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About 95% negative reviews here on styling will change to 95% "beautiful" due to the mindf**k that is about to blitz the "popular culture" (selling propaganda experts masters of manipulating all of us - I fall to it too especially regarding automobiles). But at least I'm a little bit aware of what's going on. It's fascinating to watch.

WTF is a "fashion expert" ROTFLMAO!!! Is there a school for that? State licensing!?!

There are fashion and design schools. But, hey, laugh it up!

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I like the look of it and like all the customization options. What will prevent me from buying the first gen is how heavily it relies on iphone. If it had standalone GPS (so it could replace my garmin watch) and/or cellular then I'd probably be interested. As it is, I don't see the big draw since I'd have to have my iphone on me for almost all purposes. But the flaw is not in the design, from my perspective.

How long does your Garmin watch lasts will GPS turned on and collecting data? From other people I heard, not long at all.

So, those things cannot really be called watches. For devices that can be worn all day and work, GPS is too much of a battery sucker. Its even a battery sucker on a phone which has a 6-7 times bigger battery.

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Chips are easy and cheap to mass produce. You can't mass produce a mechanical watch.

Any random factory worker can put together a battery, chip and touchscreen to make a smart watch but making a mechanical watch requires skill and years of practice.

And I don't know about the S1 chip but the most simple chip is definitely not more complex than an entire mechanical watch

You can absolutely mass produce a mechanical watch. If there was a market for it; you'd see much much lower prices and much bigger volumes.

It would be all assembled by robots of course.

There's nothing exceptionally hard about producing a watch; precise automated casting, machining has existed for awhile.
 
I'm about as interested in British Vogue editor Alexandra Shulman's opinion of the Apple Watch as I am in Tim Cook's opinion of Autumn hemlines.

LOL. Everything today is thoroughly modern …

They're perfect for an Oscar nominee's gift bag.

Apple Watch as a gift

Perhaps my metaphor was too cryptic. The iPod Nano is to "Apple Watch" as iPod Classic is to iPod Touch.

The form factor, shape, and basic aesthetic is the same, while significantly improving fit and finish, not to mention a quantum leap in functionality. Its not a stretch to see it:

Rewind nine years. With an iPod Nano, "… You can do it all without looking. …".

I'm not yet convinced that for its intended/imagined purposes, Apple Watch can be so intuitive. There's a faint odour of "we're doing it because we can"; not because a wristwatch is the ideal device for all of those purposes.

Before we leave 2005: did Madonna sit on a drawing pin?

… the watch must be functional on its own …

Yeah, I'd prefer something that's not so limited when it's without an iPhone.

40 years ago watches were prized for their slimness. Current fashion watches are frequently 12mm thick. There is no reason whatsoever that they need to be this thick as digital movements are tiny. But, fashion rules and current fashionistas are all running around with gigantic watches on their arms. So Apple really isn't that much out of step in the thickness wars.

I'm unashamedly ignorant of fashion trends. When I love the appearance of something, I don't over-analyse the reasons for that love; the thing is rarely trendy.

In the 1980s, probably before I cycled down through France, I got myself a Seiko 5 automatic with the days either in French, or alternating French/English. Similar or identical to a 7009-3100:
attachment.php

I loved it but after around two decades of terribly rough treatment by me – I don't know what I did, but parts of the case looked as if they had been struck with hammers – parts began separating from the dial. The movement remained perfect but eventually, after a clumsy attempt to fix the dial, I had to throw it away. To find a matching photograph took maybe three hours (most of which was spent looking for the wrong brand – Sekonda (Russian)).

Nowadays just occasionally I wear an old Timemaster. An online image was almost impossible to find until I discovered that Timemaster was a Fritz Wolf brand … there was one on eBay a few months ago, probably this –
attachment.php

– the photograph doesn't do justice to the style, so imagine the Seiko below – but with a winder, a date, magnifying crystal above the date, and more discreet hour markings:
attachment.php


If I were to choose something now, it would probably be this Vulcain Centenary automatic:
vulcain_swiss_auto_date_men__s_ss_watch___vintage_1_lgw.jpg

– minimalist.

on the money....All this is just the Apple hype machine at work. … Pretty sure we gentle folk are being brainwashed …

:cool:
 

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You can absolutely mass produce a mechanical watch. If there was a market for it; you'd see much much lower prices and much bigger volumes.

It would be all assembled by robots of course.

There's nothing exceptionally hard about producing a watch; precise automated casting, machining has existed for awhile.

You can roboticized mechanical watches but you won't get the detailing. There are cheap mechanical watches. Seiko at $80-$150. Full automatic.

