Don't buy AppleCare on Ebay

AlienSexGod said:

lol Dimwit your name is appropriate!

I can prove it in a court of law by asking MacMan and his suppliers to show receipts from Apple and the priginal boxes and serial numbers. He and they can't produce them because there is NO WAY in the world that they can be purchased wholesale from Apple for the price they sell them for or below.

Hence I will continue my revelation and truth against this person. If it was a few Applecare's here and there being sold below cost ( old liquidated stock etc ) then it would be possible but it is not ... it is hundreds sold behind false names and details (ebay is perfect for cons)... codes that sometimes have to be replaced NOT because of a glitch in Apple's authentication but because sometimes a real printed Apple number is sold and registered as the same one as the one they generated and sold you.

Again is something appears to be too good to be true it probably is.
In this case is is way more than probable ...it is 100% fraud.

Buy stolen goods if you wish ... they may work and maybe they wont break and you wont need to actually get warranty service and maybe you have no conscience like MacMan & Co.

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You need to settle down, I don't know why you are singling out me as a bad guy, I am the only seller that is here on the forum, and if you did read the previous posts, you will see that I do provide proof of purchases from an authorized apple reseller when it is need to to satisfy apples requests.

Why don't you contact me privately or through my email and I will be happy to talk to you, but it is you who is cowering, not me. I am hiding nothing.

Its people like you and the floundering music producer who are out of line. Funny, both of you claim to be apple authorized resellers, and both of your business's have been hurt by me and other sellers who sell for less then you. Again, sour grapes!!!

Music producer goes from posting how he is satisfied with the way I solved issues and he will look forward to buying from me in the future to agreeing with you, he has floundered twice now.

I will not bicker with you anymore, but I will expect the slander to end. This type of slander will get this thread ended, and that is not a good thing, this is an informative thread and should not disappear.


As far as me buying my wife things and acting like a good person to her, its true, I do buy my wife nice things and act like I am a good person, because I am a good person, ask anyone who has ever bought from me. You can email every person that has ever bought from me on ebay, the sales go back years and no one has ever been refused repair or had their applecare revoked. Do your due diligence before name calling and accusing.

Macman812 said:

You need to settle down, I don't know why you are singling out me as a bad guy, I am the only seller that is here on the forum, and if you did read the previous posts, you will see that I do provide proof of purchases from an authorized apple reseller when it is need to to satisfy apples requests.

Why don't you contact me privately or through my email and I will be happy to talk to you, but it is you who is cowering, not me. I am hiding nothing.

Its people like you and the floundering music producer who are out of line. Funny, both of you claim to be apple authorized resellers, and both of your business's have been hurt by me and other sellers who sell for less then you. Again, sour grapes!!!

Music producer goes from posting how he is satisfied with the way I solved issues and he will look forward to buying from me in the future to agreeing with you, he has floundered twice now.

I will not bicker with you anymore, but I will expect the slander to end. This type of slander will get this thread ended, and that is not a good thing, this is an informative thread and should not disappear.


As far as me buying my wife things and acting like a good person to her, its true, I do buy my wife nice things and act like I am a good person, because I am a good person, ask anyone who has ever bought from me. You can email every person that has ever bought from me on ebay, the sales go back years and no one has ever been refused repair or had their applecare revoked. Do your due diligence before name calling and accusing.

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Ahh, of course. Authorized resellers should have absolutely NO reason to be frustrated by dodgy sellers selling the same product for more than 40% off the distributor pricing.

I was satisfied with the comment you made that you had sold 2 Applecare boxes - and I saw that auction. But the whole story about the code only still remains suspect. I am not at all 100% satisfied that what you are selling is completely legal - of course not. The product does not exist in the distributor database, the pricing is completely off the charts - and a few other resellers (including LA Computer Company) expressed disbelief when I quoted your prices (your cost after ebay+paypal fees)

My business is not hurt by you or any other ebay seller - I sell only to studios. And my Apple reseller business is a side hobby - dealing with only studios and musicians I associate with. My main business is music production, I can do nothing but sit at home and collect royalties at home.. so it's amusing when you say that my business is hurt by you. My frustration is for the people who have got scammed by this - just like the iTunes scam.

