"Transition" Mac Mini - for creative purposes

[ConfusedPear]

Hi all,
Long time reader, first time poster. I’ll try to be brief.

My only computer is a 2010 15” MBPro. It has been my daily driver since 2010, and it runs smoothly (applied a new SSD and thermal paste). I have 2 different uses: at work (office, graphpad Prism, safari, spotify, the basic - i’m a researcher/PhD student) and at home (Capture One Pro - Sony, PS2020, GarageBand and more recently Final Cut Pro X). It can run all those programs, being only FCPX 4K editing/export and C1P export the main bottlenecks of this machine (as my patience can’t tolerate). My creative needs are not daily, but they are becoming more frequent.

I’ll upgrade for a new 14/16” MBPro when they rollout with miniLED.

Until there, I was thinking in getting a 2020 Mac Mini (i5 base spec with 512GB storage), adding it 32GB of RAM later. I know I might feel the need to get a eGPU, but I really want to see what those integrated graphics can do. Here in Portugal the cheapest option I can choose is from Amazon.es (atm), at 1189€. Even with the student discount applied in the portuguese Apple Store, the Amazon price is lower. And the used market for minis here is scarce… Full of 2011-2014, none from 2018-2020.

It will be my “transition” machine. I’ll be using it at home, for creative purposes, with my 4K TV. And keep rocking my MBPro at university/lab.

So… Do you think it is a honest idea? I mean, spending ~1200€ now and then 1800-2400€ when the 14/16” rollout will hurt. But having my hands tied (cause of hardware bottlenecks) may hurt more.

If you have another alternatives, please, shout out!

Thanks in advance.
(and sorry for english typos)

 

[Boyd01]

Welcome to the site... and I think your English is perfect!

I'm a bit confused about the new MacBook Pro you're wating for. Is this the completely different computer with Apple's new ARM cpu, or is it just the update to the Intel MacBook Pro? If it's the Intel computer, the current rumors suggest that it will be introduced by the end of the year - possibly in just a few weeks. Can't you just wait a little longer to see if these rumors are correct? Or is the Mini something that you plan to continue using after you get the new laptop?

See this:

"DigiTimes also said that Apple will launch multiple Mac notebook models with mini-LED backlit displays by the end of 2020, and Bloomberg's Mark Gurman said in April that Apple plans to introduce a 16-inch MacBook Pro in October or November, but it's not clear if this refresh features a mini-LED display."

MacBook Pro: Just Updated! Features, Buying Advice, and More

The current 14- and 16-inch MacBook Pro models feature the M4, M4 Pro and M4 Max chips, Thunderbolt 5 on higher-end models, upgraded cameras, and...

www.macrumors.com

 

[ConfusedPear]

Hi! Thanks you for your quick answer!

Yes, the MacBook Pros I'm waiting are the new ARM ones.
I've been a rumour consumer lately, so I'm consciously waiting at least until the end of November to push forward the Mini pathway.

I'll might consider getting a Intel-refreshed 16" one, but only if it has the miniLED screen. However, if I get a new Intel 16" MBPro, 6 months later I'll be looking after the new ARM ones... I guess.

Performance wise, I just need to do all the things I currently do and a smooth experience when using FCPX with my 4K footage (from a Sony A7RIII).

 

[weaztek]

I think it's all a good idea. I went well over a year without purchasing an eGPU on my i5 Mini. However, I am a photographer and found Photoshop wasn't performing up to my expectations with my massive photo files (and occasional gaming). Other than that the integrated graphics was fine (for watching movies, apps, everything else).

I managed to pick up an eGPU for $200 on the used market. A lot of gamers upgrade their graphics cards and boxes often. If you decide to get an eGPU down the road I'd definitely look to the used market because you don't need the latest and greatest card.

 

[ConfusedPear]

I think it's all a good idea. I went well over a year without purchasing an eGPU on my i5 Mini. However, I am a photographer and found Photoshop wasn't performing up to my expectations with my massive photo files (and occasional gaming). Other than that the integrated graphics was fine (for watching movies, apps, everything else).

