The MacRumors Show: Apple Intelligence and iOS 19 ft. Mark Gurman

[MacRumors]

Bloomberg's Mark Gurman joins us on this week's episode of The MacRumors Show to discuss the controversy surrounding Apple Intelligence, what to expect from iOS 19, and more.

Subscribe to The MacRumors Show YouTube channel for more videos​

With the context of his insider knowledge, Mark gives us his thoughts on Apple's recent announcement that it is further delaying the major Siri Apple Intelligence features that it expected to release as part of iOS 18. He gives us a sense of the scale of the crisis and when to expect the remaining features to arrive. We also discuss his recent report about a significant internal reshuffle to move Siri from artificial intelligence chief John Giannandrea to Vision Pro chief Mike Rockwell.

We delve into the complete redesign rumored for iOS 19, which is believed to be part of a wider push to bring a visionOS-style design language to all of Apple's major platforms. It is expected to be the biggest redesign of the iPhone's software since iOS 7. Mark tells us what users are likely to make of the update and why Apple is devoting so much energy to the redesign amid the problems with Apple Intelligence. He also tells us about the sort of new Apple Intelligence features to expect in iOS 19 and the plan to progressively improve Siri through to iOS 20.

We discuss why the delay in releasing the remaining Apple Intelligence features has delayed the company's long-rumored smart home hub product and the experience it is expected to offer when it launches later this year. We also touch on Apple's problems with allocating developer resources, iPhone 17-exclusive Apple Intelligence features, whether Apple is doing enough to course-correct on AI, Apple TV+ viewing habits, and more.

See more of Mark's work on Bloomberg and follow him on X @markgurman. The MacRumors Show also has its own YouTube channel, so make sure you're subscribed to keep up with new episodes and clips.

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If you haven't already listened to the previous episode of The MacRumors Show, catch up to hear our discussion about Apple's recent announcement that several of its most highly anticipated Apple Intelligence features are to be delayed.

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Article Link: The MacRumors Show: Apple Intelligence and iOS 19 ft. Mark Gurman

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

Gurman reviewing the podcast:

I expect this to be a great podcast. I’m led to believe that I will be invited as a guest. Consumers will most likely listen to this podcast because podcasts generally are audio-based. It could rain tomorrow.

 

[greenbreadmmm]

19 feet!

 

[markgpearse]

I was out for a walk today. Had my iPhone 16 Pro (18.3.2) with me. I asked Siri a question. It quickly responded with a written answer. I asked Siri to read the response to me. Siri said it is unable to do that.

Switched to Copilot. Asked the same question. No written response. I actually ended up having a conversation with Copilot.

As an aside, I think the guy they used for Copilot's voice is the same guy Spotify uses for their DJ's voice.

 

[spercharged69]

Oh man I love when the MacRumors show gets these huge guests, can't wait to listen. Mark is a true legend.

 

[cutlub]

I cannot believe how toxic things have become that people would personally attack Dan. It's shameful. Please don't listen to these miserable people, Dan.

I get everyone cannot stand Tim Cook, Apple Intelligence, AVP, Camera Control, 16e, every single thing Apple does. But aiming your vitriol at Dan and anyone here on MR is completely unacceptable.

 

[koolzero]

I remember hearing on a Scott Adams podcast, years ago, that because siri was so deeply embedded into ios/ipados, that it was very difficult if not impossible to improve it with the addition AI, that it would need to be drastically re-engineered. This was partly a reason for why he sold his Apple stock, maybe it was a bad decision to sell it but perhaps his understanding was correct. Then what was interesting was that not long after he said this, there started to be rumblings that Apple was working on their own AI, perhaps it was first stated by Tim "Apple" on an earnings call. It was likely to keep shareholders happy. This whole thing though is a fiasco, and if they just declared AI was coming to make the stock good, at the time, and now are paying the price, for overpromising, and also false advertisement. I think they should face harsh criticism over this and stop showing features that are not ready. I think Air Power (Apple Juice?) was the first big mistake, and now AI is another.