Even if my business was 100% related to Apple products, I would welcome competition - but *not* shady competition.

Dimwhit said:

You do realize that Macman was able to provide Apple with sufficient proof (from his supplier) when one of his buyers had his code come into question from Apple and the situation was resolved to Apple's satisfaction. Try reading back a number of pages before calling someone a liar.

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lol let's see the proof ..... no chance this is true..... con men tell you stories of what you want to hear to allay your fears so you can be conned by them.

Let's see MacMan declare to the world his real legal name, his legal business name and registration details and physical address and I will do the same. I bet he wont do it because con men don't do that ... genuine businesses do.

Macman812 said:

you will see that I do provide proof of purchases from an authorized apple reseller when it is need to to satisfy apples requests.

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Post scans of just one official invoice from an Apple authorised reseller that allows you to make profit and when selling at your prices. I bet you won't. Why?

Either you are a liar like I say or you are smarter that every Apple authorised business in the world. It's either one of the two right?

We all would buy off your supplier if they were real and legitimate. You may have fooled an operator at Apple and got a code OK'd or a print out of an official invoice OK'd (easy to photoshop). Doesn't mean it was real or genuine. If this supplier that sells way below wholesale actually exists there would be no problem telling the world because that supplier would only sell at wholesale rates to genuine retailers right?

You want to end this?
So let's end this with full public disclosure and due diligence. I will go first if you agree to post your legal names and details. Promptly I will disclose my full legal name, company name and physicial trading address and my main wholesale suppliers.

btw. My motivation is not sour grapes .. I have many revenue streams outside of Apple care .... I just like to expose & elighten people. Wake up everyone!!!!!!!

Regardless of the legitimacy of Macman's business, or not, I don't really care, it would probably behoove you to remember that speaking on the internet is not really any different than speaking in person and unless YOU can prove the claims that YOU make against this person, you're actually the one in the wrong here and making false claims online is no different than making them in person.

If you can prove that this seller purchased stolen codes and resold them, then post that and keep talking, otherwise, you're making baseless claims.

My personal feelings on the matter aren't relevant, simply pointing out as one business owner to another that Macman has no obligation to provide you any information and I don't particularly think that it is evidence of some kind of guilt that he refuses to provide some random dude on the internet the details of his entire business operation.

So, please provide YOUR proof of the accuracy of your claims. The theory of "I'm right until proven wrong" doesn't really work in this instance.

I bought mine from ebay, and I've been a few times to the apple store to get a new battery (twice) and to fix a logic board problem (twice too) after the 1 year period and never had a problem with my apple care protection. Everybody talks from experience and I'm sorry people are not getting what they paid for.

Ebay has more chances of having "sellers" that are solely devoted to scam people. This of course wouldn't happen if you get the actual box from the apple store, or if you're really careful who you buy from on ebay or any other service like that.

feelthefire said:

The theory of "I'm right until proven wrong" doesn't really work in this instance.

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You are wrong fire. This type of judgment is made everyday in courts of law of first world countries.... if you can't prove who you are, and prove legitimate ownership via legitimate sources then the goods are assumed to have been obtained via proceeds of crime and are confiscated.

The innocent until proven guilty concept only has weight were there is a reasonable possibility of innocence. Here there is none. The goods are easily counterfeited (via a keygen), are sold way below what they can be purchased for by a wholesaler, the seller won't reveal his identity or sources therefore on the balance of probabilities the goods are stolen.

Case closed.

AlienSexGod said:

You are wrong fire. This type of judgment is made everyday in courts of law of first world countries.... if you can't prove who you are, and prove legitimate ownership via legitimate sources then the goods are assumed to have been obtained via proceeds of crime and are confiscated.

