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Two Hard Drive Questions and One Ram Question

A

Adros

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 3, 2009
54
1
So I've finally decided on a 2.93 quad core Mac Pro and I have a couple of questions that I was hoping the more experienced could help me out with.

Hard Drives
1. For the hard drive that is going to come with the computer, is $90 a decent upgrade price to go from 640GB to 1TB? While I know I can get 1 TB hard drives cheaper, I just feel like I will replace a 640GB hard drive to a TB anyways and $90 for a hard drive I will keep instead of the $180 that is built in which I will not use seems like the smart move.

2. I understand that keeping the OS on a faster hard drive will offer fairly significant performance boosts. Most of the 10000 rpm drives I have seen are about 150 GB or less, (like this western digital) and I want to install OS X and XP. It seems like splitting a drive this small to 75/75 GB leaves me with way to little space, even when storing most of my files on a different hard drive. Is it possible to have the OS on two separate hard drives, or do they both need to be on one? I really wouldn't mind just using two 10000 rpm drives if it gives me the extra space I need.

Ram
1. I definitely don't feel the need for 4x4gb ram sticks, so I will probably just go with either 3x2gb or 4x2gb sticks. I've tried looking over the posts here, as well as the linked articles to places like Barefeats, but I am lost on why you would not want to fill all the ram slots... just confusing me. :confused:

Sorry if the post is a bit long or dense, but hopefully someone can muddle through it.
 
1. No, definitely stick with stock and buy a terabyte for the price of the upgrade. You'll have about 1.5TB as opposed to .93.

3. Tri-channel RAM is faster than dual channel here. Apple left four RAM slots out, so we can't fill them all and have the "fastest" RAM.
 
Adros said:
So I've finally decided on a 2.93 quad core Mac Pro and I have a couple of questions that I was hoping the more experienced could help me out with.

Hard Drives
1. For the hard drive that is going to come with the computer, is $90 a decent upgrade price to go from 640GB to 1TB? While I know I can get 1 TB hard drives cheaper, I just feel like I will replace a 640GB hard drive to a TB anyways and $90 for a hard drive I will keep instead of the $180 that is built in which I will not use seems like the smart move.

2. I understand that keeping the OS on a faster hard drive will offer fairly significant performance boosts. Most of the 10000 rpm drives I have seen are about 150 GB or less, (like this western digital) and I want to install OS X and XP. It seems like splitting a drive this small to 75/75 GB leaves me with way to little space, even when storing most of my files on a different hard drive. Is it possible to have the OS on two separate hard drives, or do they both need to be on one? I really wouldn't mind just using two 10000 rpm drives if it gives me the extra space I need.

Ram
1. I definitely don't feel the need for 4x4gb ram sticks, so I will probably just go with either 3x2gb or 4x2gb sticks. I've tried looking over the posts here, as well as the linked articles to places like Barefeats, but I am lost on why you would not want to fill all the ram slots... just confusing me. :confused:

Sorry if the post is a bit long or dense, but hopefully someone can muddle through it.
Click to expand...

1) i'd pay the upgrade.
2) you can build a raid 0 array out of two drives to double the capacity (and also increase the speed) - just be sure to back up regularly.
3) average bandwidth goes down if you fill all the slots. However, despite what people say, I'd fill all 4 - the decrease in speed is nothing compared to the decrease in speed you'll get if you end up having to use virtual memory.
 
dukebound85 said:
because for 129 or even cheaper, you can buy a new 1tb hd and KEEP the 640gig one as opposed to spending 90 to just get the 1tb
Click to expand...

yeah, but here are his two choices:

1) $90, get exactly what he wants
2) $129 (or 85, or whatever), get what he wants plus something he has no use for

I mean, you can save money on beef jerky if you buy it by the metric ton, but that doesn't mean the extra beef jerky is of any use to you.