I managed to pick up an eGPU for $200 on the used market. A lot of gamers upgrade their graphics cards and boxes often. If you decide to get an eGPU down the road I'd definitely look to the used market because you don't need the latest and greatest card.

Hi! Thanks you for your feedback!

Yes, Photoshop can really push integrated graphics with massive files... In my case, my RAW editing is mainly done in C1P, only using Photoshop to merge/stack some images when needed, and so far I can live with its performance.

For sure! For the eGPU option, if needed down the road, I'll begin looking for used ones. I've seen some around 400-500€ (RazerCoreX + Vega 64), which are very well priced.

Dou you have any feedback on FCPX 4K editing performance of your i5 MacMini? (I can live with somehow long export times).

 

[weaztek]

I haven't done any video editing on my Mini yet. If you plan to use Photoshop extensively and do video editing I'd start shopping for the used eGPU though. As a quick note, my Geekbench 5 graphics results with a relatively old, inexpensive RX 570 card are nearly 10x better than without the eGPU.

 

[ConfusedPear]

I see... 10x better results with a cheap RX570 are very appealing indeed.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind! AMD will launch some new Graphic Cards by the end of October, so more options will be available then 😀

 

[CC88]

I'm in the same boat.

I bought (it will arrive on friday I hope) a used i5 32gb 512ssd macmini for 700 euro to suite my needs (fcpx, lightroom, photoshop, affinity and a bit of 3d modeling in blender) waiting for a new desktop arm machine (or a new mbp 13 with new AS processor).

After thinking for a while it's the best option for me. Low price and discrete performance. In the future I can sell it for half the price but in the meantime I didn't buy a 2k euro and over machine without a certain future in terms of resale.

I would also buy an eGPU for FCPX and Blender but I'm not sure it will work on arm based mac.

 

[ConfusedPear]

Thanks for your feedback

You are in a almost similar situation I am. That 700 euro Mac Mini is a hell of a deal...! At that price, adding an eGPU would be almost mandatory. I'll wait to find one used as yours until the end of the year... But I guess they will eventually be priced higher, here where I live.

Yep, the eGPU will probably not work in a ARM mac, but I hope the graphical performance of those (13" and 14" MBPro) will be in line with the ones with dedicated GPUs (something like the 5300 in the current 16" MBPro), forgiving the eGPU need.

 

[ConfusedPear]

I'm in the same boat.

I bought (it will arrive on friday I hope) a used i5 32gb 512ssd macmini for 700 euro to suite my needs (fcpx, lightroom, photoshop, affinity and a bit of 3d modeling in blender) waiting for a new desktop arm machine (or a new mbp 13 with new AS processor).

Can you share some insight on FCPX editing/playback performance, when your mini arrives?

 

[CC88]

Can you share some insight on FCPX editing/playback performance, when your mini arrives?

Yes sure... Please note that my eGPU in case will be a sapphire nitro+ rx580 8gb + Razer Core X bacause I can have both for around 300 euro used.

Have only to wait the shipment.

 

[ConfusedPear]

Yes sure... Please note that my eGPU in case will be a sapphire nitro+ rx580 8gb + Razer Core X bacause I can have both for around 300 euro used.

Have only to wait the shipment.

Another good deal... Yes, I'll keep those specs in mind thank you again for your input!

 

[weaztek]

Yes sure... Please note that my eGPU in case will be a sapphire nitro+ rx580 8gb + Razer Core X

I think that will be a nice fit with the Mini. My RX 570 has good drivers but uses every drop of memory from it's 4 GB of VRAM. Something like a RX 580 is probably about perfect if it's supported (I haven't checked).

 

[CC88]

I think that will be a nice fit with the Mini. My RX 570 has good drivers but uses every drop of memory from it's 4 GB of VRAM. Something like a RX 580 is probably about perfect if it's supported (I haven't checked).

