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The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,383
19,615
UK
There is no "normal" size. People are buying all kinds of sizes. Only the iPhone owners think something close to 4" is normal but that's mostly because Apple has clung to that size for too long. Even Apple recognizes it's time to shift so they are abandoning what was previously spun as "perfect" which, by the way, replaced 3.5" which was also previously spun as perfect.

As soon as Apple formally endorses these 2 new sizes, "we" will quickly shift our thinking about "normal" to these 2 sizes. I suspect we're only days now from more than few posts starting to refer to the current "normal" as "puny" and similar: "how did we every get by with such tiny screens?", etc

For the Android crowd who have models with screens bigger than 6", 5.5" may seem small and 4.7" may seem "too small". What is "normal" is very subjective.



Did they alienate a lot of customers with the original iPad Mini vs. iPad? How about the laptop lines? iMacs? It's "normal" for Apple to have differing specs in different-sized screens in most of what they make that have screens. Sure this is the first tangible model split for iPhone but it's simply following the lead of just about everything else Apple makes.

All these gripers will gripe right up until Apple rolls them out. Then, they'll jump on whichever one they want. A lot of this perceived alienation, etc will evaporate as soon as rumor is transformed into reality by Apple formally launching the products.



Have you gone out and actually seen bigger-screen smart phones or are you just basing this on your imagination? Some of the Android crowd own phones with 6" and bigger screens and aren't wearing "baggy MC Hammer" pants so they can pocket their phones.

You've sold yourself on 4.7" already. Per rumored size specs, the 5.5" is only 12mm wider (barely more than 1cm) and 20mm taller (2 centimeters, less than 1 inch taller). I made a relative sizing graphic a week or so ago to better illustrate the sizes of 5s vs. 4.7" vs. 5.5" vs. iPad Mini. Download & print it. Cut out the size you want and the 5.5" and lay one on top of the other to see how much real difference there is between the two. Here's the link to the PDF: https://www.dropbox.com/s/2lv2phny3oiytrf/iPhone6RelSizesWiPadMini.pdf?dl=0 What should be obvious is that the physical difference between 4.7" and 5.5" is not great, and- I think- once people can actually see both screens, the pre-launch decision that 4.7" is the ONLY way to go will shift for a lot of people.



$$$$$. People want bigger screens so bad they are choosing to forgo iOS for Android on bigger screens. Apple likes $$$$$ more than they like marketing spin. They simply use marketing spin to sell whatever they are offering as a current "perfect" to try to maximize $$$$$. 3.5" was the perfect size until they launched 4". Then, 4" was the perfect size until they launch these new ones.

Marketing spin is about selling what they have now. Changing is about going where the money is. Apple has a long history of flip flopping from very passionate, very public stances. See this article for some examples: http://www.techlicious.com/blog/5-big-flip-flops-from-apple/



I don't think so. At least for me, if the 5.5" ONLY differentiating feature was bigger screen, that would still be the one for me. Me aside, a lot of people are choosing Android over iOS because they want a bigger screen. An opportunity to get iOS on a bigger screen even if there was nothing else would likely entice a lot of that crowd.



They stop at about iPhone 10. By that point, the focus on thinning will have made the iPhone so thin it becomes invisible. I think the Apple faithful will still buy what will seem like an empty box once but then they'll be able to fake it that they have the iPhone 11 & 12 because their friends won't be able to see the iPhone anymore. ;)
Reason I left iPhone was due to screen size but that was before all the great features I found on the note. So for me to leave the note the added features need to be there. But that's just me. Others might not care about the added features.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Sorry, but thats moronic. 99,99% of the email I send and receive from mobile devices are three lines top! No need for a webpage or spreadsheet open by side to make refference, when there is a copy/paste function.



If you want even more nosense example of split screen usage, please reffer to Surface Pro ads where they are mocking the iPad for not having split screen functionality. The producers who actually dedicated serious time and effort to find any useful aplication of the split screen gimmick for this ad actually came with something that is beyond laughable.