I'm not knocking Seiko but it doesn't have the craft. It sure beats the $500 Michael Kors quartz. But the higher finish watch require detailign by hand. the polished circular details.

See the zig-zag. That is done by hands.
grieb-benzinger-Blue_Danube-tiffany.jpg


The circular sand, polish. Again by hands

cal315_sil_prwl.jpg


Also, robotic assembly would not be able to place the microscopic balance screws. If it could, FoxConn wouldn't need manual labours to assemble iPhones.

Many Swiss cases and certain parts are machine made but requires human assembly and tuning.
 
Is this the first time Apple makes a codependent product? I can't believe you'll need an iPhone for the Watch to work. That's DOA right there. I wanted the watch because I love working out and I thought it would have some sort of cellular functions but instead they introduced an iPhone accesory. They need to remove that limitation, the watch must be functional on its own or else no one will buy it.

It works alone, it runs apps, collects data from sensors, resync this data (and data you entered) back to the phone, its just more usefull with a phone. I can also take notes, play music, look at photos and probably play videos all by itself.

It is for its communication functions that it needs the phone (and for the GPS).

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You can roboticized mechanical watches but you won't get the detailing. There are cheap mechanical watches. Seiko at $80-$150. Full automatic.

I'm not knocking Seiko but it doesn't have the craft. It sure beats the $500 Michael Kors quartz. But the higher finish watch require detailign by hand. the polished circular details.

See the zig-zag. That is done by hands.
Image

The circular sand, polish. Again by hands

Image

Also, robotic assembly would not be able to place the microscopic balance screws. If it could, FoxConn wouldn't need manual labours to assemble iPhones.

Many Swiss cases and certain parts are machine made but requires human assembly and tuning.

Still, it doesn't matter. Say 90% robot assembled with 10% in a Foxcon like factory. The end result would be mass assembly anyway. If there was a market for that many mechanical watches, they would be made.
 
Square design and bringing back the click wheel? I can't imagine how using that dial is better then straight up multi touch.
 
What a moronic statement. With all due respect to Swiss timepieces, there is more "complexity" in a square millimeter of the "just a chip" in this watch than an entire mechanical Swiss watch. 21st century complexity vs. 19th century complexity...

A Chip is usually C-A-D. Computer assisted. They're not designed by a single person. They require software, engineers, groups,etc. Yes, it is an engineering feat.

But there are some watches that are simply mind-blowing to build. You have a single guy with no computers, putting together a bunch of rotors, balances, screws, to make a movement that can run 200 years; tell you the date/time. Phases of the moons. It handles the leap years, the calendar dates accounting for February 28 and. It knows when it was a full moon phase in the year 2322 or 1999. It will tell you if it was a saturday or tuesday on March 31, 1999 or April 5th in the year 2567 and the moon all at the same time. Oh, what Chinese lunar year was in there too!

MoonlightSpecial_14.jpg


Can an Intel engineer do that with just a bunch of wheels, microscopic screws, and rotors? If you say yes, then I see your point. It isn't that easy to design and then assemble.
The INTEL engineer would need to know how to balance the wheels, align them. In fact, he would need to know how to actually fabricate a 1mm circular wheel with teeths by hand. Apply the right pressure of the balances and springs so it doesn't run to slow or to fast. It would have to be +/- 1 sec accurate out of 8,640 a day. Do all this with no dremel or modern tools.



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Still, it doesn't matter. Say 90% robot assembled with 10% in a Foxcon like factory. The end result would be mass assembly anyway. If there was a market for that many mechanical watches, they would be made.

The Foxconn assembly person won't have the skills to assemble. It isn't that easy for a 19 year old kid to work on a microscopic level. I can't event hold a saw the size of a pen and move it 1 mm in circular fashion. Can you? IT takes years for some Swiss employee to move up the rank and gain the skills from cleaning rotors, to hand winding springs.

Some mechanical watches take as long as 2 years to build by hands.
 
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Remember when first opinions were from tech sites?

Not really? I don't see any other tech sites reviewing fashion products... do you?

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Ion hardened glass, whatever that is.

Ion implant.

They blast the glass with charged particles to modify it. It usually only applies to the top few microns of the glass, and with enough energy you can bury the ions below a thin layer of glass as it shoots through the glass.

And to be honest i'm surprised Apple did this. This process is usually reserved for chip manufacturing and is expensive.
 
I've been giving this product a LOT of thought, simply because Apple tends to sneak up on you with the familiar but ends up blowing you away sometimes.


A wearable device is the equivalent of jewelry. There's styles for men, and styles for women. This skews heavily toward the latter, in my opinion. It's nowhere near neutral, which is a trend I see in Apple products of late, particularly after Steve's passing.

