When getting a new MBP...

[shiato storm]

...New here but been lurking for a few weeks in lieu of the MBP releases. Now they're out I'm going to get one, vista doesn't appeal and I need a mobile solution. I'm a photographer and think apple offer more for creative people to be quite honest, over the other alternatives (though linux has some nice things too).
Anyway, given I'm not really a game player I'm guessing the 2.2/128mbVr 15" would suit me over the other...at least I'm of the belief video ram isn't a priority for image processing(!), correct me please if I'm wrong.
What I'm pondering is reading a few reports of people wiping their MB/MBPs as soon as they arrive and fresh install the OS. I thought this was usual practice for windows machines (need I go into the bloat Dells come with?!!) not macs. Please enlighten me on what the reason behind it is? what do you lose/gain from doing it other than a bit of extra hdd space?
[again an assumption but nonetheless notable - apple use 'works straight out of the box' as a selling point...curious about fresh install then]

 

[Trepex]

the expert consensus (and what my experience has been using macs at work) is that you don't need to do this. you can save some precious space later on by stripping some languages off if you get really tight. you're not getting a bloated dell machine

agreed. you don't need anything beyond the 2.2GHz stock MBP.

 

[mcbeej]

Actually, I have a question related to this. The Rosebook's come pre-installed with 10.4.9 - is it essential to run this version on these machines?

There are software compatibility reasons why I want to run 10.4.8 on there - is this ok or a bad idea?

Lastly, if I trash the 10.4.9 OS and install 10.4.8 from scratch, will I still be able to install and run the machine-specific software like Photobooth and Front Row? That stuff doesn't come with OSX by default as far as I'm aware...

Cheers,

 

[shiato storm]

the expert consensus (and what my experience has been using macs at work) is that you don't need to do this. you can save some precious space later on by stripping some languages off if you get really tight. you're not getting a bloated dell machine

agreed. you don't need anything beyond the 2.2GHz stock MBP.

thanks for clearing that up. maybe those who did it just fancied stripping the languages out first off...not a bad idea since I can't exactly speak a word of german, let alone read or write it!
Yep, will probably go for stock, more ram is always good but not at prices...!! will wait until it chugs and then up capacity for not very much. It wasn't long ago that 256mb cost the same as 1gb now...2gb sticks are still pricey but hoping that changes soon enough. Same goes for the 160 7200rpm drive (nuts!!)

 

[xpovos]

The fresh install is for hard drive space purposes only and has nothing whatever to do with performance issues of any kind. While OS X install discs come with a few, not many, demo programs, most people that do a fresh install do it to get rid of all the extra language packages and things like printer drivers they know they'll never use, etc. The pre-installed OS includes all of these extra languages and drivers, and that stuff can take up several gigabytes of disk space.

A fresh install is absolutely not necessary if you don't mind leaving that stuff on the hard drive.

As for performance, "it just works", etc., true true. Since OS X doesn't use a registry database like Windows does, the extra pre-installed software carries no risk of incurring a performance penalty on the system.

 

[coledog]

Actually, I have a question related to this. The Rosebook's come pre-installed with 10.4.9 - is it essential to run this version on these machines?

There are software compatibility reasons why I want to run 10.4.8 on there - is this ok or a bad idea?

Lastly, if I trash the 10.4.9 OS and install 10.4.8 from scratch, will I still be able to install and run the machine-specific software like Photobooth and Front Row? That stuff doesn't come with OSX by default as far as I'm aware...

Cheers,

10.4.9 is the exact same as 10.4.8 except with UPDATES (security and other) installed. Photobooth and Front Row come WITH OSX. No worries about not having them...

 

[shiato storm]

Since OS X doesn't use a registry database like Windows does, the extra pre-installed software carries no risk of incurring a performance penalty on the system.

thats all good to know. similarly if one were to swipe and reinstall is it a fairly straight forwards procedure - since I'll only ever really need english...what about things like this iLife I keep reading about - is that part of OSX or on a disk with all the stuff when you buy the machine?
just curious.

 

[mcbeej]

10.4.9 is the exact same as 10.4.8 except with UPDATES (security and other) installed.

