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With Tiger comes the demise of Camino

spaceballl

spaceballl

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2003
2,941
365
San Francisco, CA
With every release of Firefox, it becomes faster, more lightweight, and more feature friendly (extensions, themes, etc). Camino development has slowed to a crawl, with most of the developers having moved to firefox development. On top of that, Tiger's Safari is a lot faster than Panther's. GMail is now a pleasure to use and general surfing is great.

With Firefox's rendering engine being way ahead of Camino's and Camino development moving at a Snail's pace and Safari being much better, I don't see room for Camino in the mac world. I have a feeling this project will probably close down within a year.

And not that this is a bad thing at all... because like I said, with each iteration of Firefox, it is integrating better and better into the mac platform.

-Kevin
 
i don't think so. you're right that camino suffers from a dearth of developers. but i still like it. the optimized versions are much faster than safari 1.3/2.0 on my ibook g4, especially when opening multiple tabs simultaneously. camino doesn't have all the bells and whistles of FF and the mac integration of safari, but it's a nice little browser that i use 90% of the the time and which i hope will not go the way of the dodo.
 
See, I like Camino a lot too. I have its optimized versions. I feel like Camino really held a place in the mac world for the past couple years, especially even back when it was called Chimera. It is a gecko based browser w/ OS X native code. The problem is that developers have left like crazy... and aren't coming back. The project is moving at a snail's pace. half the develeopers that left went to go work on Firefox and help make it more mac friendly. With the right themes and extensions and firefoxy, Firefox looks almost as good as Camino. Camino is just a deteriorating project as of now. Firefox is the fastest moving proejct on the internet.
-Kevin
 
I disagree. As long as Firefox is still sucky on Macs (non-matching widgets, windows/linux-like GUI conventions, fake toolbars, no service support, etc... I could go on forever) Camino will still be alive. And since Camino is Cocoa, Firefox will never be able to get to the level of Mac-ness and GUI quality that Camino is at.
 
iindigo said:
I disagree. As long as Firefox is still sucky on Macs (non-matching widgets, windows/linux-like GUI conventions, fake toolbars, no service support, etc... I could go on forever) Camino will still be alive. And since Camino is Cocoa, Firefox will never be able to get to the level of Mac-ness and GUI quality that Camino is at.
Click to expand...

true but the next release is supposed to be more mac like.. 1.1 or maybe it's some future version. they are using cocoa in the mac version now for the buttons and all that. it's done in the skin.
 
Well, whatever happens, I'll be supporting the REAL Mac app here (Camino) and not the crappy port. I, for one, have very stringent requirements for my software. I hate Java apps and their non-standard interface for example - The only apps I'll tolerate being even the tiniest bit non-standard are the Apple pro apps and Blender. Anything else will not be accepted.
 
iindigo said:
Well, whatever happens, I'll be supporting the REAL Mac app here
Click to expand...
are people not realizing that this thing really is moving slowly, if at all? Camino is dead.

And the next firefox release is supposed to be cocoa. If you use Firefoxy right now, you can get nice widgets in firefox right now.
 
ill still use Camino if it is killed off, and i will probably never use FireFox unless some HUGE improvemens are made, i would just switch back to safari if Camino wouldnt/couldnt work for me anymore

i dont think Camino is going to die though, just slowed development in my opinion, but its still faster than any other browser out ther in my opinion
 
I think it's still hard to find a great mac browser..

for me, firefox is a bit buggy and a resource hog. I just find it a bit slurry..

safari is good, but it's incompatible with a fair few sites, sometimes it just stalls, i dont like the brushed metal. plus, the rss and page updating is annoying me - i just cleared my cache and restarted and im still seeing cached pages from thursday..

i think there's still a small market for these, because there will always be people like me who are fussy..hehe :)
 
spaceballl said:
Camino development has slowed to a crawl, with most of the developers having moved to firefox development.
Click to expand...

Actually Camino's development has picked up lately. Only one developer has left Camino recently, and he has been hired to work on things that will benifit both Firefox on the Mac and Camino.

I can see if you're basing your opinion off of the official releases, but the nightly builds are far superior to the official releases with many new features and bug fixes.

spaceballl said:
With Firefox's rendering engine being way ahead of Camino's
Click to expand...

Um... you do realise both use gecko? Like I said above if you're basing your comments off of the official realese then yes it is using an older version of gecko, but the nightly builds use the latest version.

spaceballl said:
I don't see room for Camino in the mac world. I have a feeling this project will probably close down within a year.
Click to expand...

That's what people said when Safari was released, but look it's still around. It still has a dedicated fan base, and it's developers are still slowly hacking away at it. It's not going anywhere.

spaceball said:
And the next firefox release is supposed to be cocoa. If you use Firefoxy right now, you can get nice widgets in firefox right now.
Click to expand...

Uh huh. And where did you hear this information? If Firefox was Cocoa then it would no longer be firefox because the point of Firefox is that it uses the same code on all platforms (like the original Mozilla did), so it uses XUL. If it were to stop using XUL then it would be... Camino.