I understand your primitive desire to have this funcionality on your iOS device but if you only check your mail outbox you will see that my observations and conclusions are beyond rational.


Why do you assume that your usage in any way resembles mine? 99,9 % of the email that I send from my mobile are rather complicated and usually always involve data from reports, spreadsheets, web sites etc. I get by, since I always carry two phones, so I can use the other one to pull up data and the other to compose the email.

And the Surface Pro 3 is the ultimate mobile workstation for me, now that you happened to bring that up as well.

Now, if you will stop assuming that what you do is what everyone does then we can start discussing what is rational.
 

Jimrod

macrumors 65816
Jun 24, 2010
1,199
659
There is no "normal" size. People are buying all kinds of sizes. Only the iPhone owners think something close to 4" is normal but that's mostly because Apple has clung to that size for too long. Even Apple recognizes it's time to shift so they are abandoning what was previously spun as "perfect" which, by the way, replaced 3.5" which was also previously spun as perfect.

While I completely get, and largely agree with your point - the 4.7" iPhone will be the biggest seller and the most usable as a phone, the 5.5" devices will be popular with some people, mainly techy types but when I say normal I mean the most common, popular size.

When it comes to one-handed use, putting in the pocket etc 5" seems about the max - I was trying it out recently as I was considering the HTC One M8 but it's just a bit too big to be comfortable in one hand, the HTC One was fine as was a co-worker's Galaxy S4 but those sizes seem to be the cut-off before you're into "Phablet" territory. Nothing wrong with phablets but I think calling them phones is a bit of a stretch, they're more an all-purpose media gadget. People look pretty odd making calls on them.
 
Sep 4, 2014
199
0
N/A
Protip: Put your camera in MACRO mode when doing videos this close up!! So painful knowing the whole video's going to be out of focus :cool:
 

Populism

macrumors regular
Jun 11, 2014
193
3,080
I have always wanted an iPad, but never needed one. So, I've never owned one. But I use the *(^* out of my iPhone. a 5.5-inch iPhone will be perfect for my needs.
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
This totally makes sense for 5.5" version because it's (if early rumor is true) is not simply a giant phone, but a iPad-cross over phone which also runs iPad apps, it definitely needs more battery for processing.
This 5.5" iPhone (if happens) will probably the most feared device for Android phone manufacturers.

Exactly, jack of all trades and really good at nothing. I think Apple will disappoint me by releasing a phablet tomorrow. I hope there is a non phablet iPhone 6. If not Apple lost my business of iPhone 6.
 

HobeSoundDarryl

macrumors G5
While I completely get, and largely agree with your point - the 4.7" iPhone will be the biggest seller and the most usable as a phone, the 5.5" devices will be popular with some people, mainly techy types but when I say normal I mean the most common, popular size.

You may be right but I have my doubts. I think the key qualifier is "usable as a phone", meaning for those that mostly use an iPhone for phone functions, the 4.7" will probably be more appealing. Then again, I'd argue that the 5s would be even more appealing as there will be no loss of phone functionality from 5s to 4.7" to 5.5". So if its about mostly using these as phones, I would think the 5s would continue to sell best (it will be smallest, most pocketable, lower (discounted as former model) price, and not lack in any way in terms of phone functionality)… nor sacrifice "one handed use" in any way :rolleyes: … nor require us to find pants with bigger pockets :rolleyes:

That said though, I observe that many people don't really use their iPhone as a phone as much; instead, it seems they use it as a mobile do-everything (else) device. For those using them for "everything else", they might make this decision more toward buying a pocketable iPad Mini rather than choosing between a smaller vs. bigger iPhone. And this iPad Mini Mini will be able to also make & take phone calls too- just like a classic iPhone. If so, the bigger screen of the 5.5" will make much of "everything else" more capable- for the same reasons people argue for iPads over iPhones.