Maybe it was always there (rainbow iMacs, iBooks), but now it just seems more prominent to me.

This style was always there. Because stereotypically rounded, easy to use and fun is seen as "female; not sure why exactly. Same cultural stereotype is what keeps women out of STEM fields.


Apple is obviously, and always has been, a women :).


Things that have painful edges, are ornery to use and make you look like you eat concrete for lunch and are as much fun as a colonoscopy are obviously masculine.

They should put razor blades around the edges of the watch to make it more masculine ;-).

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Remember when Apple products were tech products?

The core of Apple is not tech, it is design; tech that adapts to life not the other way around.

There's always has been a personal aspect about Apple, how it fits the person is important to its identity.

They had the colour computers while everyone else had the beige towers. That should tell you something.
 
A Chip is usually C-A-D. Computer assisted. They're not designed by a single person. They require software, engineers, groups,etc. Yes, it is an engineering feat.

But there are some watches that are simply mind-blowing to build. You have a single guy with no computers, putting together a bunch of rotors, balances, screws, to make a movement that can run 200 years; tell you the date/time. Phases of the moons. It handles the leap years, the calendar dates accounting for February 28 and. It knows when it was a full moon phase in the year 2322 or 1999. It will tell you if it was a saturday or tuesday on March 31, 1999 or April 5th in the year 2567 and the moon all at the same time. Oh, what Chinese lunar year was in there too!

Image

Can an Intel engineer do that with just a bunch of wheels, microscopic screws, and rotors? If you say yes, then I see your point. It isn't that easy to design and then assemble.
The INTEL engineer would need to know how to balance the wheels, align them. In fact, he would need to know how to actually fabricate a 1mm circular wheel with teeths by hand. Apply the right pressure of the balances and springs so it doesn't run to slow or to fast. It would have to be +/- 1 sec accurate out of 8,640 a day. Do all this with no dremel or modern tools.



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The Foxconn assembly person won't have the skills to assemble. It isn't that easy for a 19 year old kid to work on a microscopic level. I can't event hold a saw the size of a pen and move it 1 mm in circular fashion. Can you? IT takes years for some Swiss employee to move up the rank and gain the skills from cleaning rotors, to hand winding springs.

Some mechanical watches take as long as 2 years to build by hands.

You obviously haven't seen the woman on those assembly lines at work (not just at apple). In the early 1960s, woman were cabling integrated circuits by hand at TI (before they adopted the Fairchild process); that's very very small detail work.

But hey, think whatever you will. Doesn't matter anyway. Mechanical watches are a niche. Interesting, but not for most people.
 
you know you've hit bottom when u find urself arguing which company has the best smartwatch. if this is the priority then we live n a sad, boring and aimless world. maybe time for apple to retire, guessmtheyve seen and done it all, nothing left to see here..
 
I agree with you (also as a watch collector). The Apple Watch is not for me but I can see the appeal for others.

I am also having a greater appreciation for Ives; considering the design constraints and target goals of this project. The Moto 360 is simply too divisive of a design; regardless if it appeals to you. It does not account for the other half of the population - woman. Also all the pre-Apple mockups I've seen like the Chronograph case does not work for many people. Again, as they are tailored specifically at a specific genre and profile.

Seems like this post was lifted from a post I made earlier. I saw all the Fashionista responses in my trending Twitter and Instagram.
Their opinion is what the general public will go with. Nerds on tech forums do not represent the majority opinion.

The Milanese bracelet is sublime. I was very much in shock with the attention to detail. The sapphire is slightly elevated with a 1 mm chamfer. Theere is also a chamfer around the crown.
The matte grain weave of the SS bracelet is very well done. The Milanese bracelet simply wow. Omega sold a similar bracelet for $600 back when I was looking.
I said it before and I'll say it again. Apple is not competing against Google/Motorola/Samsung here. Nor are they competing Polaris and Garmin.

They're targeting the mid range premium "mall watches" The ones in the department stores from the $300-$1200 price point.
Those watches are driven bases on fashion and brand cachet. The Michael Kors, Movados, Burberry, Armani, Calvin Klein. These brands, like Apple, have zero horological pedigree.
They sell $50 watches for $400-1000 and reap insane profits. This is the "premium" market. It doesn't compete with the luxury market - Rolex, Blancpain, IWC.
In the Premium market, fit-n-finish and presentation is everything. There is no doubt, Apple nailed it in terms of build quality.
There is also a premium market for accessories. Panerai's straps are a cottage industry into itself where people pay up to $300 for just a leather strap.

