Anyone interested in a Hi-def (1920 x 1200) mod for PB/MBP?

[noetus]

Have you? I wouldn't mind knowing what the timing settings you've been using are. I've discovered that the settings that worked for Leopard don't work in Windows Vista. It improves things (a lot - it's now usable), but doesn't make the color funkiness go away completely, and there is more flicker.

And here's a funny thing. Keeping the Front Porch, Sync Width etc constant, I tried varying just the frequencies. Guess what? As I lower the vertical refresh (with the other frequences changing accordingly) I notice that the lower the frequency, the better the colors - though the more there is flicker. The lowest it would work was at 19Hz (!!!) and color was almost perfect - but TERRIBLE flicker! Rack it back up to 60Hz (the default from the EDID) and the colors are way off, but the flicker has gone away.

What on earth is going on? Something in the PRAM is screwing everthing up, that's for sure. I think it IS a 60Hz panel, but for some reason setting 50 Hz in Leopard compensates in the right way (and there is no noticeable flicker).

But that trick doesn't really work in Vista. At 50Hz in Windows there IS flicker, and the colors are only so-so - quite a lot of banding.

So here are my timings in Mac OS, and it works beautifully there:

1920, 48, 32, 208, 60.996 (horizontal)
1200, 2, 6, 12, 49.997 (vertical)

But isn't good in Windows.

Next I'm going to try a PRAM reset and then boot into Windows just on the external, bring in the internal, and see what happens. It'll screw up the Leopard settings, but I know how to get those back now.

 

[mediapirate]

Out of the Loop

Sorry guys I had an emergency and was out of the loop there for a week. I updated to 10.5.1 as soon as it came out. I also have been trying to find ways to break the functionality of the screen without success. I have the matte screen and I have no banding issues to speak of. The process is fairly simple enough that I believe following the directions posted in the last two pages anyone should be able to get it to work. Finally, I tested using an external 1280x800 LCD instead of my 1080p tv and was still able to get the LCD working. I don't believe you have to use the same resolution external as you have for the internal LCD.

I do have to say the text is small but I've become comfortable using the control scroll to zoom in. This makes things much easier and watching full 1080p video's really makes the transition worthy of it's time!

MP

 

[noetus]

It's beautiful, isn't it? I was a long-time Windows user (since forever) and got a Mac specifically to try this hack. Now I've done it and I'm falling in love with the Mac...

(Won't be getting rid of the Vista laptop quite yet though, as I need the tablet functionality.)

Hope your emergency wasn't too serious, mediapirate.

Have people gotten Vista to work properly? Is there a fix I can try? I'm not too bothered because I think I'm going to be using VMWare's Fusion, not bootcamp anyway. But it would still be nice to have Vista working with normal colors and without flickering.

Bryanus? How is the Vista experience for you?

 

[bryanus]

Haven't installed Vista, and probably never will. I'm still waiting on a bootcamp fix to re-install XP.

 

[melmo]

Joined the club

Well, you guys inspired me. I finally managed to upgrade my Macbook Pro on the weekend with a Samsung rev 4 panel from Ztronics, OSX Leopard, and a 250 gig Western Digital hard drive. It took me a couple of months to receive the panel from Ztronics, and it's also been sitting at home for about a month while I pondered the risks of tearing my MBP apart.

Having this many pixels is awesome! The screen is not as bright as the stock panel, but I can live with that - I usually had my screen set to be fairly dim anyways. My only complaint is that I have a small half-centimeter in diameter bright spot on my screen, so I'm wondering if it's a factory second. I guess maybe that is how Ztronics manages to sell these lcd panels for so cheap (the panel did look new when I received it, still sealed in the electrostatic bag, no seals broken). Mine did not have the mounting clips that folks have been cutting/dremelling, so installation was relatively easy.

Removal of the original panel was a pain in the butt. Lot's of glue and double sided tape, however I took my time and didn't do any cosmetic damage to the MBP, it still looks brand new (and upgraded!).

I had to use an external monitor to install Leopard, and then I went and installed ATIinject.kext to get the panel going.