So, my gut guess about sales goes like this:
For the crowd here at MR, the 4.7" will sell better than the 5.5". This crowd is so Apple-centric that they are thoroughly bought into marketing spin bullets like "one-handed use" so they are mentally stretching that to 4.7" so they can buy the latest & greatest from Apple while still clinging to spin points Apple was using back when 3.5" was spun as the "perfect" size. Much of this crowd will also be buying before they can actually see them in person, so they'll buy the one they imagine as best. Thus, I suspect the majority of the MR crowd will end up with 4.7" for this generation (though I suspect there will be a lot of second guessing once they get to actually see the 5.5" in Apple stores).

For the mass market, if the 4.7" and 5.5" are not differentiated by price, I suspect the 5.5" will outsell the 4.7" The mass market will choose the bigger screen which won't look that big through their eyes (accustomed to seeing even bigger screens in many Android competitors). And the Android crowd who would rather have iOS but can't tolerate a 4" screen will come back to iOS at 5.5" so they get both of what they want. I think much of the Android crowd will see 4.7" as "too small" from their perspective.

However, if the 5.5" comes out at $100 more (as rumored), I suspect the price difference will sway the mass market to favor the 4.7".

But in all scenarios, I personally think the 5.5" is going to sell much better than many here seem to think. "We" see it as huge because "we" are accustomed to 4" as "perfect". But the mass market will see it as "normal" relative to countless Android phones sized from 5" to more than 6".
 
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the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
i also hope there is a 5.5"
It seems lots of people hope Apple make a mistake like you do. It won't affect their bottom line but their reputation in my mind, making products that are jack of all trades and great at nothing.
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
"iPhone 6" is a lot easier to remember and to use than "iPhone 8th generation" or "iPhone late 2014 model". Even more so if there's 2 sizes available.
How many regular consumers (non-tech people) remember this stuff?

iPhone Air.

----------

4.7" is normal. 4" is child sized. 3.5" can only be normal for a small rodent.

In your opinion. No one complained the iPhone 1 was too small on the release day. It's a great size for most people. Normal for a phablet yes you are right there. But this an iPhone, not an iPhablet.

If Apple were to rename it iPhablet on the other hand . . .

----------

Any update planned for the 4" phone? ie any update expected for the iPhone 5s?

Nope. Apple loots to be abandoning it's loyal iPhone customers in favour of iPhablet wannabes.
 

SirLance99

macrumors 6502
Jul 15, 2011
385
36
Exactly, jack of all trades and really good at nothing. I think Apple will disappoint me by releasing a phablet tomorrow. I hope there is a non phablet iPhone 6. If not Apple lost my business of iPhone 6.

Prepare for disappointment. The 5.5" is going to sell well and is much needed for Apple

----------

It seems lots of people hope Apple make a mistake like you do. It won't affect their bottom line but their reputation in my mind, making products that are jack of all trades and great at nothing.

That's because you're thinking too small. There are tons of people who get the Note 3 because of the larger screen and they can do more.
 

DakotaGuy

macrumors 601
Jan 14, 2002
4,229
3,792
South Dakota, USA
It seems lots of people hope Apple make a mistake like you do. It won't affect their bottom line but their reputation in my mind, making products that are jack of all trades and great at nothing.

Why would making a phone with different screen sizes hurt their reputation? It's still the same phone just with an additional screen choice no different then the iMac, MacBook Pro or iPad.

Sometimes I wonder if some are upset with the possibility of a large screened iPhone only because they have made fun of large screen Android phones and they can't do it anymore if Apple releases one.
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
Prepare for disappointment. The 5.5" is going to sell well and is much needed for Apple

It will sell well. But it's not what Apple needs. Apple needs to make the best products. Phablets are the netbooks of the smartphone world.

I hate the word "expected" but yes I think I will be disappointed. Shaking my head tomorrow going "Apple, shane, you can do so much better". Hopefully the rest of tomorrow's keynote is great to make up for this mistake.

Such a "me too" product. Apple doing "me too" is never a good sign.
 

SirLance99

macrumors 6502
Jul 15, 2011
385
36
iPhone Air.

----------



In your opinion. No one complained the iPhone 1 was too small on the release day. It's a great size for most people. Normal for a phablet yes you are right there. But this an iPhone, not an iPhablet.