I think that based on egpu.io builds the razer core x and RX580 8gb is a plug&play process in macOS. Also the new MacPro 2019 has the RX580 as a starting point.

I will use it for FCPX/DaVinci and maybe GPU rendering. Will do some test with and without to see how it works.

 

[jayducharme]

I have a 2018 mini with the Sonnet 560 eGPU. I'm using a Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT in it. In order to boot the mini, I need an HDMI cable connected from the mini to my monitor. Once booted, I can disconnect it. I have the Radeon's Display Port connected directly to my monitor. I do a lot of 4k work in Final Cut. The mini (the i7 version with 32 gb RAM) performs okay. It's not as fast as my 2013 Mac Pro, which had less graphics horsepower. So I suspect it's an OS support issue with my Radeon. But generally, video clips render in half time (so a 20 minute clip takes about 10 minutes to render). Once rendered in FCPX, I can export them fairly quickly. I also work a lot with Blender, and that runs very smoothly. And I play some games, which all work well (and which were unplayable without the eGPU). So overall, I'm satisfied with the performance, and hoping the new OS will boost it a bit.

 

[CC88]

I have a 2018 mini with the Sonnet 560 eGPU. I'm using a Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT in it. In order to boot the mini, I need an HDMI cable connected from the mini to my monitor. Once booted, I can disconnect it.

Hi.

Is it a Sonnet behavior or all the eGPU's connected machines need to boot via hdmi?

Maybe today I finally can have my TB3 cable to work with my Razer Core X (finger crossed).

 

[jayducharme]

From what I’ve been reading on these forums, it’s an issue with the particular card in the eGPU. Some users have had better luck with the older cards, like the Radeon RX 580.

 

[Yebubbleman]

Hi all,
Long time reader, first time poster. I’ll try to be brief.

My only computer is a 2010 15” MBPro. It has been my daily driver since 2010, and it runs smoothly (applied a new SSD and thermal paste). I have 2 different uses: at work (office, graphpad Prism, safari, spotify, the basic - i’m a researcher/PhD student) and at home (Capture One Pro - Sony, PS2020, GarageBand and more recently Final Cut Pro X). It can run all those programs, being only FCPX 4K editing/export and C1P export the main bottlenecks of this machine (as my patience can’t tolerate). My creative needs are not daily, but they are becoming more frequent.

I’ll upgrade for a new 14/16” MBPro when they rollout with miniLED.

Until there, I was thinking in getting a 2020 Mac Mini (i5 base spec with 512GB storage), adding it 32GB of RAM later. I know I might feel the need to get a eGPU, but I really want to see what those integrated graphics can do. Here in Portugal the cheapest option I can choose is from Amazon.es (atm), at 1189€. Even with the student discount applied in the portuguese Apple Store, the Amazon price is lower. And the used market for minis here is scarce… Full of 2011-2014, none from 2018-2020.

It will be my “transition” machine. I’ll be using it at home, for creative purposes, with my 4K TV. And keep rocking my MBPro at university/lab.

So… Do you think it is a honest idea? I mean, spending ~1200€ now and then 1800-2400€ when the 14/16” rollout will hurt. But having my hands tied (cause of hardware bottlenecks) may hurt more.

If you have another alternatives, please, shout out!

Thanks in advance.
(and sorry for english typos)

If you're looking for a transitional system (and are coming from a 2010 15" MacBook Pro), I might recommend a high-end 21.5" iMac (with an SSD, not Fusion or Hard drive) or a 27" iMac from 2017 or 2019 sold on the Apple Refurbished Mac section of the Apple Online Store. That being said, I might also consider just biting the bullet and getting a 16" MacBook Pro and using it until it's naturally time to replace it, by which time the Apple Silicon versions will have matured. But if you're looking for an interim desktop to tide you over until the Apple Silicon 16" MacBook Pro comes out, I'd definitely consider a refurb 27" or high end 21.5" iMac (so long as you get it with an SSD and not a Fusion or hard drive). If it's a 21.5" iMac, I'd make sure it has enough RAM for your needs as upgrading that after the fact is not a fun endeavor at all.

