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Teardown of Apple's New AirPort Extreme Reveals Hard Drive Slot, but No Connectors

mdntcallr said:
Welcome to the new world where Apple cuts costs as much as possible even thought it is swimming in cash.

The same rational is why they refused to bother updating the Mac Pro for about 4 years... and the new one isn't exactly coming out until the fall.
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Or, alternatively and with slightly less tin foil involved:

1) Apple has used the same part because its primary function is to get some distance between the wireless antennas so would look more-or-less the same anyway.

2) The new Mac Pro isn't coming out until the fall because Intel hasn't made the Ivy Bridge Xeon CPU's yet! Not that hard really... As for why they didn't launch this with an earlier generation of CPU I'd suspect the cost of flash was the big problem, there's just no room to fit a hard drive and large amounts of fast PCIe-based flash has been both horrifically expensive and usually built around full-size PCIe cards. Oh, and they really need the increased bandwidth of Thunderbolt 2 to drive all the potential external devices they've highlighted and that isn't available until later this year either.
 
mdntcallr said:
The same rational is why they refused to bother updating the Mac Pro for about 4 years... and the new one isn't exactly coming out until the fall.
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or that intel didnt have the new Xeon processors they needed. but no, it was a big conspiracy to piss you off. thats it!!

yawn... the continuing tales of shipping something with parts of it obsolete gets boring.
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funny, ive had my current Extreme for many years of service. never found it obsolete until now. ill likewise feel the same about the new Extreme.

But this is what happens when accountants hidden in the backroom are really the ones in control of Apple.
Click to expand...

unless you work in corporate, you have no clue how apple operates. me, im going to take Cook's heartfelt and honest keynote speech over you, some dude on the interwebs.
 
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Henk Poley said:
Has anybody benchmarked the thing in terms of bandwidth?
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Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.

I just picked one up yesterday (a 2TB Time Capsule) and replaced my older Airport Extreme (generation before last) last night.

Now I know that the last gen AEs made a big thing about improved range and coverage too, so this may not be a fair comparison. But it's all I've got.

Previously, from my living room - which has almost line-of-sight to the router - I was getting about 50Mb/s from my internet connection (I haven't benchmarked the LAN speed - but I have a 100Mb internet connection so I was a long way short of that).

From my bedroom I would typically get only 10-20Mb/s.

With the new device I'm now seeing 101Mb/s from my bedroom!

This is from my rMBP, which has only 802.11n, so I seem to be getting full capacity from a historically awkward location - and, I believe, I'm not even taking advantage of beamforming (IIRC that's an ac feature?).

A single datapoint - but a happy one for me :)
 
hardwickj said:
Folks, this thing uses the BCM5301X SoC according to iFixit's teardown. That chip provides support for USB 3.0. So, this means one of two things:

1) Either Apple's documentation is wrong. If someone can get their hands on one of these and actually test it, we'll know.

or, more likely...

2) The BCM5301 supports up to 3 PCIe 1x lanes *IF USB 3.0 ISN'T BEING USED*. Otherwise it only supports 2 lanes. So the USB 3.0 takes up one of those lanes. I'm guessing something about Apple's design, whether it be the HDD (time capsule) or what not, requires that 3rd lane. The same board/firmware/etc is probably shared between AE and TC, so if the TC doesn't have USB 3, neither will the AE.
Click to expand...

This was my first thought when I saw the specs before the teardown. I figured that Apple had stayed with USB 2.0 because it had typically skimped on the SoC to push the data around. No point in shoving in USB3 ports, even if people were wiring up and expecting full Gb performance, if the system was not capable of handling that bandwidth.

So many people buy cheap wired NASes with Gigabit ethernet ports and wonder why data up and downloads rarely exceed 5MB/s when the ports suggest that data I/O should be faster.

I do, however, think that Apple deserves brickbats for the latest Apple Express, which only has 10/100 ports. My down speed from my ISP is 120Mb/s which the AEx caps according to speednet. I am pretty sure it is capable of pushing more if only it were not throttled by the WAN port.
 
locust76 said:
If you tip a hard drive over that's running you will destroy the drive and your data.
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ive never had that happen to any of my notebook hard drives when they slipped off the sofa. broke a power plug once, but never had my drive explode. possible? sure. guaranteed? nope.

The hard drive had your kid's baby pictures on it.
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since youd likely be using the TC as a backup volume, unless you simultaneous blow up your mac youll be fine.
 
MrCubes said:
Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.
Click to expand...