If anything I'd have to say the Firefox on the Mac is the forgotten stepchild of Firefox on Windows and Linux. The development of Firefox for those two platforms seems to be a much higher priority than for the Mac.
 
just out of curiostity, where do you guys get your nightly builds from? the offical camino site? or do you have a different preference?
 
iindigo said:
I just use the nightly build link on the front page of http://caminobrowser.org/ -
Click to expand...


you should give these a try some time: http://camino.ilnm.com/

they are a little different than the regular Camino, the tabbing is different and more like safari, i cant decide which i like better, and im not sure if there are other nightly builds out there either

another side note: if i have a rev a powerbook 876Mhz what G4 do i have? 7400 or 7450?
 
PlaceofDis said:
you should give these a try some time: http://camino.ilnm.com/
Click to expand...

Yes, I highly recommend my builds as well :)

PlaceofDis said:
they are a little different than the regular Camino, the tabbing is different and more like safari, i cant decide which i like better, and im not sure if there are other nightly builds out there either
Click to expand...

They are the same as the official nightly builds except that they are optimized (meaning those new tabs are also on the nightly builds). It is only the official releases that have different tabs, but that should change with the .9 release.

PlaceofDis said:
another side note: if i have a rev a powerbook 876Mhz what G4 do i have? 7400 or 7450?
Click to expand...

Your system should have a 7410 which is considered a 7400 according to GCC
 
wrc fan said:
Yes, I highly recommend my builds as well :)



They are the same as the official nightly builds except that they are optimized (meaning those new tabs are also on the nightly builds). It is only the official releases that have different tabs, but that should change with the .9 release.



Your system should have a 7410 which is considered a 7400 according to GCC
Click to expand...

i knew someone here gave me the link :D, i didnt remember the other nightly builds having the tabs, but its been a bit of time since ive gotten to download one so thats my mistake, and thanks about answering which proc i have!
 
PlaceofDis said:
... and thanks about answering which proc i have!
Click to expand...

Actually I just re-read your post, you said you have a Rev A, but then you said you have a 867MHz... so if you have a Rev A it's a 7410, if you have a 867MHz then it's a 7455. The 867MHz would've been a Rev E since it was the 5th and last rev of the TiBook.
 
this makes no sense to me. why would a company like mozzilla make more then one mac web browsser?

why not just simply incorporate the best of both worlds into one "superbrowser"
 
wrc fan said:
Actually I just re-read your post, you said you have a Rev A, but then you said you have a 867MHz... so if you have a Rev A it's a 7410, if you have a 867MHz then it's a 7455. The 867MHz would've been a Rev E since it was the 5th and last rev of the TiBook.
Click to expand...

i should have been clearer, i have a rev a 12" AL book, which was at 876 Mhz, my mistake
 
biohazard_6969 said:
this makes no sense to me. why would a company like mozzilla make more then one mac web browsser?

why not just simply incorporate the best of both worlds into one "superbrowser"
Click to expand...


For two reasons:

#1: Different people have different needs/wants for their browser
You may want a browser that does everything but go to the bathroom for you, but I may want one that simply browses and does nothing more.

#2: to be completely compliant with whatever platform the browser's running on. There needs to be a mozilla-based browser native to the system. In this case, Cocoa is native to OS X, and that's what Camino uses. Mozilla, on the other hand, uses XUL and C++ which is certainly not native to OS X without Carbon (I loathe carbon... it still includes OS 9 resources *shudders*).
 
wrc fan said:
Hmm... I don't know why but I had 15" in my head. I guess I should have been able to put the Rev A and 867Mz together to figure out 12". :eek: Anyway, it's still a 7455.
Click to expand...

cool thanks again, for your answer and for your optimized builds!
 
The only reason I don't use camino is because the firefox extensions don't work with it. They also announced they have no plans to have firefox extensions working with camino. I just can't browse without adblock - those flash adds peg my processor.
 
nichos said:
The only reason I don't use camino is because the firefox extensions don't work with it. They also announced they have no plans to have firefox extensions working with camino. I just can't browse without adblock - those flash adds peg my processor.
Click to expand...

there are other ways of blocking ads you know besides adblock. when i browse i dont see any adds really....

for example check out this site http://www.floppymoose.com/
 
ok lots of weird crap being said here.

FireFox uses Cocoa ui elements now. They are using XUL but within XUL they have some compiled code that actually forces the skin to use cocoa ui elements. hence the firefox for mac skin is only usable in os x. go ahead, copy the skin over and try it on windows, guaranteed it won't work.

with that said, there are lots of improvements to be made, and they are being made. there's nothing stopping firefox from using cocoa ui elements even more, however those parts of the code will obviously only be available for the mac. the next version is supposed to be a lot more mac worthy.

i just don't like camino, tried it and it's very.. weird. some like it, i just don't. i use opera, firefox and safari on my powerbook, not in that order either. mostly safari though.

expect lots of mac updates in the next version of firefox.
 
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