 

[JSRinUK]

For a moment I read that as a “19ft Mark Gurman”. Scared the life out of me! 😂

 

[Lounge vibes 05]

I think the most interesting thing about this podcast was a very quick Gurman remark that flew by.
When talking about the redesign of all of the operating systems in relation to bugs…
“the bug things is what you and I, we talk about on your podcast. That's what the MacRumors people talk about.
That's what we talk about on Twitter and threads and whatnot. Two billion plus people use these devices. Fewer than 1% of people are complaining about bugs.”

Another interesting remark regarding the new Siri lead:
“So here's the backstory. Rockwell has been one of Siri's fiercest critics within the company for years. He had been complaining to senior VPs and other executives at Apple for years that Siri is junk. It does not work. He wanted it to be a core part of the Vision Pro. It ultimately didn't become one.”

 

[TechTexan]

I cannot believe how toxic things have become that people would personally attack Dan. It's shameful. Please don't listen to these miserable people, Dan.

I get everyone cannot stand Tim Cook, Apple Intelligence, AVP, Camera Control, 16e, every single thing Apple does. But aiming your vitriol at Dan and anyone here on MR is completely unacceptable.

100% agree. All I see on social post is that people are turning off AI left and right. Who cares if it takes them longer to get it right.

 

[Mrkevinfinnerty]

Gurmy is much shorter than 19 feet according to people who are familiar with the matter.

 

[socialwill]

I have to think that Mark has some high-level execs that feed him information. Apple would have shut this down years ago, and somehow his reporting has been mostly on par. Some misses, but mostly correct. Microsoft and others are known to release information in back channels as to get the public reaction, and to help soften the waters before impact. I think Apple does the same thing, but with a very, very limited group of people.

 

[yanki01]

Oh man I love when the MacRumors show gets these huge guests, can't wait to listen. Mark is a true legend.

is this ChatGPT?

 

[johnsawyercjs]

I think the most interesting thing about this podcast was a very quick Gurman remark that flew by.
When talking about the redesign of all of the operating systems in relation to bugs…
“the bug things is what you and I, we talk about on your podcast. That's what the MacRumors people talk about.
That's what we talk about on Twitter and threads and whatnot. Two billion plus people use these devices. Fewer than 1% of people are complaining about bugs.”

Another interesting remark regarding the new Siri lead:
“So here's the backstory. Rockwell has been one of Siri's fiercest critics within the company for years. He had been complaining to senior VPs and other executives at Apple for years that Siri is junk. It does not work. He wanted it to be a core part of the Vision Pro. It ultimately didn't become one.”

It's interesting that the second Gurman statement you quote contradicts, in a way, the first statement--if the bugs in Apple OSs, including Siri, were so few that fewer than 1% of users are complaining about them, then it's unlikely that someone as high up at Apple as Mike Rockwell would be complaining so much about Siri.

 

[vegetassj4]

For a moment I read that as a “19ft Mark Gurman”. Scared the life out of me! 😂

Yeah, he's just a tad under 8'

 

[Lounge vibes 05]

It's interesting that the second Gurman statement you quote contradicts, in a way, the first statement--if the bugs in Apple OSs, including Siri, were so few that fewer than 1% of users are complaining about them, then it's unlikely that someone as high up at Apple as Mike Rockwell would be complaining so much about Siri.

Kinda but I think the problems with Siri go way further than “some bugs”.
The bugs he was referring to are like, the dumb ones people complain about. Like if you swing around the notification center, push the buttons and some order and do this that and the other thing your notifications come in as squares or something like that, stuff that really affects no one‘s day-to-day usage.

 

[mlayer]

I think the most interesting thing about this podcast was a very quick Gurman remark that flew by.
When talking about the redesign of all of the operating systems in relation to bugs…
“the bug things is what you and I, we talk about on your podcast. That's what the MacRumors people talk about.
That's what we talk about on Twitter and threads and whatnot. Two billion plus people use these devices. Fewer than 1% of people are complaining about bugs.”

Another interesting remark regarding the new Siri lead:
“So here's the backstory. Rockwell has been one of Siri's fiercest critics within the company for years. He had been complaining to senior VPs and other executives at Apple for years that Siri is junk. It does not work. He wanted it to be a core part of the Vision Pro. It ultimately didn't become one.”

It's interesting that the second Gurman statement you quote contradicts, in a way, the first statement--if the bugs in Apple OSs, including Siri, were so few that fewer than 1% of users are complaining about them, then it's unlikely that someone as high up at Apple as Mike Rockwell would be complaining so much about Siri.