 

[CC88]

Hi.

Here I am.

After some trouble getting a TB3 cable for my razer core x (amazon whareouse didn't tell is not included, but they gave me back 40 euro for that) I finally got time to test my system.

In the meantime I upgraded my mini to 32gb of ram for around 130 euro (it's another world than the previous temporary 8gb setup).

So, I'm using a Razer Core X + Sapphire Nitro+ RX580 8gb DDR5, MM 2018 i5 3Ghz with 32gb of Ram.

First thing first it boot with the Apple logo also using the eGPU connected via diplay port to my monitor without any problems.

Geekbench Single Core:
1091

Geekbench Multi Core:
5367

The multicore score is lower than my previous 12 core trashcan macpro, but the system feel more smooth and responsive than before (maybe due to the 40% higher single core score). Also in the MM switch I'm using Catalina 10.5.7 instead of Mojave.

I got a 33560 score in Metal under geekbench (can't find another test of a similar system to compare).

Got great results from Unigine Valley test higher than some other found on the net using the same system (maybe in the evening I will post the screenshot).

Played a little with FCPX and old clips (4K from a DJI mavic air and Osmo Pocket): it seems faster than my previous Macpro 6.1 12 core (64gb of ram and dual D700GPU). Background render is as fast as my previous MP6.1 if not faster (need some new clips to working on and doing a complete project. You know, working on a complete project is different than playing with a previous one).

Lightroom and Photoshop are blazing fast than on MP6.1: the eGPU is used by default and all is very very fast and smooth without lag. Zoom in and out in LR, working with presets etc is awesome. I'm very satisfied at how Lightoom and Photoshop work compared to my previous configuration. I was very disappointed at how Lightroom library was slow, but now it's amazing fast (I have my library in the same RAID0 as before).

If you need some tests, you have some questions please feel free to ask. I can do some tests that I haven't done and see how it goes.

The only thing I can't understand is that eGPU seems in a wake state despite my MM is in a stop state. All the disk are sleeping etc but not the eGPU. Asked in egpu.io forum if someone can help or it is a normal behavior.

 

[ConfusedPear]

If you're looking for a transitional system (and are coming from a 2010 15" MacBook Pro), I might recommend a high-end 21.5" iMac (with an SSD, not Fusion or Hard drive) or a 27" iMac from 2017 or 2019 sold on the Apple Refurbished Mac section of the Apple Online Store. That being said, I might also consider just biting the bullet and getting a 16" MacBook Pro and using it until it's naturally time to replace it, by which time the Apple Silicon versions will have matured. But if you're looking for an interim desktop to tide you over until the Apple Silicon 16" MacBook Pro comes out, I'd definitely consider a refurb 27" or high end 21.5" iMac (so long as you get it with an SSD and not a Fusion or hard drive). If it's a 21.5" iMac, I'd make sure it has enough RAM for your needs as upgrading that after the fact is not a fun endeavor at all.

Hi! Thanks for your advise. Yes, I only want SSD desktop/laptops. Never used Fusion Drives before, and I'm not using them anytime soon. My search began with used 27" 5K iMacs, but they usually have fusion/hard drives... Change those will require time, risk and somehow money I'm not willing to spend. Used 21" here are usually 8GB RAM configured, so it's a no to me. Refurbished Apple products in Portugal are only available from authorised retailers, not directly from Apple and still, the prices are not appealing. I'll wait to see how the first Silicon, hopefully arriving November will perform, and based on that I'll confirm the need for a Intel-based Mac until the Silicon 14/16" MBpros arrive or get mature... er.

 

[ConfusedPear]

Hi.

Here I am.

Hi! Thank you so much for coming back with your helpful walkthrough with your new setup!

Well, based on what you said, it seems a solid performer.

I mean, Photoshop/Lightroom editing experience looks very smooth - that's what matters me the most. How about the export times? Do they become lower with the EGPU connected? It could be another positive factor while deciding to get an EGPU later...

