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Speculative: Why haven't Apple released a full sized TouchBar external Keyboard?

T

TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Original poster
Aug 24, 2017
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So, it's been what, 2 years now since the TouchBar came out with much fanfare on the higher end MBP's and yet there's still no external keyboard with the same.

Now, I know that there's some people out there who totally hate the TouchBar and feel there's zero need for it. That said, TB enabled MBP's do sell and apparently sell rather well - and there's folk who do seem to like the TouchBar.

So, this begs the question (purely speculative) - now that the new iMac is out - why wasn't that given a keyboard with a TouchBar?

Personally I'm a pondering if Apple's usage analytics are revealing that TouchBars don't get a huge amount of use past initial thrill - but that's based on me not owning a TB MBP so, what do I know?

I'm fascinated to hear from others what they're thoughts are (please no 'it's useless - I hate it responses - that's not what I'm looking for), especially from folk who have used it more than just initially and what their thoughts are.
 
I’d buy a touchbar keyboard in a heartbeat, if only for Touch ID. Why doesn’t it exist? Perhaps Apple considers the touch bar a wrong turn, or perhaps there are security issues moving Touch ID into a peripheral, or perhaps Apple is just slow? It’s not like Apple operates on a breakneck release schedule (for anything except phones).
 
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Because the TouchBar is an iOS device in a weird form factor actually. Adding the Touch Bar to the keyboard not only would drive up the price quite a lot, I think Apple has not solved how to synchronise the content on the Touch Bar (e.g. Auto-correction, suggested words etc.) with the Mac wirelessly in an acceptable latency.
 
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It is absolutely, 100%, well within Apple’s technical ability to make a Touch Bar and Touch ID-equipped external keyboard.

That they haven’t tells me that they agree now that the Touch Bar has been a bit of a failure, and, if they’re not going to put engineering effort into it, then they may as well not put effort into Touch ID on an external keyboard either because Face ID is probably on the cards for the relatively near future (I’d expect to see it in a redesigned iMac first).
 
I could be wrong, but I firmly believe the Touch Bar and the butterfly switch keyboard are Apple's first steps at producing a keyboard where each key is an individual OLED panel. I think the Touch Bar is a first attempt at implementing OLED tech on the keyboard, and the butterfly switches are a way to make the keyboard mechanism thin enough that they can fit a tiny OLED screen on top of it. It'd basically be the old Maximus keyboard.

Apple under Cook has been more willing to experiment in public, with the expectation that their customers like Apple products enough to deal with the experiments that don't quite work out. People may not largely like or use the Touch Bar, but they're still going to buy a new MacBook because...what else are they going to buy? And that gives Apple a huge advantage over the competition, because they get to test these new ideas on a huge number of customers. But it wouldn't make sense to implement the Touch Bar in a standalone keyboard, as people are more likely to avoid buying an accessory they don't like.
 
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TiggrToo said:
Personally I'm a pondering if Apple's usage analytics are revealing that TouchBars don't get a huge amount of use past initial thrill - but that's based on me not owning a TB MBP so, what do I know?
Click to expand...

I'd say that's pretty much it, initially people seemed to think it was brilliant and really cool but long-term users I've spoken to say they hardly use it, apart from Touch ID.

If you're a touch-typist then the last thing you want is to have to look down at the keyboard which you have to do as there is no physical way to tell between the options you are selecting.

I'd rather just have a simple fingerprint sensor built into the keyboard/Macbooks and save a couple hundred quid.
 
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MacGizmo said:
Touch ID isn't even going to exist in another year, so I doubt you'll ever see it in the external keyboard.
Click to expand...

Probably true on touch ID as face ID is doing a pretty good job so far. As for the touch bar ...

It's funny because I thought touch bar was hoopla and hadn't used it at all since I have external keyboard/trackpad and mouse. But after being on the road for a week and getting VERY used to one-touch bold/italics and two touch font color change and other useful things (including auto-suggest for words I don't know how to spell) - I'm REALLY missing it now that I'm back home!

Only trouble is, they will likely build a different form factor and I've already had to rebuild my keyboard tray twice - once for Magic Keyboard, then a second time to add the number pad.

IMG_0160 2.JPG
IMG_0158 2.jpg
 
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Sweet setup, fergmyster.
[doublepost=1519877899][/doublepost]'Cause they want to push buyers toward new machines?
Disclaimer: It's possible I'm a cynic.
 
It's because Apple knows that the touchbar is just a gimmick and adding it to a keyboard isn't going to make them a whole lot of money. Apple knows their MacBooks last a long time. They need to continue to give people reasons to not just keep using the same MacBook (Pro) for years on end.

There's just no reason to put that much time and effort into an accessory they can only sell for around $100 that only a very small subset of Apple's customers would even buy.
 
I stumbled upon this conversation because I, of course, like everyone here was thinking "why isn't there a magic keyboard with touch bar?" I connect my MacBook Pro to a monitor at home and I immediately miss some of the touch bar features I've gotten used to … especially the ease of logging in.

I think there is a lot of great speculation in this thread, but it brings me to a greater concern I have had of late.

I've used Apple products since the early 90s—cut my teeth on Mac Classics. I currently own a (2017) Macbook Pro, iPhone X, brand new iPad Pro (and Apple Pencil :)). What strikes me every day is the lack of consistency between device experience as of late. Just the configuration of USB-C, Thunderbolt and headphone connectors seems almost random at this point. It's maddening.

