What is the point of effort in workouts on the AW?

[DMG35]

Why does Apple ask for effort after a workout? It’s almost like they put it in there because other companies like Garmin use effort to track your recovery. I see nothing with the Apple Watch when I log effort every day. I get no notifications on it, nothing. So what is it there for?

I know with my Garmin watch the effort is tracked and they make recommendations on what to do following an intense workout but with Apple its like its there just to be there. What am I missing here?

 

[PatrickNSF]

Apple uses your self-reported Effort to calculate your Training Load.

 

[Grayburn]

As Patrick stated, you’ll find your Training Load in the Fitness app.

 

[doogm]

I spent about a month rating effort after each workout after I updated to watchOS 11 but now I don't bother. It tends to estimate itself now. My only issue with the rating is that (IIRC) they don't describe what they mean by "effort". What's a 1 vs. a 3? What's a 3 vs. 4 vs. 5? Etc.

 

[PatrickNSF]

I prefer the training load implementation in the Coros app (I export all of my workouts into it) but still keep effort ratings up to date in the Fitness app in case Apple improves it during the next iteration.

Also, I found this helpful –

 

[MarkX]

I spent about a month rating effort after each workout after I updated to watchOS 11 but now I don't bother. It tends to estimate itself now. My only issue with the rating is that (IIRC) they don't describe what they mean by "effort". What's a 1 vs. a 3? What's a 3 vs. 4 vs. 5? Etc.

It's using the RPE scale. Rate of perceived effort. 1 - 10, 10 being a max effort.

 

[azhava]

I spent about a month rating effort after each workout after I updated to watchOS 11 but now I don't bother. It tends to estimate itself now. My only issue with the rating is that (IIRC) they don't describe what they mean by "effort". What's a 1 vs. a 3? What's a 3 vs. 4 vs. 5? Etc.

The Rate of Perceived Exertion (RPE) Scale Explained

This blog will do a deep dive on how to monitor intense exercises by using the RPE scale method.

blog.nasm.org

 

[doogm]

It's using the RPE scale. Rate of perceived effort. 1 - 10, 10 being a max effort.

The Rate of Perceived Exertion (RPE) Scale Explained

This blog will do a deep dive on how to monitor intense exercises by using the RPE scale method.

blog.nasm.org

1. The Apple Watch and the fitness app IIRC does not do this. It just asks for a number rating with no explanation.

2. Reading that link I am still confused - what exactly is easy? What exactly is hard? What exactly is very hard? How do you tell the difference? Can the watch simply say that, say, if you are walking or running and cannot carry on a conversation that is is very hard, but if you can barely do so it is hard, and if you can easily do so it is easy? (And are those accurate statements? - I do not know.)

 

[azhava]

1. The Apple Watch and the fitness app IIRC does not do this. It just asks for a number rating with no explanation.

The watch automatically assigns a rating based upon the metrics it gathers from your workout. I guess maybe it assumes that if you're enough of an athlete to override its ratings and assign one manually, you understand RPE and would be able to discern whether your workout was light moderate, medium moderate or heavy moderate, etc.

2. Reading that link I am still confused - what exactly is easy? What exactly is hard? What exactly is very hard? How do you tell the difference? Can the watch simply say that, say, if you are walking or running and cannot carry on a conversation that is is very hard, but if you can barely do so it is hard, and if you can easily do so it is easy? (And are those accurate statements? - I do not know.)

It's all subjective. And if I had to scroll down through all that on the watch before assigning a rating, I'd 'X' out and say forget it. 🤣

 

[TTTedP]

1. The Apple Watch and the fitness app IIRC does not do this. It just asks for a number rating with no explanation.

2. Reading that link I am still confused - what exactly is easy? What exactly is hard? What exactly is very hard? How do you tell the difference? Can the watch simply say that, say, if you are walking or running and cannot carry on a conversation that is is very hard, but if you can barely do so it is hard, and if you can easily do so it is easy? (And are those accurate statements? - I do not know.)

“perceived” is the key word here. You decide how you felt.

 

[doogm]

Because of the two answers you guys just gave, I’ve turned off the notification of effort after a workout and I am no longer doing it. I have no way of saying subjectively if one walking workout is easy vs moderate vs hard when I also run and do interval bike workouts. Are they measured against that, or only other walking workouts? Is a running workout measured against an all-out sprint for very hard, and a walk is very easy, so any continuous run is at least moderate, or is it only measured against another run?

Because I spent a couple of weeks “measuring” my effort, yes, the workout app does assign an effort to some of my workouts, but not all of them. I just started doing yoga workouts this year, months after I stopped rating workouts, and they are never assigned an effort.

I think what I needed was not something that said after every workout “this is how you rate your effort” - I just needed one on-boarding that described what the watch was expecting in order to measure training load. Or, better, I would prefer it always just assign itself based on heart rate zones, length of workout, cardio fitness for the workouts where that is collected, heart rate recovery after the workout, etc., rather than ask the user to rate effort. Like cardio fitness, this should be a machine-learning model that is prepared for everyone. Let people override the automatic rating if they wish.

I’m not looking to argue with anyone about this - if it works for you, that’s great - I’m just saying that I find it incomplete and I think that it’s one thing that is not well-implemented by Apple and the watch regarding fitness, at least for me, and in my opinion.

 

[TTTedP]

Are they measured against that, or only other walking workouts? Is a running workout measured against an all-out sprint for very hard, and a walk is very easy, so any continuous run is at least moderate, or is it only measured against another run?

In my head, I tell myself the scale is inclusive of all workout possibilities, not relative to one workout type; walks/yoga > easy to moderate, runs/swims > moderate to hard, bike > moderate to hard. Even Garmin does it with little smiley faces("how did you feel?") vs assigning a # 1-10.

Maybe this year Apple steps it up to assign effort based on real metrics. IMO, Apple is dipping their toes (as they do) without having to face the criticism they know will come with using real scores (blogs need content after all). There are plenty of arguments elsewhere even with Garmin, etc where people debate the accuracy of sensors, algorithms, etc that go into those metrics. And in the end a lot of people say "FU, I know how I felt".

If you want a science based score on your AW, for now, use an app like HealthFit or Athlytic. Or just use RPE

 

[azhava]

...I think what I needed was not something that said after every workout “this is how you rate your effort” - I just needed one on-boarding that described what the watch was expecting in order to measure training load. Or, better, I would prefer it always just assign itself based on heart rate zones, length of workout, cardio fitness for the workouts where that is collected, heart rate recovery after the workout, etc., rather than ask the user to rate effort. Like cardio fitness, this should be a machine-learning model that is prepared for everyone. Let people override the automatic rating if they wish.

That's exactly what it does now. It assigns an effort level based on the parameters of the workout and you can either accept it or override it if you don't agree with it.

I very rarely override the level it assigns to my workouts. I may have bumped it one number either way a couple times, but I've never seen it assign a 'wtf' value that I completely disagreed with.