When you say "it seems faster" while playing with you 4K clips in FCPX, what are you referring to? The playback of those clips? The export time? Again, I prioritise the editing responsiveness and smoothness to export and render times. How about the playback with no EGPU? Too much stuttering?

Again, thank you very much for you input.

 

[ConfusedPear]

I have a 2018 mini with the Sonnet 560 eGPU. I'm using a Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT in it. In order to boot the mini, I need an HDMI cable connected from the mini to my monitor. Once booted, I can disconnect it. I have the Radeon's Display Port connected directly to my monitor. I do a lot of 4k work in Final Cut. The mini (the i7 version with 32 gb RAM) performs okay. It's not as fast as my 2013 Mac Pro, which had less graphics horsepower. So I suspect it's an OS support issue with my Radeon. But generally, video clips render in half time (so a 20 minute clip takes about 10 minutes to render). Once rendered in FCPX, I can export them fairly quickly. I also work a lot with Blender, and that runs very smoothly. And I play some games, which all work well (and which were unplayable without the eGPU). So overall, I'm satisfied with the performance, and hoping the new OS will boost it a bit.

Hi! Well, all great news

If the new OS boost the RX 5700s performance, those can also be good contenders for using as an EGPU. I'll be looking to some 580 or even some Vega 64 deals to keep the cost low, but always with an eye open for some newer card deals.
Thank you for your feedback!

 

[jayducharme]

No problem. Good luck!

 

[CC88]

I mean, Photoshop/Lightroom editing experience looks very smooth - that's what matters me the most. How about the export times? Do they become lower with the EGPU connected? It could be another positive factor while deciding to get an EGPU later...

Can you explain "export time"? I usually work on a single RAW file from A7RIII. I do landscape and nature photography, I don't have multiple batch work as wedding photography etc.

So I do basic adjust in LR and then export it to Photoshop for luminosity masking etc

I will go 1600 on the long side for web. Then I do some sharpening etc for printing on the full size.

When you say "it seems faster" while playing with you 4K clips in FCPX, what are you referring to? The playback of those clips? The export time? Again, I prioritise the editing responsiveness and smoothness to export and render times. How about the playback with no EGPU? Too much stuttering?

Had to do a new project from scratch. But, working on titles, adding transition, editing is very fast. It's smoother than my 6.1 Macpro. I think the eGPU give a real boost in FCPX work. I didn't try export. Same as you I'm not so interested in export time. But sure I'm interested in background render.

Will try to see how it works without the eGPU and report back.

 

[ConfusedPear]

Can you explain "export time"? I usually work on a single RAW file from A7RIII. I do landscape and nature photography, I don't have multiple batch work as wedding photography etc.

So I do basic adjust in LR and then export it to Photoshop for luminosity masking etc

I will go 1600 on the long side for web. Then I do some sharpening etc for printing on the full size.

Had to do a new project from scratch. But, working on titles, adding transition, editing is very fast. It's smoother than my 6.1 Macpro. I think the eGPU give a real boost in FCPX work. I didn't try export. Same as you I'm not so interested in export time. But sure I'm interested in background render.

Will try to see how it works without the eGPU and report back.

Yes: I usually do concert, portrait and even time-lapse (nature) photography and I organize everything by session. I rate and then develop the ones I feel good to go. Depending on the session, at the end I can have from 20 to >200 photos to export. I use C1P (Sony Express, I also work with a Sony A7RIII - mostly shoot compressed RAW) and export the full sized pictures almost every time. When I do time-lapses, then I'll have them cropped to 16:9 because of cinematic reasons. The last exportation I experienced, was a ~50 photos session, and it took around 30 min with my MBP at full blast (hot and fan-furious). Maybe it's normal, for a laptop this old.

That's the basic process. Sometimes I'll have some photos to fine retouch with PS.

Regarding video, it seems the EGPU is the way to go, not much to expect here... I'll wait to see your report then