The innocent until proven guilty concept only has weight were there is a reasonable possibility of innocence. Here there is none. The goods are easily counterfeited (via a keygen), are sold way below what they can be purchased for by a wholesaler, the seller won't reveal his identity or sources therefore on the balance of probabilities the goods are stolen.

Case closed.

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The burden of proof first lies with the state to prove that a crime was committed. The burden then falls upon the defendant to refute the state's claims or to establish a defense to the charges. Has someone stepped forward in this thread to claim Macman ripped them off, or did I just miss that?

In the name of God, please tell me you're not working in a District Attorney's office somewhere! Case remanded.

AlienSexGod said:

The goods are easily counterfeited (via a keygen)

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So let me see if I've got this figured out. It would be possible to get a keygen utility to create counterfeit AppleCare codes. I could then sell those codes on eBay for over $100 each. I could earn $1,000 per day selling these on eBay. On the rare occasion when Apple questions a code, I could show them a legitimate invoice from an authorized Apple reseller and then keep on selling. And there's nothing Apple can do to prevent the fake keys?

Wow, where can I get one of these?

jrusch said:

So let me see if I've got this figured out. It would be possible to get a keygen utility to create counterfeit AppleCare codes. I could then sell those codes on eBay for over $100 each. I could earn $1,000 per day selling these on eBay. On the rare occasion when Apple questions a code, I could show them a legitimate invoice from an authorized Apple reseller and then keep on selling. And there's nothing Apple can do to prevent the fake keys?

Wow, where can I get one of these?

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I'm assuming you're being sarcastic, but if not..

You can get in touch with the Chinese hackers who cracked the iTunes algorithm. $2.60 for a $200 iTunes card, I saw a AppleCare code for $20 at a Chinese auction marketplace.

Apple seems to invalidate iTunes accounts created with fake codes faster than AppleCare agreements - presumably because - 1. The iTunes scam was much bigger and had a broader market share (almost all users want to buy iTunes cards, but not everyone has a mac to buy applecare for) and 2. Apple has not yet actively started looking into this - although it seems that they have started to check recent purchases and have been asking for receipts, etc - which might be a good sign.

One poster mentioned that a supplier could simply be buying AC in bulk, opening the boxes and emailing the codes to everyone. True, but again, an unauthorized retailer can NEVER get any Apple product for a lower pricing than a authorized reseller gets it for. Never. There are different pricing levels depending on how much sales you generate, etc - but there is no special pricing for unauthorized dealers - that's plain stupid.

Only thing I can think of is these guys who are buying AC in bulk, open the boxes, etc - and then claim a refund after a year or so (they have the original receipts) This leaves their buyers stranded with useless Applecare agreements.

I bet he gets his keys through a government or education source that has a large contract with Apple.

That's where he gets his computers too.

trip1ex said:

I bet he gets his keys through a government or education source that has a large contract with Apple.

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That would definitely be illegal. But then again, he's been bundling pirated software as well on the computers he's sold (check feedback for mention of 'photoshop', etc) which he lists as 'Extras available for free'.

Check out this attached image of an auction for a MacBook Air/13 " MBP AppleCare for 600 Yuan - which is about $87 (macman sells the same code for $120). Keep in mind that the retail price on this AC is $249 - most retailers probably get it for $160 or so.. definitely not lower than that.

As with any business, this chinese seller could easily supply this AppleCare code for $20 if he's promised bulk sales (direct sales so that he does not have to pay auction fees, etc) I hope this shuts everyone up who live in a la-la land thinking that they're getting a great deal.

View attachment 194880

Why are you attacking Macman? I have read this whole thread and I do not understand it. Any complaints that have been made against him have been resolved by him and yet you keep attacking him. You guys should be applauding him.

Now your trying to make him look bad by claiming he buys and sells computers through the government, are you kidding me?