If Apple were to rename it iPhablet on the other hand . . .

----------



Nope. Apple loots to be abandoning it's loyal iPhone customers in favour of iPhablet wannabes.

Not one complained because the times were different and use cases were not as advanced as they are today. Stop thinking so small.

----------

It will sell well. But it's not what Apple needs. Apple needs to make the best products. Phablets are the netbooks of the smartphone world.

I hate the word "expected" but yes I think I will be disappointed. Shaking my head tomorrow going "Apple, shane, you can do so much better". Hopefully the rest of tomorrow's keynote is great to make up for this mistake.

Such a "me too" product. Apple doing "me too" is never a good sign.

Larger screened phones are nothing like netbooks. In a few more years all phones will be large screened phones, or at least the top tier ones. It's not a PHONE anymore. It's so much more than that.
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
Sometimes I wonder if some are upset with the possibility of a large screened iPhone only because they have made fun of large screen Android phones and they can't do it anymore if Apple releases one.

Nah, we just want Apple to make the best, and not "me too" just to satisfy the market. It happened with the iPad. The market wanted the netbook, but Apple said netbooks were useless and made the iPad. In the same vein, the people want phablets and Apple is not making a better products, they are (rumoured) to be just going me too. It seems Apple is not learning from the whole netbook vs iPad experience.
 

MacVista

macrumors 6502
Jun 18, 2007
303
2
OK, enough iPhone 6. Now I want iPhone 7.
Apple, you can skip this one already and save the shipping costs.
 

Jimrod

macrumors 65816
Jun 24, 2010
1,199
659
Nah, we just want Apple to make the best, and not "me too" just to satisfy the market. It happened with the iPad. The market wanted the netbook, but Apple said netbooks were useless and made the iPad. In the same vein, the people want phablets and Apple is not making a better products, they are (rumoured) to be just going me too. It seems Apple is not learning from the whole netbook vs iPad experience.

Sadly, at the risk of sounding like a typical MacRumors contributor - I think Apple have been gradually losing their way without Steve Jobs around to steer things. Jony Ive just wants everything thin, even if it doesn't aid usability (iMac), it's like he's been let off his leash but is blindly running in one direction without stopping to look around...
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
That's it. I'll keep my mouth shut after this. If Apple wants to go iPhablet, they can. Apple can swim in it's profits from doing so. But they will have lost some of my respect for doing so.

If Apple class the phablets as something totally different to an iPhone then I won't be too disappointed but then you have the whole issue of too many SKU's which is bad. But replacing the iPhone with an iPhablet but still calling it an iPhone? That's loses some of my respect for Apple huge time. And this is coming from me, who used to be one of those Apple fanbois who believed Apple post Jobs 2nd coming could do nothing wrong. The funny thing is they one who is proving to me that i was wrong and Apple can do wrong is Apple itself.

Folks, Apple can make mistakes. And at this point Apple need to do more than just up the profits. 150 billion or 200 billion in the bank, at those crazy amounts it doesn't matter any more. If product quality/design suffers then what's the point. This is one of those moments where Steve Jobs would have solved the issue. He would have said "Phablets are **** end of story. Go away and make something that satisfies the customers needs but is a good product." No one at Apple can say no like this at Apple anymore. And if trends keep going in this direction, it won't be good for Apple's reputation (in my eyes at least).
 

HobeSoundDarryl

macrumors G5
the8thark, I don't agree with much of what you've written in this thread. And I suspect like many who make similar arguments, once Apple endorses these rumors by making them reality with the launches, many like you will then "now that I've actually got to see one" their way to love the new sizes.

But, let's say that you are smarter than Apple and this crowd here that is countering your points: if so, then Apple abandoning the formerly "perfect" sizes of 4" and 3.5" gives the Android manufacturers a huge opportunity to flip too. In other words, they can vacate the 4.7" and 5.5" size screens and go where Apple is not at 4" and smaller.