In scenario (2) he can spend still more money and get an enclosure (assuming he fills all four slots), ebay it, etc., but if he has no use for it, the hassle is probably not worth it.
 
why on earth would anyone pay 90 for the upgrade when they can spend 85 to get the 1tb in addition to the stock

your reasoning makes no sense at all sorry

more hd space is always better. its not as if the macpro only has 1 hd bay you know
 
dukebound85 said:
why on earth would anyone pay 90 for the upgrade when they can spend 85 to get the 1tb in addition to the stock

your reasoning makes no sense at all sorry
Click to expand...

Because if you don't have any use for the stock drive, it's nothing but a paperweight. A nuisance. Something for your wife to yell at you about. Hell, I would pay $90 to get my extra equipment out of the house if I could.

Why go to the hassle of reinstalling the OS, etc., when you can pay your $90 to apple instead of newegg?
 
cmaier said:
Because if you don't have any use for the stock drive, it's nothing but a paperweight. A nuisance. Something for your wife to yell at you about. Hell, I would pay $90 to get my extra equipment out of the house if I could.
Click to expand...

so paying more for less capacity is a good deal in your mind? its not like it takes any effort to order online from newegg

Why go to the hassle of reinstalling the OS, etc., when you can pay your $90 to apple instead of newegg?
Click to expand...

who really cares who you pay your money to:confused:

i dont give a rats a$$ for apple in the end. its all about what i want and what company can provide the best solution for the price

reinstall os? what are you talking about? you could use it as a time machine drive or as an extension to your main drive



OP: buy the newegg drive and ill pay for the shipping for your stock drive if you truly end up not wanting it. my feeling is he would find a use for it........
 
dukebound85 said:
so paying more for less capacity is a good deal in your mind? its not like it takes any effort to order online from newegg



who really cares who you pay your money to:confused:

i dont give a rats a$$ for apple in the end. its all about what i want and what company can provide the best solution for the price

reinstall os? what are you talking about? you could use it as a time machine drive or as an extension to your main drive
Click to expand...

I'm not suggesting there is a benefit to paying apple. my point is, who cares who i pay.

And he'd need to install the OS on the 1TB drive - Apple will install it on the stock drive which he will not be using.

And, sure, if he has something he can do with the drive (including giving it to you), and if he doesn't mind the hassle of having to move everything apple pre-installs to the 1TB drive he will be buying from another source, then yes, he may as well get the stock drive. The premise was he had no use for the stock drive.
 
Drive #2 Q.:

Yes you can manage both OS X and Vista within 75GB (each) very easily. Mostly all you have to do is move the "program files" and "applications" folders off to another drive. You can do this within the OS's themselves so it defaults to the location you want and assuming installer scripts will be pointed there or you can do it manually and try and point each installation to where you want it installed.

In OS X's case I would also try to do the same thing for the Users folder as iPhoto, iTunes, and etc. what to default to placing everything in there. :(

My Users folder is currently about 200 gigs and I've moved all significant data libraries out of there already.
 
I'd get the stock drive, then spend the $85 for a 1TB HDD. Since you are buying a mac pro, that 640GB stock drive isn't a useless paper-weight, but rather a perfect candidate for a Time Machine Drive.
 
Thanks for the responses guys, definitely helpful. I had not thought about using the 640 as a time machine device. That could be a great solution, especially since I may not install a second TB drive for a while. I also like the idea of using two 10000 rpm drives in raid 0, and the stock drive would be a good way of keeping the data safe.

As for the ram I suppose I will go for 3x2gb sticks and if I notice I need more I can put another stick in. Price from apple is $135, price from crucial is $149.99. Any other suggestions on where I may want to pick up the ram?
 
Adros said:
Thanks for the responses guys, definitely helpful. I had not thought about using the 640 as a time machine device. That could be a great solution, especially since I may not install a second TB drive for a while. I also like the idea of using two 10000 rpm drives in raid 0, and the stock drive would be a good way of keeping the data safe.

As for the ram I suppose I will go for 3x2gb sticks and if I notice I need more I can put another stick in. Price from apple is $135, price from crucial is $149.99. Any other suggestions on where I may want to pick up the ram?
Click to expand...

check macstore.com. They may be cheaper.
 
Adros said:
I had not thought about using the 640 as a time machine device.
I also like the idea of using two 10000 rpm drives in raid 0, and the stock drive would be a good way of keeping the data safe.
Click to expand...