Well, yeah, but 10.4.9 came with an prematurely updated AuValidation spec that broke a lot of third-party audio plugins, and for this reason I do not want to go to 10.4.9 at this time, until these compatibility issues can be sorted and I know I can rely on having my essential tools.

I just wanted to know whether there may be specific drivers/things in 10.4.9 designed to handle specific features of the Rosebook's, and thus 10.4.8 may cause problems.

Photobooth and Front Row come WITH OSX. No worries about not having them...

Ok, cool, thanks.

 

[Sopranino]

Well, yeah, but 10.4.9 came with an prematurely updated AuValidation spec that broke a lot of third-party audio plugins, and for this reason I do not want to go to 10.4.9 at this time, until these compatibility issues can be sorted and I know I can rely on having my essential tools.

That's interesting. I do a lot of Audio Production work myself, could you provide a list of the audio plugins that you are having problems with?

Thanks

Sopranino

 

[mcbeej]

*I'm* not having problems because I've stuck with 10.4.8

There was a lot of carnage when 10.4.9 was released with audio plugins that previously worked fine now mysteriously failing AU Validation and thus not showing up in AudioUnit hosts.

In fact, almost every other post in forums such as Apple's Logic forum was "How come my plugins don't show up?" followed by the response "Have you recently just updated to 10.4.9?" for weeks after the 10.4.9 release.

Many companies, for example Waves, were recommending users to not update to 10.4.9 at this time. I can't remember specific ones that I know broke, but there were quite a few - enough to cause problems.

Hence my concern at the new Rosebook's coming with 10.4.9...

 

[shiato storm]

will not 10.4.10 address this situation and correct it, given the amount of 'air time' its getting?

p.s again, just wondering - is iLife all part of osX or an add-on, in case one were to scrubb the HDD and reinstall...

 

[mcbeej]

will not 10.4.10 address this situation and correct it, given the amount of 'air time' its getting?

If you are referring to the 104.9 issue: No. It won't be "fixed" in new OS versions, because it's not a bug to be fixed.

The AUValidation is a specification that third-party audio developers have to check their plugins against.

Apple updated the spec to make validation checks tighter, but released it early (the new spec wasn't supposed to be put in until Leopard, but ended up prematurely in 10.4.9.)

This means that many plugs that previously passed validation and worked fine in 10.4.8 now did not pass the new tighter checks. It is up to the third-party developers to update their products to work with the new spec, but that takes time, and Apple kinda jumped the gun. And until then, the plugins won't validate in 10.4.9.

(It *is* possible to use them, but is a pain because it requires you to bypass validation and run plugs in unsupported incompatible modes and so on. I won't go into that.)

In any case, all that stuf is not the issue, my issue is whether the new machines *require* 10.4.9 for any reason, or whether 10.4.8 works fine. I guess I'll just have to try it when I get the new machine and see...

p.s again, just wondering - is iLife all part of osX or an add-on, in case one were to scrubb the HDD and reinstall...

iLife is not part of OSX, it is a separate product, but it is bundled with every Mac as far as I know...

 

[shiato storm]

(It *is* possible to use them, but is a pain because it requires you to bypass validation and run plugs in unsupported incompatible modes and so on. I won't go into that.)

ah, right I see...oh. well, gonna be a while for the others to catch up then isn't it. have apple released code to developers for drivers etc though?

iLife is not part of OSX, it is a separate product, but it is bundled with every Mac as far as I know...

cheers for info

 

[mcbeej]

have apple released code to developers for drivers etc though?

Yep. They said "Here is the new updated spec for Leopard. You will need to develop your plugins for this new spec. Leopard will be out October."

And then went ahead and launched that spec in 10.4.9, silently without mentioning it, in March (or whenever it was). And everyone's plugins broke.* Oopsies!

(* Well, everyone 'cept the smarts folk who did not rush out and immediately update their perfectly working 10.4.8 systems but instead waited for the great unwashed to do it first and report back if they experienced any problems. Which they, well, did... )

 

[shiato storm]

Yep. They said "Here is the new updated spec for Leopard. You will need to develop your plugins for this new spec. Leopard will be out October."

And then went ahead and launched that spec in 10.4.9, silently without mentioning it, in March (or whenever it was). And everyone's plugins broke.* Oopsies!

doh!