Anyways, thanks to everyone who's contributed to this thread, I feel like I bought a new laptop!

 

[koobcamuk]

This might be a really stupid question, I searched for it already, but can any mods at all be done with a 12" PowerBook (regarding screen)?

 

[whateverandever]

This might be a really stupid question, I searched for it already, but can any mods at all be done with a 12" PowerBook (regarding screen)?

None have been done here, though you're welcome to try.

 

[koobcamuk]

If someone could get me started -

Which display might be compatible?
It's 12.1" right?

Any other requirements?

I would love to give this a go... I just don't know if there are any high res screens out there!

 

[noetus]

Having this many pixels is awesome! The screen is not as bright as the stock panel, but I can live with that - I usually had my screen set to be fairly dim anyways. My only complaint is that I have a small half-centimeter in diameter bright spot on my screen, so I'm wondering if it's a factory second.

My screen also has a slight defect - slightly strangely shaped bright spot right at the bottom. However, it's really only noticeable when the machine is starting with the grey background. Once OS X is up and running it's not really noticeable.

There is also a slight spot a few pixels in diameter. It looks like some dirt or something is caught under there.

So yeah, maybe Ztronics is selling seconds. I'd still like to try an LG panel now that this is working in OS 10.5. They seem to be the best quality. Somewhat pricey, though.

 

[TheStu]

If someone could get me started -

Which display might be compatible?
It's 12.1" right?

Any other requirements?

I would love to give this a go... I just don't know if there are any high res screens out there!

I have been looking into this as well. I personally am not sure if the 12" PowerBook is using a 12.1" or 12" panel, but I do know that there are 12" panels (they are 12.1 IIRC) on ebay that have a 1440*1050 resolution, and some have built in Wacom digitizers. So, they are basically tablet pulls. However, if it is at all possible to get the digitizer to work under OS X, you now have a high resolution touch screen Mac. That right there is my ultimate goal for my 12" PowerBook... now i just need the cash to burn.

 

[koobcamuk]

I have been looking into this as well. I personally am not sure if the 12" PowerBook is using a 12.1" or 12" panel, but I do know that there are 12" panels (they are 12.1 IIRC) on ebay that have a 1440*1050 resolution, and some have built in Wacom digitizers. So, they are basically tablet pulls. However, if it is at all possible to get the digitizer to work under OS X, you now have a high resolution touch screen Mac. That right there is my ultimate goal for my 12" PowerBook... now i just need the cash to burn.

I can't seem to find any. If you can show me an auction or two, that would be great. Imagine having a tablet mac 12" PowerBook! Not sure what I would use tablet features for, but has to be cool!

 

[TheStu]

I can't seem to find any. If you can show me an auction or two, that would be great. Imagine having a tablet mac 12" PowerBook! Not sure what I would use tablet features for, but has to be cool!

http://cgi.ebay.com/LTD121KM1K-Tosh...ryZ42189QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

run a search for "12.1 sxga+"

 

[koobcamuk]

http://cgi.ebay.com/LTD121KM1K-Tosh...ryZ42189QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

run a search for "12.1 sxga+"

Ah, I searched UK.

You know what, it's not that expensive. Getting it to fit - that's the key.

If we can get one of these to fit inside the 12" PowerBook I would be amazed. 1440 resolution on a 12" PB? Beats the MacBook!

 

[lil'homunculus]

check this guy out...
http://www.fabiennemaurer.com/flo/tablet/

 

[bryanus]

OK, decided to try and install XP via BootCamp again. After a lot of cr@p and dealing with the "disk error" and "hal.dll" errors, I got it installed, and it don't look pretty. Colors are mucked up to hell. Leopard side is still working though. Since I access XP primarily via Fusion, I guess I didn't really need to install via BootCamp, but wanted to see how the colors would turn out, and if I'd break my screen. Thankfully it didn't.

 

[TheStu]

check this guy out...
http://www.fabiennemaurer.com/flo/tablet/

Well, that is interesting to be sure. The advantage for the others though is that they have the Wacom Digitizer already as part of the screen, so the hardest part there would be to figure out where to attach it. It is hopefully USB based, so you could theoretically connect it directly to one of the USB ports, but that would effective disable that USB port. It would be conceivable to somehow cram a small USB hub into the system (no idea where that could fit mind you) and then use that...