I read that Music_Producer would buy immediately an AppleCare boxed from MacMan when he put in on eBay. He put it there more than month ago. Did you buy it?

Come on...you are attacking this man for no reason - no proof of anything!
What a shame!

guklein said:

Why are you attacking Macman? I have read this whole thread and I do not understand it. Any complaints that have been made against him have been resolved by him and yet you keep attacking him. You guys should be applauding him.

Now your trying to make him look bad by claiming he buys and sells computers through the government, are you kidding me?

I read that Music_Producer would buy immediately an AppleCare boxed from MacMan when he put in on eBay. He put it there more than month ago. Did you buy it?

Come on...you are attacking this man for no reason - no proof of anything!
What a shame!

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Good grief. You read the whole thread and yet you do not understand? Applauding him? Lol, ok. I hope you don't get scammed in the future, you seem too naive.

I don't think you get the concept of pricing, right? How, it's NOT POSSIBLE for ANYONE (read: ANYONE - that includes authorized, unauthorized, black, brown, white, etc) to sell AppleCare for those prices.

It was NOT POSSIBLE for people to sell the iTunes cards at ridiculous prices - the reason for that pricing came out eventually. Now we know why AC is so cheap as well. I even posted a damn screenshot of it, and yet you don't understand?

Music_Producer said:

Good grief. You read the whole thread and yet you do not understand? Applauding him? Lol, ok. I hope you don't get scammed in the future, you seem too naive.

I don't think you get the concept of pricing, right? How, it's NOT POSSIBLE for ANYONE (read: ANYONE - that includes authorized, unauthorized, black, brown, white, etc) to sell AppleCare for those prices.

It was NOT POSSIBLE for people to sell the iTunes cards at ridiculous prices - the reason for that pricing came out eventually. Now we know why AC is so cheap as well. I even posted a damn screenshot of it, and yet you don't understand?

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Did you buy boxed AppleCare from him as your promise made last month? You said it would be a pleasure to buy it immediately.

Thread reopened

Thread is now active after some major spring cleaning.

Let's review a few rules:

1. Insults. Don't insult someone just because you disagree with them.
2. Advertising/soliciting. Using the forums for advertising or for commercial business deals and offers. This includes eBay pages.
3. Profanity. The profanity filter is there for a reason. Do not circumvent it.
4. Sequential posts. Combine your comments into one post rather than making many consecutive posts. Use the multiquote (
   
   ) button. It's your friend.
5. Selling outside the Marketplace. Please review Marketplace rules.

If you see any violations of these or any other rules, please report () them. Thanks.

Thanks to the admins for opening this thread again. The one thing I wanted to add is that apple reached what it obviously intended I won't buy apple care on ebay again, even if the seller does have a good reputation.

Although I would still prefer apple to go after the sellers not the buyers.

Frid

clyde2801 said:

Case remanded.

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Sorry Clyde as Linda & Aaron said "you don't know much , but you know I love you"... American & Australian law is based on the British system which eventually comes down to the balance of probabilities.

If a person selling goods in bulk cannot show clear title, legitmate sourcing and sells way below the wholesale rate at the rate of stolen goods on the balance of probabilities the goods are stolen and therefore can be confiscated by the state.

Fair , reasonable and factual law. Crims lose their assets this way everyday when the long arm catches up to them.

Thanks for re-opening the thread admins ... this is an important message that needs to be aired. People need to get their heads out of the sand. Denial does not enlighten us and free us.

Also the education angle some friend of Mac Man (who knows maybe his brother?) doesn't hold water as the sale and whole prices of edu applecare are very close to normal applecare... certainly way higher NOT lower than 99% of the ebay sellers plus as Music Producer said even if the price added up it would be illegal to sell edu to non edu people.

Music Producer please pm me your box is full!

I sell alot on ebay and Ive bought a few thing as well.

Leave a negitive feedback and learn from your mistake. Have great communication with the seller.

That sucks that you got scammed,

Ericatomars said:

I sell alot on ebay and Ive bought a few thing as well.