I've got the last non-GigE model now and don't get coverage in the furthest part of the house. Given your experience with a conversion from a more recent one I'm really tempted to pick one of these up.

B
 
downpour said:
Fair enough, so what's the point of having one?

Presumably 802.11ac isn't going to make your internet browsing any faster.
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.ac offers better range and speed. if you have a large house or tried to browse in the backyard, youll appreciate that. likewise w/ airplay audio streaming from one part of the house to another.
 
moo083 said:
Currently I use my Airport Extreme with a plugged in external drive as a Time Capsule. Did Apple by any chance eliminate our ability to do that with this new version or is that feature still in tact (despite not being officially supported)?
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We were discussing that in this thread earlier. The Apple KB previously explicitly excluded the Extreme for USB Time Machine backup. But the new version of that same KB2421 (screen below) does not differentiate USB drive use between the Extreme and the TC. So perhaps they are now supporting Time Machine to external USB on the Extreme?

41vrBZu.png
 
Not Impressed

Still only 1 USB port. So I can either connect my printer or an external HDD. That's my biggest complaint about my current AP-EX. FAIL.
No USB3. That should be standard on all USB devices. It's called Future Proofing. FAIL

I expect that very shortly aftermarket places will offer "upgrade" deals to add a HDD. I mean everything but the plug is there. It shouldn't be that hard.
 
Bobtodd said:
The real reason all 3 of these are the same design is to save manufacturing costs. why spend money on tooling for 2 differnt products when you can save money by tooling for all 3. its down to basics COST.
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no. the new Extreme is .ac, just like the new TC. the optimal antenna design they came up with is putting antennas up top...thus the height. why would they do it differently for the Extreme vs the TC? theyre both .ac devices and utilize the same antenna design.
 
MrCubes said:
Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.
..
This is from my rMBP, which has only 802.11n, so I seem to be getting full capacity from a historically awkward location - and, I believe, I'm not even taking advantage of beamforming (IIRC that's an ac feature?).
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info. 101Mb/s of effective download speed is about max from 802.11n as far as I know. btw, 802.11n had some optional beam forming (TxBF) in the specs, but it was specified too loose to be effective and compatible between vendors. Which might mean that Apple to Apple (Broadcom to Broadcom) there is beamforming. Especially possible with recent hardware, such as the retina MacBooks.

For example the Broadcom BCM43xx in the plastic MacBook Mid 2010 does not have TxBF (on any OS). The more recently used Atheros AR5BXB112 does, but might be incompatible with Broadcom in the Airport Extreme.
 
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mdelvecchio said:
then you should have no problem accepting that because thats exactly what they said in the keynote about this device. and from their site:

"With the antennas at the top of the elevated design, AirPort Time Capsule now has a higher platform for dispersing the signal. "

did you watch the keynote video? their intro video also specifically said they design things for purpose, not just for the sake of change. why do you doubt it? why would they lie to you?
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Thanks, I didn't watch the video. I take MR forums comments as gospel! :)

As it is, my TC is currently behind my TV and "kinda" accessible by the kids. So my wider, shorter version cannot be tipped over by a stray ball (that should not happen in the first place, but kids...)

At least, if I have to replace it, it wouldn't be as bad as when I got a Kinect...
I drew the line at having to build an extension to my living room so that my couch would be farther so that the Kinect would work well... I returned it.

With a new AEBS/TC, I could place it somewhere else...
 
When Apple makes beautiful products at the expense of features, people criticize Apple for valuing form over function.

In this case, however, Apple has changed the design to engineer a much superior wireless router. Now that they put function over form, people are STILL criticizing Apple.

While we all want nice looking devices, and this certainly still is agreeable, let's not forget that it's still a router. That's it's main purpose.
 
MrCubes said:
Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.

I just picked one up yesterday (a 2TB Time Capsule) and replaced my older Airport Extreme (generation before last) last night.

Now I know that the last gen AEs made a big thing about improved range and coverage too, so this may not be a fair comparison. But it's all I've got.

Previously, from my living room - which has almost line-of-sight to the router - I was getting about 50Mb/s from my internet connection (I haven't benchmarked the LAN speed - but I have a 100Mb internet connection so I was a long way short of that).

From my bedroom I would typically get only 10-20Mb/s.

With the new device I'm now seeing 101Mb/s from my bedroom!

This is from my rMBP, which has only 802.11n, so I seem to be getting full capacity from a historically awkward location - and, I believe, I'm not even taking advantage of beamforming (IIRC that's an ac feature?).
Click to expand...
Support for 802.11n beamforming is vendor specific.