It's all audience perception. Normies vs. fanboys for the first. Gurman's Rockwell anecdote is completely inside baseball and hopefully Rockwell is focused on solutions delivery. These are three distinct ways of looking at the problem. Within Apple, the ecosystem is so tightly integrated (HW+SW) that when everything works it appears like magic. When it doesn't work because part of it is buggy or incomplete, it shows far more severely than for most companies. So Rockwell was, despite his misgivings about Siri, rooting for its success. Now I suppose Rockwell could've been rooting for failure so that he could take over the unit. I doubt it. Vision Pro may have a longer tail than Apple Intelligence, which at its best is a feature, not a distinct product or platform. He was asked to take over a flailing effort, so he's going there.

 

[Seoras]

We're all on the outside looking in and saying, it's easy to make Siri good and do Apple Intelligence to a level where the field is just now.
On the inside I suspect they are struggling with executing while maintaining their user privacy standards but the big issue is the legion of lawyers ready to bring class actions against the world's favourite company to sue.
OpenAI is in trouble in Norway just now because ChatGPT told some guy he murdered his family.
Can you imagine the s**t Apple would be in for something like that?

AI is a loose cannon that is tricky to control. Small startups can risk it, big corps like Apple are more risk averse.

 

[John_Blackthorne]

Gurman's right in that broadly speaking, Apple Intelligence IS a flop. ChatGPT's proofreading and writing tools are far superior.

 

[John_Blackthorne]

I cannot believe how toxic things have become that people would personally attack Dan. It's shameful. Please don't listen to these miserable people, Dan.

I get everyone cannot stand Tim Cook, Apple Intelligence, AVP, Camera Control, 16e, every single thing Apple does. But aiming your vitriol at Dan and anyone here on MR is completely unacceptable.

Who's attacking Dan? What did Dan do?

 

[PowerButton]

I was out for a walk today. Had my iPhone 16 Pro (18.3.2) with me. I asked Siri a question. It quickly responded with a written answer. I asked Siri to read the response to me. Siri said it is unable to do that.

Switched to Copilot. Asked the same question. No written response. I actually ended up having a conversation with Copilot.

As an aside, I think the guy they used for Copilot's voice is the same guy Spotify uses for their DJ's voice.

I have the exact same gripe! You’d think Siri could handle something as basic as reading a response out loud, but apparently, that’s asking too much.

 

[ronno]

It's interesting that the second Gurman statement you quote contradicts, in a way, the first statement--if the bugs in Apple OSs, including Siri, were so few that fewer than 1% of users are complaining about them, then it's unlikely that someone as high up at Apple as Mike Rockwell would be complaining so much about Siri.

The first statement about bugs was concerning the whole OS in general. There are not that many people complaining about iOS instability.

The second comment was about Siri sucking, not buggy per se, but just not useful and behind the competitors.

 

[Expos of 1969]

Good show guys. Short but focussed.

 

[Mitochris]

I fully believe Apple was completely hit blindsided with AI. They are fully committed to hardware but have neglected software, including their OSs. I am struggling to come up with a software that is actually good or has been significantly improved/ developed further in recent years. Their office packages, pages, numbers, keynote haven’t seen proper love for years. Photo is good for sharing but not for editing. (They should never have killed aperture). Their OSs are incremental inclusions of new emojis, books and podcast apps are not the easiest to use, and from what was said on this site some time ago was that pros are moving away from Final Cut Pro. Instead we are getting toy stuff like genmoji. As I said on another thread. The distance between their hardware and software is massive and it needs to catch up. The competition is not sleeping.

 

[Piggie]

I felt he make an excellent point about apple maps and how it was ok as apple maps finally matched others.

You can't use that same logic with ai.

Maps were done and dusted 99% already by others, so apple had years to gradually get good enough to be equal.

But AI is totally different.
Many many other companies are advancing their own ai systems daily and lord knows how much more advanced they will be in 5 to 10 years.
Even 2 years from now!

Apple can't take a few years to try and get as good as others are today.

Others are not standing still as they were with maps. The race is up and running right now and if you are already at the very back a few laps behind simply running at the same speed will still leave you at the back of the race.