And if there is this big crowd of people who feel as you do, then Android can take a huge bite of the market that don't want screens bigger than 4". What would happen if this played out? Apple would recognize it's "mistake" and the 6s would have a 4" screen variant.

That said though, I think this won't play out. Apple is not leaving 4" because they are stupid. They are following the money. Once people can get iOS on bigger-screen phones, even the segment of those people who think 4" is the maximum size will probably find their way to seeing 4.7" as the new "perfect". They already did that when Apple shifted from the old "perfect" of 3.5" to 4". Ahead of that launch were people much like you writing much like you've been writing about 4" being too big and much more: "abomination", "99% don't want", fragmentation, etc. Then, Apple rolled out the 4" and it was a ton of "shut up and take my money" and "best iPhone ever".
 

Markiie

macrumors 6502
Oct 10, 2011
473
213
Los Angeles, California.
You may be right but I have my doubts. I think the key qualifier is "usable as a phone", meaning for those that mostly use an iPhone for phone functions, the 4.7" will probably be more appealing. Then again, I'd argue that the 5s would be even more appealing as there will be no loss of phone functionality from 5s to 4.7" to 5.5". So if its about mostly using these as phones, I would think the 5s would continue to sell best (it will be smallest, most pocketable, lower (discounted as former model) price, and not lack in any way in terms of phone functionality)… nor sacrifice "one handed use" in any way :rolleyes: … nor require us to find pants with bigger pockets :rolleyes:

That said though, I observe that many people don't really use their iPhone as a phone as much; instead, it seems they use it as a mobile do-everything (else) device. For those using them for "everything else", they might make this decision more toward buying a pocketable iPad Mini rather than choosing between a smaller vs. bigger iPhone. And this iPad Mini Mini will be able to also make & take phone calls too- just like a classic iPhone. If so, the bigger screen of the 5.5" will make much of "everything else" more capable- for the same reasons people argue for iPads over iPhones.

So, my gut guess about sales goes like this:
For the crowd here at MR, the 4.7" will sell better than the 5.5". This crowd is so Apple-centric that they are thoroughly bought into marketing spin bullets like "one-handed use" so they are mentally stretching that to 4.7" so they can buy the latest & greatest from Apple while still clinging to spin points Apple was using back when 3.5" was spun as the "perfect" size. Much of this crowd will also be buying before they can actually see them in person, so they'll buy the one they imagine as best. Thus, I suspect the majority of the MR crowd will end up with 4.7" for this generation (though I suspect there will be a lot of second guessing once they get to actually see the 5.5" in Apple stores).

For the mass market, if the 4.7" and 5.5" are not differentiated by price, I suspect the 5.5" will outsell the 4.7" The mass market will choose the bigger screen which won't look that big through their eyes (accustomed to seeing even bigger screens in many Android competitors). And the Android crowd who would rather have iOS but can't tolerate a 4" screen will come back to iOS at 5.5" so they get both of what they want. I think much of the Android crowd will see 4.7" as "too small" from their perspective.

However, if the 5.5" comes out at $100 more (as rumored), I suspect the price difference will sway the mass market to favor the 4.7".

But in all scenarios, I personally think the 5.5" is going to sell much better than many here seem to think. "We" see it as huge because "we" are accustomed to 4" as "perfect". But the mass market will see it as "normal" relative to countless Android phones sized from 5" to more than 6".

I don't even think price matters in this day in age as much as you think......we live in a society where our phone rules our lives. For some, it's the best investment we make so I don't think 100 dollars is going to send anyone running to the hills. Not to mention most of the apple crowd hold their phone up with pride as a symbol of status.
 

jimbo1mcm

macrumors 68000
Mar 21, 2010
1,922
477
I went to the Galaxy S4 from the Iphone 4 to get a bigger screen and I liked it for a while. When I went back to the Iphone 5 and 5S I got used to a smaller screen very quickly because I like IOS. I then jumped to the LG G3 to get a bigger screen with 1080p, wireless charging and small bezels. I am ready to go back to the 4.7inch because I know I can get used to the smaller screen again very quickly. IOS is tough to beat. 1 day to go.
 
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