Leave a negitive feedback and learn from your mistake. Have great communication with the seller.

That sucks that you got scammed,

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The point is that most people who got scammed, were not able to leave -ve feedback or demand a refund from PayPal as it was at least 3 months before the AC got deactivated. However, now it seems that Apple is catching up and verifying ACs much sooner - still, there are clueless consumers who buy something, and as soon as they get the AC registered, they leave a positive feedback. They can't change that feedback once they've left it.

Bottom line, buy boxed AppleCare from eBay from an authorized reseller (especially now that Apple is asking for a receipt)

AlienSexGod said:

If a person selling goods in bulk cannot show clear title, legitmate sourcing and sells way below the wholesale rate at the rate of stolen goods on the balance of probabilities the goods are stolen and therefore can be confiscated by the state.

Fair , reasonable and factual law. Crims lose their assets this way everyday when the long arm catches up to them.

Thanks for re-opening the thread admins ... this is an important message that needs to be aired. People need to get their heads out of the sand. Denial does not enlighten us and free us.

Also the education angle some friend of Mac Man (who knows maybe his brother?) doesn't hold water as the sale and whole prices of edu applecare are very close to normal applecare... certainly way higher NOT lower than 99% of the ebay sellers plus as Music Producer said even if the price added up it would be illegal to sell edu to non edu people.

Music Producer please pm me your box is full!

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Correct, pricing is everything. The fact that these sellers are selling AC code only @ a price that is way lower than an authorized reseller's pricing (direct from distributor) is a big giveaway of fraud.

E.g. I sell the Digidesign Mbox 2. Retail price at any store is $449. I sell it for $349. I acquire it from the manufacturer for $279. The best pricing for this unit is $260 (if purchased in huge amounts)

I have never seen any new mbox 2 on ebay for less than $320 - why? Take into account all the ebay fees, paypal fees, etc - even with a cost of $ 260, a sales price of $320 will net about $5 in profit. So if there is a seller selling 'new units' for $250 or some ridiculous price, you can be pretty sure that they are either used and re-packaged.

Now this is a hardware product, so it can't be 'faked' like a key-generated Apple Care code. But you get the idea on how pricing is a good way to evalute whether a product is fraudulent or not. Reminds me of the time when a ebay seller was selling forever stamps for 39 cents each (when it's 43 cents each) There is no way anyone can get a 'discount' from the post office on postage stamps.

Officials finally tracked the stamps as stolen - a postal worker had stolen $600,000 worth of stamps and was giving them to a seller who would resell them on ebay. Sure, the customers who bought these stamps got them for a great price - but in the case of Apple Care, you're stuck with no warranty - and you're out of money!

What I find funny is all the people defending macman and other sellers - and this whole practice in general. All I can say is, good luck to you who are buying these codes. Hope your AC doesn't 'expire' beforehand, and if it does.. kindly come back to this thread and let us know how embarrassed you are about it. And I know that a good seller will not include 'extras' such as pirated versions of Photoshop and other software loaded on the computers he/she sells.

Alien.. Pm'd you right now.. sorry my inbox was full - I'm too lazy at deleting stuff

AlienSexGod said:

Also the education angle some friend of Mac Man (who knows maybe his brother?) doesn't hold water as the sale and whole prices of edu applecare are very close to normal applecare... certainly way higher NOT lower than 99% of the ebay sellers plus as Music Producer said even if the price added up it would be illegal to sell edu to non edu people.

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Well I suggested he may have a contact in government or education that has a contract with Apple. Perhaps even himself.

Not talking about edu prices on Apple's app store.

Anyway this might explain why he can sell computers for cheap in addition to Applecare. It might explain why he can't become an authorized dealer. And it might explain why he can, if asked, get a "receipt" for his Applecare customers, but doesn't do it automatically.

Note, I have no knowledge of Apple's bulk pricing with regards to large contracts to institutions. But it seems like a decent explanation if the guy isn't an outright "pirate" like he says.