If Angela (I don't know her name) does her job, I can see where she can pull her connections to have one-offs and collab pieces in just straps. Burberry Apple Wear straps are coming. They already make iPhone cases.

Fashionista Sarah Collette already gave her approval and she has lot of weight in the Fashion circles. From her Instagram.
Image

Whoa. It is HUGE. And that band. I thought it looked nice from a bare front picture.
 
It. Is. NOT. It's water "resistant", and Apple recommends not even taking a shower with it. That's a far cry from a typical watch in that price range that is water resistant to 50 meters or more.

When was the last time you dove to 50 meters?
 
About 95% negative reviews here on styling will change to 95% "beautiful" due to the mindf**k that is about to blitz the "popular culture" (selling propaganda experts masters of manipulating all of us - I fall to it too especially regarding automobiles). But at least I'm a little bit aware of what's going on. It's fascinating to watch.

WTF is a "fashion expert" ROTFLMAO!!! Is there a school for that? State licensing!?!

Omgosh, you are hilarious and so right on the money... and yes I am victim to it too. hahaha
 
I think it is needlessly to thick and "chunky". The thickness is almost 1/3rd of the length.

Apple missed an obvious opportunity to place the battery inside the wristband. Why not use a flexible battery of even a thicker buckle to hide a battery
 
Chips are easy and cheap to mass produce.

Cheap?

Producing a "chip" requires a fab line containing several billion dollars worth of semiconductor processing equipment.

The mask set (tooling) to produce a chip for any design today costs many millions of dollars. Make a mistake, and it may cost another multi-million dollar mask set. A bit more expensive than dropping a watch gear wheel.

And that's after 2 to 5 years of chip design, often involving a building full of PhDs for the design and the tools, and before the chips are tested and assembled into any product.

Not easy.
 
I'm wearing a $3,000 Tag watch currently because I love the quality and the look of the watch. It's 100% mechanical, which means a $10 Timex watch keeps time more accurately... but that's not why I wear it.

I usually wear my Pebble on the weekdays (at work) and my Tag on the weekends. Being able to see a ton of info without whipping my phone out in a meeting etc is priceless.

If Apple can make an experience better then the Pebble AND it looks classier then I am sold.

The only question I have is what is the release cycle/price points... I buy a new iPhone every year and a new Mac every 2-3 years. Is the Apple Watch designed to be something I replace every year with a new model or keep for 5 years? Obviously it will eventually be thinner, and have more features, but if the mid range model with a metal band is $500+, thats going to be a bit of a pain to try to swap out every year or two.

I guess I just can't wrap my head around that. I mean IMHO only I feel like I get the same if not a very similar looking watch for like $100 - $200 at Kohls. In fact I've seen some very beautiful watches for even less than $100. Tempting but I don't wear 'em anymore just simply can't take the weight of 'em, tightness around my wrist, and how hot it gets around there being wrapped so closely to my skin. Just not my thing anymore.

Watches were the iPhone in the pre-21st Century. Everyone had to have them. I just don't understand why today except for fashion but even your cheap watches look good as a fashion statement. Again my humble opinion, not knocking you if you believe otherwise. Seriously, I don't care that much.
 
The Apple Watch will sell more than the iPad initially did.

It looks great, and people love it.

Not more than the iPad - just because you need a late model iPhone to use it. I know lots of people with iPads who don't own iPhones.

Oh.. thanks. I missed that details. So, the sports may be the cheapest of the 3 collections.

Nope. The one listed first, the one that's not made of specialized components, is the first one.

What I want to know is does "Sports Addition" mean it's a sports look or is it actually different because it's intended purpose it to be used during sports? If not, will the other versions be durable enough to use for sporting purposes? (distance runner here)

They're all durable unless they hit something hard enough to stop being durable. ;)

I'm about as interested in British Vogue editor Alexandra Shulman's opinion of the Apple Watch as I am in Tim Cook's opinion of Autumn hemlines.

I'm not interested in anyone's opinion of hemlines at any time of the year... but as an Apple fan and stockholder I'm sure interested in the opinion of reviewers of their products.


You could just google any of the big swiss names. Image

The complexity of these watches far exceeds that of the apple watch which is just a chip and a few smartphone components. And I am willing my entire life on this that no business man would ever choose an apple watch over a classic swiss watch.

Not sure how you define businessman, but I can think of a lot who will.

I would pay $500 right now if it were a standalone device with GPS and 3G modem.

I totally hate the idea of it being tethered to the iPhone. How impractical is that?

Such a device, plus the :apple:WATCH functionality, including full day battery, would not fit into a watch right now.

Ion hardened glass, whatever that is.

Gorilla glass.
 
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