Or, you could conceivably find where the USB pins are located on the Southbridge, and with incredibly steady hands you could solder directly to that and of course other things for power and the like.

So, I reckon the best way to do it would be to (until an alternative could be found) solder it to one of the USB ports and then block that one off somehow. If you were to make it a pure tablet a la the ModBook, you could eventually trim the lid, put the screen in backwards and then pull the keyboard which would give you room for the USB hub.

This whole project feels terribly exciting to me... I wish I had the cash on hand to undertake it.

 

[noetus]

OK, decided to try and install XP via BootCamp again. After a lot of cr@p and dealing with the "disk error" and "hal.dll" errors, I got it installed, and it don't look pretty. Colors are mucked up to hell. Leopard side is still working though. Since I access XP primarily via Fusion, I guess I didn't really need to install via BootCamp, but wanted to see how the colors would turn out, and if I'd break my screen. Thankfully it didn't.

These were the same symptoms when I installed Vista. I have the same screen as you. I also got those errors when trying to install XP. I use Fusion as well, so am not too concerned about this.

I'd be interested to know if other screens would work better now that there seems to be a more general fix - especially the LG screen. I might get around to trying to use that screen at some point, but it is rather expensive (seems to be over $300 when I tried to source it online) and I've already sunk a fair bit of money into this project (most lately because I broke the inverter and had to get a new one - which fixed the buzzing noise by the way, I don't have that and all brightness levels work flawlessly with no noise).

I thought the colors were a bit washed out but then used Mac OS's built-in color calibration tool and it looks much better now.

 

[noetus]

... If you were to make it a pure tablet a la the ModBook, you could eventually trim the lid, put the screen in backwards and then pull the keyboard which would give you room for the USB hub....

I remember getting quite excited when I first saw the Modbook until I found out that the keyboard is missing! Technically that is a slate, not a true tablet...without the advantage of a PC slate (v. thin and light). I can't imagine giving up the keyboard for a stylus, especially if it comes at the cost of the size and weight of a regular laptop.

There is a youtube video of someone drawing on the Modbook and there seems to be a cripping delay between stylus input and the drawing response of the OS. That may be a generic issue with this sort of mod of the Mac OS, something to consider.

If/when Apple comes out with a Mac tablet, I do hope it is a proper tablet with a keyboard!

 

[bryanus]

Wait, so this screen has the Wacom built-in? That's really cool...hard enough to find a SXGA+ 12" screen already...

Other problem might be getting a compatible pen. I have had several Wacoms, and they don't work with each other.

http://cgi.ebay.com/LTD121KM1K-Tosh...ryZ42189QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

run a search for "12.1 sxga+"

 

[TheStu]

Wait, so this screen has the Wacom built-in? That's really cool...hard enough to find a SXGA+ 12" screen already...

Other problem might be getting a compatible pen. I have had several Wacoms, and they don't work with each other.

LTD121KM1K Toshiba Portege M200 with Wacom Digitizer Unit SU-019-X01

That's what the auction says... and also, almost every system I can find to buy new or old, ebay or otherwise, that has an SXGA+ is a tablet (ok, I think there was one Thinkpad that wasn't)... so, although they seem sort of rare, they all seem to have the digitizer.

 

[melmo]

Interesting... I guess it's good to know that I'm not the only one with a screen that has some issues... heh, sorry Noetus, misery loves company

So does anyone know have a source for cheap LG LCDs? Not that I could justify replacing the Samsung I have, but I think I'm pretty good at tearing apart the MBP now.

My screen also has a slight defect - slightly strangely shaped bright spot right at the bottom. However, it's really only noticeable when the machine is starting with the grey background. Once OS X is up and running it's not really noticeable.

There is also a slight spot a few pixels in diameter. It looks like some dirt or something is caught under there.

So yeah, maybe Ztronics is selling seconds. I'd still like to try an LG panel now that this is working in OS 10.5. They seem to be the best quality. Somewhat pricey, though.