Not sure this is "illegal" exactly. It probably is unethical and could get someone fired.

This thread is such a good thing, I joined it in the beginning to share and help. I knew there were some bad sellers out there and I tried to let people know who the good sellers are. Then, once I realized that people are going to say things, and make things up, regardless of the facts, I decided I would just let people know how to find my products on ebay. Then when AlienSexGod started calling me a criminal and Music_Producer floundered once more and turned on me for the 3rd time and started teaming with Alien God and really slandering me, I decided I was not going to be involved anymore. What most of the people on this thread need to realize, is that AlienSexGod and Music_Producer are only sharing their opinions, about 80% of what they are saying is 100% false, and then to have them start spewing laws on whats considered criminal behavior and what is legal, is comical. The fact is, 90% of my codes were purchased from a one time apple authorized company, I did at one time have all the boxes and most were damaged. I do still occasionally sell boxed applecares, and they are listed now on ebay.

One thing I need to make people aware of is that no one person or company can return thousands of applecares back to apple, so the garbage that is being said about returning codes is nonsense, also, if there is a key gen system to produce these codes, why and how would they be approved by apple? Is there a supposed formula to this numbers. I have no idea and don't want to know.

Also, I have no affiliation with any educational or governmental program, and the fact is if I wanted to be an authorized apple reseller, I could be as can anyone on this sight if you are willing to spend enough money with them, which I am happy to do, but then they control what I am allowed to sell items for and to be honest, my costs would go up quite a bit if I bought directly from apple.

This will more then likely be my last post on this thread, and to be honest, I think that is a bad thing as I know more about applecares then anyone on this forum, I can also offer help, but these users are just making it too uncomfortable. I do want you all to know that I have private messaged both off these guys and neither have responded.

One last thing to remember, I have been selling applecares for over 4 years, and to this date, I do not have 1 unhappy customer or 1 customer who does not have their applecare in place (except 1 guy who chose a refund, but even he was happy once refunded). This is out of thousands of applecare sales. If anyone on this forum wants to hear the truth, simply email any of my previous customers, the history is there on ebay, thousands of them. Believe me what my customers tell you will be fact and what these 2 users, Music_Producer and AlienSexGod are sharing is opinion mixed with a splattering of fact.

I hope I have helped some people along the way, and I am not trying to make a dramatic exit, but I didn't want people to think I just simply disappeared. Also, realize that now that I am not hear to disprove anything that these guys say, they will probably attack me even harder. So please take all with a grain of salt.

Music_Producer said:

I don't think you get the concept of pricing, right? How, it's NOT POSSIBLE for ANYONE (read: ANYONE - that includes authorized, unauthorized, black, brown, white, etc) to sell AppleCare for those prices.

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What do you think how much pay a apple auth. reseller apple/manufacturer for a macbook pro applecare?

Did you see on the china marketplace a applecare "in box" for a very cheap price?

patrick1234 said:

What do you think how much pay a apple auth. reseller apple/manufacturer for a macbook pro applecare?

Did you see on the china marketplace a applecare "in box" for a very cheap price?

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Most probably $250 for the MBP AC (sells for $349 retail) at the lowest pricing structure. Check with Alien for exact pricing - I don't get the best pricing from Apple as I'm more of a pro-audio reseller, but I do get great deals from time to time.

Yeah, if you check the post, I was the one who posted that image from the Chinese auction. And it's not a 'in box', it's for the code.

They simply used the image of an AppleCare box (after all an image of a Apple Care code wouldn't look so impressive right?)

i think it is also possible to buy in china a fake applecare "in a box".

china´s people fake all

patrick1234 said:

i think it is also possible to buy in china a fake applecare "in a box".

china´s people fake all

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Including your shiny Mac?

Most likely it was built in China.

Think before you type and leave the stereotypes behind.

Like everywhere, the vast majority of people in China are honest.