorado has a small claims limit above $6,000 (I know it's $7,500 for California but I'm not sure about Colorado).

Good luck! :)
 
No. DELL has horrible customer service. I am the "neigborhood repair man" and I've helped a lot of dells out so I've called in a lot. Furthermore when my parents bought me my first desktop when I was 14 it was a Dell (04-ish) and they also have only had dells. NOTHING BUT TROUBLE. Not only do I feel the computers are crap but so is their SERVICE. YUK! Thanks for resurrecting my horrible memories. In that era I'm pretty sure everyone that I know had their HDD go out... screw you Dell. If you got to have a PC, go HP.
 
Clearly persistence is key. Well done on the free tv. I'm quite jealous of the size :p

Wow, nicely done. See, never back down.

Good job. Congrats to you sticking to it and congrats to Sony for following througgh with a promise.

Yea I am still amazed that we actually got one. They could have easily told us to screw ourselves but really, glad they came around

WHen you pay that much for a tv, it should last more than 5-6 years:eek:
 
My new Sony HXR-NX5U Broke. I was redirected seven times to order replacement parts.

So, Bought a brand new Sony HXR-NX5U from B&H, two months ago.

Today, the hood on the end of the camera wouldn't open or close. It's a simple plastic part, probably worth no more then $40. I figured because the camera was still under the 1-year warranty, I would simply call B&H and have them send me a new part.

Well, B&H directed me to Sony to have them take care of the problem. they had me call the number-

888-476-6972

Who then had me hang up and call this number-

239-768-7606

Who put me on hold for a few minutes, said I had the wrong department and had me call-

866-766-9272

The guy here didn't speak good english and had me transferred to a different number, who then after hearing my problem, had me call this number-

800-538-7550

After navigating the phone menu and being asked four times if I wanted to do this in Spanish and holding for a few minutes told me I needed to call someone else because he didn't have access to the right information to complete my transaction, and gave me this number and extenuation.

800-883-6817 252

Who had poor manners, put me on hold for 7 minutes of silence, with no-background music, then gave me the number of the guy I had last.

800-538-7550

this time a pleasant sounding woman answered. I was in tears and played on her sympathy. She transferred me back-

800-883-6817 252

This time things were different, the guy seemed to actually know what a camera was, looked up my part number, and took down my information. He told me he'd call back. I'm just hoping that happens before the warranty expires in ten months.

In conclusion, isn't Sony great?

Cheers,
Andy
 
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