 

[mediapirate]

Two working perfectly in Leopard

So, I have my two MBP working perfectly in Leopard but I haven't tried installing Windows, really it's a lack of necessity. I'm thinking about selling one of them as having them both doesn't make sense anymore. I feel comfortable selling them to a noob since I've tried every arrangement to break the configuration and none have succeeded thus far. Has anyone else had any problems with theirs? I think I'll setup B.C, install Vista and see how the LCD works in Windows before I put them up for sale.

 

[koobcamuk]

LTD121KM1K Toshiba Portege M200 with Wacom Digitizer Unit SU-019-X01

That's what the auction says... and also, almost every system I can find to buy new or old, ebay or otherwise, that has an SXGA+ is a tablet (ok, I think there was one Thinkpad that wasn't)... so, although they seem sort of rare, they all seem to have the digitizer.

Now I just have to decide whether it's worth it or not!

 

[noetus]

So, I have my two MBP working perfectly in Leopard but I haven't tried installing Windows, really it's a lack of necessity. I'm thinking about selling one of them as having them both doesn't make sense anymore. I feel comfortable selling them to a noob since I've tried every arrangement to break the configuration and none have succeeded thus far. Has anyone else had any problems with theirs? I think I'll setup B.C, install Vista and see how the LCD works in Windows before I put them up for sale.

I'd be really interested to know how you get on with installing Vista or XP on Bootcamp. I'm intrigued to know why it doesn't work anymore on mine and Bryanus'. Also if there is some way of getting it fixed. And do you have the 50Hz redirect on Leopard, or is it 60Hz?

I haven't seen any other issues except occasionally some flicker - I think only when the machine has newly started up - and which goes away almost immediately. I've been using the machine continuously for some days now, with lots of restarts and a good many sleeps.

So here is a site selling the LG screen for a not too bad price ($268 brand new, which presumably means no defects ). I notice there are actually three sub-models of this screen on this site, the K1, the K2, and the K3 - I wonder if there are any real differences (they are all the same price).

According to the specs I dredged up and posted some pages back (p. 26 - though I do not know if these are reliable) you should see an improvement in the contrast from 300:1 to 600:1, and an improvement in the response rate from 25ms to 15ms from the Samsung screen we're using. If that's right, it is almost worth the time and expense of doing the upgrade.... it would be interesting to see how noticeable a difference it would make to the subjective display quality. (The WUXGA LG screens are the ones used in the Thinkpad T61P, which gets pretty good reviews for the quality of its display.)

Wanna go for it?

 

[mediapirate]

Another test.

I guess I could but I'd rather wait till after the holiday's. I'm supporting another family member right now after an accident a couple of weeks back so I'm not lavishly spending on MAC hardware as I was. I'm also considering selling both my MBP's to buy a single MBP with LED LCD which will prevent me from further testing. We'll see but if I do I'll let you guys know in January.

MP

I'd be really interested to know how you get on with installing Vista or XP on Bootcamp. I'm intrigued to know why it doesn't work anymore on mine and Bryanus'. Also if there is some way of getting it fixed. And do you have the 50Hz redirect on Leopard, or is it 60Hz?

I haven't seen any other issues except occasionally some flicker - I think only when the machine has newly started up - and which goes away almost immediately. I've been using the machine continuously for some days now, with lots of restarts and a good many sleeps.

So here is a site selling the LG screen for a not too bad price ($268 brand new, which presumably means no defects ). I notice there are actually three sub-models of this screen on this site, the K1, the K2, and the K3 - I wonder if there are any real differences (they are all the same price).

According to the specs I dredged up and posted some pages back (p. 26 - though I do not know if these are reliable) you should see an improvement in the contrast from 300:1 to 600:1, and an improvement in the response rate from 25ms to 15ms from the Samsung screen we're using. If that's right, it is almost worth the time and expense of doing the upgrade.... it would be interesting to see how noticeable a difference it would make to the subjective display quality. (The WUXGA LG screens are the ones used in the Thinkpad T61P, which gets pretty good reviews for the quality of its display.)

Wanna go for it?