As I understand it Time Machine is not a safety backup. It's more of a roll-back system so if your RAID dies Time Machine won't save you.

For RAM just use one of those price watcher sites. There's little or no actual difference between makers either. So just get the best price. Check CL, speed ratings, and warrantee period is all.
 
Tesselator said:
As I understand it Time Machine is not a safety backup. It's more of a roll-back system so if your RAID dies Time Machine won't save you.
Click to expand...

Is this for sure ? :confused: So all my macs on time machine are not securelly backuped but if my hdd dies those backups can not be pulled back onto new drive with all data ? OMG!
 
DrawingArt said:
Is this for sure ? :confused: So all my macs on time machine are not securelly backuped but if my hdd dies those backups can not be pulled back onto new drive with all data ? OMG!
Click to expand...

No, it's not for sure. I took the information off of maybe 4 different threads at the Apple.com forums. All top guys were saying unchallenged I might add, that TM was no replacement for an actual backup and pointed to all of the reasons why not. But then I read commercial articles like this one saying stuff like:

is brilliant when you think of Time Machine as a safety net. If you want to revert to an earlier version of a file you're working on or if you accidentally delete something, you usually know it very quickly. Having hourly backups means you can go back through your version choices easily -- it functions almost like a universal-undo feature. It also means that if you have a hard drive failure, you will have an extremely recent backup to restore from, and there will be almost no data loss.​

Since I haven't used it myself I can't say for sure just how much "almost no data loss" is nor just how easy/difficult it is to pull only the newest files and system settings, registration codes, etc. back out of it. As I understood it from those exhaustive threads it's just not a replacement for an actual back-up period. <shrug>

EDIT: I guess you could try it and then you'll know. Back up your smallest partition, format it and then do whatever TM is capable of. Compare the BU with the TM reconstruction.
 
Tesselator said:
No, it's not for sure. I took the information off of maybe 4 different threads at the Apple.com forums. All top guys were saying unchallenged I might add, that TM was no replacement for an actual backup and pointed to all of the reasons why not. But then I read commercial articles like this one saying stuff like:

is brilliant when you think of Time Machine as a safety net. If you want to revert to an earlier version of a file you're working on or if you accidentally delete something, you usually know it very quickly. Having hourly backups means you can go back through your version choices easily -- it functions almost like a universal-undo feature. It also means that if you have a hard drive failure, you will have an extremely recent backup to restore from, and there will be almost no data loss.​

Since I haven't used it myself I can't say for sure just how much "almost no data loss" is nor just how easy/difficult it is to pull only the newest files and system settings, registration codes, etc. back out of it. As I understood it from those exhaustive threads it's just not a replacement for an actual back-up period. <shrug>

EDIT: I guess you could try it and then you'll know. Back up your smallest partition, format it and then do whatever TM is capable of. Compare the BU with the TM reconstruction.
Click to expand...

Thnx mate, will have to investigate though ... hehe. I love TM but it should be also safety backup. Nevertheless I'm doing handly backup on extra drive for extra safety from now on ;)
 
Time Machine is safe. If your startup disk fails and you have to do a fresh install, you put the install disk in, do the install, then you will be asked if you want all your stuff pulled off your TM backup. Your data and preferences will then be transferred, and it's like you didn't skip a beat. You can "roll back to it", but it's more functional than just that feature. That's one option. That prevents you from having to do a reinstall and import from the TM backup. But if you can't roll-back, you can reinstall then import from TM too. It's pretty brilliant.
 
bozz2006 said:
Time Machine is safe. If your startup disk fails and you have to do a fresh install, you put the install disk in, do the install, then you will be asked if you want all your stuff pulled off your TM backup. Your data and preferences will then be transferred, and it's like you didn't skip a beat. You can "roll back to it", but it's more functional than just that feature. That's one option. That prevents you from having to do a reinstall and import from the TM backup. But if you can't roll-back, you can reinstall then import from TM too. It's pretty brilliant.
Click to expand...

Ok thnx for that, it sounds perfect.
 
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