Why no usbc only hub / dock always this usb-a

[Jonas Danielsson]

I’ve been using only USB-C accessories for years now. Everything I use daily connects via USB-C keyboard, mouse, SSD drives, control panels like the Stream Deck, audio interface, iPhone, iPad, and more.

Of course, I still have a few USB-A devices, but they’re rarely used. For those, I’ve invested in USB-C to micro USB and USB-C to USB-B cables, so I can still connect them when needed. Most of those older items only come out maybe once a year, so it’s not a big deal. What matters is that all the devices I use daily are USB-C.

I’ve always wondered why no manufacturer makes a proper Thunderbolt dock or hub with only USB-C ports.


I get that people have different use cases, and there are many great options out there from companies like OWC and CalDigit. But even their high-end docks still include a lot of USB-A ports. Why not just release a version that’s fully modern, or at least offer two variants one with USB-A and one with only USB-C?

I don’t need high-speed ports for everything. A keyboard or MIDI controller doesn’t require much bandwidth. What I do need is more ports. Even with a Mac Studio, I’ve already filled all the rear ports, and I still end up having to swap devices regularly. And inalwasy has two few usb-c ports


So, is it just me? Or is anyone else wondering the same thing why hasn’t anyone made a Thunderbolt hub with only USB-C ports?

 

[PaulD-UK]

@Jonas Danielsson Both TB3 (Titan Ridge controller) and TB4 only have enough USB 3.x bandwidth to run one USB-C port at 10Gbps.

The idea of a string of USB ports in a hubs was inherently a USB-A thing, originating back in the day when four HDs wouldn't saturate a 4-port USB 3 hub...

The USB-A thread here in January ran to 13 pages in a few weeks with people decrying USB-A's replacement by USB-C...

I guess TB3/4 hub and dock manufacturer's have heard this ongoing cacophony, and used USB-A ports to share out the meagre bandwidth to bulk up their port count?

Only with TB5 is there the bandwidth to do things properly, and the basic nub of the matter is how many people will buy TB5 docks at TB5 prices to connect 'low-bandwidth' peripherals?

In the meantime the best suggestion is to try to find a TB4 hub/dock with extra downstream TB4 ports for high bandwidth peripherals, and extra USB-C ports sharing 10Gbps for low bandwidth stuff.

If any of your USB-C devices have stability problems when directly connected to the Mac, then use a TB3 dock with USB-C ports as that will have it's own USB 3.x controller which will work better than the Mac's internal USB 3.x controller in many cases.
It has to be a TB3 dock, as TB4/5 hubs and docks still use the Mac's USB controller.

 

[xraydoc]

Because if they did, people would complain that they've got this expensive dock and there's no USB-A ports on it.

The manufacturers have to make them with broad enough appeal to cover the most potential customers.

I'd expect though in a few more years, the number and availability of USB-A ports on some of these docks will diminish.

 

[joevt]

The Thunderbolt 4 chip from Intel has 3 downstream Thunderbolt 4 ports and 1 downstream USB 10 Gbps port. Therefore, most Thunderbolt 4 hubs will have 3 downstream Thunderbolt 4 ports and one USB-A 10 Gbps port. The CalDigit Element Hub adds a 4 port USB 10 Gbps hub to convert the one USB 10 Gbps port into four 10 Gbps USB-A ports. I think the Intel Thunderbolt 4 chip has a single lane of PCIe so a 7.877 Gbps PCIe device (such as a Gigabit Ethernet controller) could be added but at additional cost and it would not be usable when the Thunderbolt hub is connected to a USB (not Thunderbolt) host.

USB-C ports require extra chips to allow flipping the cable and have higher minimum power requirements compared to USB-A.

 

[theorist9]

I’ve always wondered why no manufacturer makes a proper Thunderbolt dock or hub with only USB-C ports.

Belkin makes a USB-C-only hub:

Connect USB-C to 4-Port USB-C Hub | Belkin US

Accelerate connectivity and productivity with this USB-C to USB-C Hub with 4 Ports from Belkin US. It's compatible with the MacBook, iPad, and Chromebook.

www.belkin.com

I personally like that docks continue to feature USB-A, since I use a modern wired gaming mouse for my office work, and those continue to be USB-A. That's also the case for many current high-quality wired keyboards.

This makes sense to me—why use a more expensive, higher-speed connection (and one that's also less robust) on devices that are inherently low-bandwidth?

Indeed, I think the only time it makes sense to use USB-C for mice and keyboards is on those specifically intended for use with laptops. Since most current laptops don't have USB-A, you'd want mice and KB's you can plug in directly.

And I think USB-A keys continue to be more common than USB-C keys, so if you need to plug one in, it's nice to have that port handy.

Even the new TB5 docks from CalDigit, OWC, Sonnet, and Kensington all have USB-A ports, indicating there's a strikingly uniform consensus among the manufacturers of those devices that these continue to have utility.