I should be able to charge all my devices with the same cable and plug, and use the same "stock" earbuds no matter which device I am using (I use Bluetooth earphones, but that isn't the point). The connection to my Apple LED display requires two adaptors and leaves an obsolete mag charging wire dangling in the wind. And I should have (at least the option to) the same keyboard experience externally as I do on my Macbook.

I am all-in for change and innovation but, every new generation of Apple products should have the same rules for connectivity and experience, in my opinion.

Again, some of the tech drawback speculations for the keyboard here may be valid, but I honestly don't buy it. I'm more inclined to believe there's been a shift in priority at Apple—away from seamless, cross-device UX. A shame because the real beauty of Apple's clean, sophisticated design, always had brilliant UX at its core. </rant>
 
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The touchbar has kinda been a flop for Apple.
I don't believe we'll see it appear on any keyboards.

I could be wrong.
 
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I forked out £15 for an app called DUET that I use when my MBP with touch bar is docked in clamshell connected to an external monitor an keyboards.
This allows me to use a connected iPad as a second screen, and also puts all the Touch Bar features onto this screen. Works pretty well for the $£$£$£$£$£
 
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wickawicka said:
I could be wrong, but I firmly believe the Touch Bar and the butterfly switch keyboard are Apple's first steps at producing a keyboard where each key is an individual OLED panel. I think the Touch Bar is a first attempt at implementing OLED tech on the keyboard, and the butterfly switches are a way to make the keyboard mechanism thin enough that they can fit a tiny OLED screen on top of it. It'd basically be the old Maximus keyboard.

Apple under Cook has been more willing to experiment in public, with the expectation that their customers like Apple products enough to deal with the experiments that don't quite work out. People may not largely like or use the Touch Bar, but they're still going to buy a new MacBook because...what else are they going to buy? And that gives Apple a huge advantage over the competition, because they get to test these new ideas on a huge number of customers. But it wouldn't make sense to implement the Touch Bar in a standalone keyboard, as people are more likely to avoid buying an accessory they don't like.
Click to expand...
You're not entirely wrong.
 
Following the 2018 refresh with the touchbar firmly in place on the MBP I think we may see something emerge with the upcoming Mac Pro and Mac Mini refresh following Mojave.
I would imagine the external touchbar will only work with Mojave and will therefore exclude older machines, keeping the new tech out of the hands of those who have not invested in newer machines.

I personally love the touchbar and with Better Touch Tool installed the potential for it is great. My MBP spends a lot of time in clamshell mode sat under the big screen TV, rendering the touchpad useless.
I would make much more use of the feature if it was available at all times.

Obviously the battery life will be shorter but I'd happily plug it in, just like I do with my phone and charge for a while while I keep using it.

They should include a long lead as well as a separate charger plug, although surely most of us have a spare phone charger plug.

Also the device will be heavier and a thicker form factor than the current magic keyboard so perhaps they will wait for Magic Trackpad 3 and match the size?

Or more likely they are waiting for improved battery technology.
 
I am simply left wanting for some hardware consistency across Apple's lineups.
Example. The Phone moves to FaceID as the mobile Laptops pick up TouchID while a desktop is left with potentially unlocking faster if you have an Apple Watch on your wrist and your wrist is close enough to the desktop when you sit down.

What am I asking for isn't even future hardware that doesn't exist yet.
Stop taking a dump on the desktop users and act like you're throwing us a bone every so often.
They spend a decent amount of keynote time talking about macOS with all it offers and they can't give us just a simple consistent way to unlock our devices across all of them.

Hey we want every customer to purchase multiple products but the unlocking process is the most inconsistent part of all of them. Figure it out already.
 
Today, I get prompted to double-tap my Apple Watch when I install an app or need to make preference changes. Why can't Apple at a minimum use the Apple Watch or the iPhone's Face-ID to integrate and be used as an Auth device?
 
Unless they put a massive battery in that thing, I don't see a touch-bar mobile keyboard ever. Like others, I'd chalk up $150+ for a keyboard with Touch-ID since I use my laptop as a desktop most of the time.
 
Touch Bar on external keyboards is technically possible. It's not exactly plug and play. Apple would need to provide appropriate drivers for all Macs running macOS.

Touch ID is a bit different. On iOS devices the fingerprint data is stored on the secure enclave of A7 thru A13 SoCs and on the T1 and T2 chips inside Macs. There would be privacy concerns on that topic.
 
@06tb06 Not necessarily - remember that you can unlock your Apple Watch by putting it on your wrist and unlocking the linked iPhone with password or biometrics. You can then further unlock a Mac simply by bringing the Apple Watch near it. Apple has figured this (wireless) chain out, so replacing the Apple Watch with a keyboard that has Touch ID shouldn't be any different.

I suspect other reasons for why we don't yet have a Touch ID keyboard. Apple's keyboards are already not the cheapest things around, and adding everything required for Touch ID would only increase the price.

Furthermore I think it more likely that Apple is considering Face ID for the iMac. That would only leave the Mac mini to rely on Apple Watch as an "external authenticator" for logging in, and probably Apple considers the number of Mac mini users without Apple Watch to not warrant adding Touch ID to their keyboard products.

After all, an Apple keyboard can be purchased for use with any type of Mac, and if all but one of those types of Macs already has built-in biometric authentication then doubling up on biometrics with all those Macs might not appeal to Apple.

The added price of the keyboard certainly wouldn't look great; customers would probably complain that their Mac already has biometrics, why do they have to pay more for a keyboard that also comes with it when a regular keyboard would do fine? And splitting Apple's keyboard products further into Touch ID and non-Touch ID versions doesn't sound like Apple to me.

But, this is just speculation on my part.
 
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