From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11ac#New_technologies

Other elements/features

Beamforming with standardized sounding and feedback for compatibility between vendors (non-standard in 802.11n made it hard for beamforming to work effectively between different vendor products)
...
Click to expand...
So it is possible that “older” 802.11n devices (rMBP, MBA, ...) support beamforming.
 
MrCubes said:
Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.

I just picked one up yesterday (a 2TB Time Capsule) and replaced my older Airport Extreme (generation before last) last night.

Now I know that the last gen AEs made a big thing about improved range and coverage too, so this may not be a fair comparison. But it's all I've got.

Previously, from my living room - which has almost line-of-sight to the router - I was getting about 50Mb/s from my internet connection (I haven't benchmarked the LAN speed - but I have a 100Mb internet connection so I was a long way short of that).

From my bedroom I would typically get only 10-20Mb/s.

With the new device I'm now seeing 101Mb/s from my bedroom!

This is from my rMBP, which has only 802.11n, so I seem to be getting full capacity from a historically awkward location - and, I believe, I'm not even taking advantage of beamforming (IIRC that's an ac feature?).

A single datapoint - but a happy one for me :)
Click to expand...

Can you determine if the new model makes a buzzing sound when you're running that 100 Mb/s speed test? The previous gen made a buzzing/sizzling sound when under heavy load, and if that problem has been eliminated it will spur me to upgrade to the new one.
 
Seriously? It needs a FAN??

I've lost count of how many devices I've had that died because some $0.50 fan quit after a year or two. I can't believe that a router needs a fan. :(

I've maxed out all the ethernet jacks on my current AEBS. For me to buy this one, I'd still have to keep the old AEBS (or another router) around to give me all the ports I need.
 
WilliamLondon said:
What are all of you doing around your homes<big grin>, dancing the Mexican router dance around these devices, while holding glasses of wine, carefully, so as not to spill *those*?? :rolleyes:

I'm getting one of these. I've got a gen 1 airport extreme I'd like to upgrade once my new MBA arrives - hoping to see some connectivity and throughput improvement in this new device (which will reside where the current one resides - out of harm's way, on a shelf in the corner, at the back, near the wall, it is wireless after all!).
Click to expand...

I am considering it as well. I have a gen 1 TC. It works great but looking for a little speed improvements. I might get this but the TC version.
 
all other comments aside one of the big wins on the time capsule is that we can now open the thing up and put our own hard drive in easily.

I'm quite looking forward to buying one, and know that I don't have to live with the rubbish fujitsu drives that kept failing on my past time capsules with a decent datacentre level drive without having to 'crack' the case open with palette knives and the like.

I'm optimistic.
 
MrCubes said:
Well, not really a benchmark, but my personal experience has been very promising.

I just picked one up yesterday (a 2TB Time Capsule) and replaced my older Airport Extreme (generation before last) last night.

Now I know that the last gen AEs made a big thing about improved range and coverage too, so this may not be a fair comparison. But it's all I've got.

Previously, from my living room - which has almost line-of-sight to the router - I was getting about 50Mb/s from my internet connection (I haven't benchmarked the LAN speed - but I have a 100Mb internet connection so I was a long way short of that).

From my bedroom I would typically get only 10-20Mb/s.

With the new device I'm now seeing 101Mb/s from my bedroom!

This is from my rMBP, which has only 802.11n, so I seem to be getting full capacity from a historically awkward location - and, I believe, I'm not even taking advantage of beamforming (IIRC that's an ac feature?).

A single datapoint - but a happy one for me :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the information. I've got the 4th generation Extreme that was an Apple refurb, and have been waiting to upgrade. I seem to get bottlenecks from time-to-time and I'm hoping that the new Extreme/TC will fix the problem. Think I'll get the 2TB Time Capsule this time instead of using an external drive for Time Machine.
 
downpour said:
Fair enough, so what's the point of having one?

Presumably 802.11ac isn't going to make your internet browsing any faster.
Click to expand...

People always want the top of the line, fastest product even if they have no use for it. You're right, it's not going to increase browsing speeds for anyone. It will increase speeds of data transfer from computer to computer across the wireless network but thats about it.

The Airport Extreme is meant to be a general consumer product with some use for small business. Consumers have no real use for NAS (some believe they do but it's always been overkill in every situation I've seen and those that it's not, they aren't a consumer, they're doing commercial work at home).
 
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