14 Year Old Prodigy dead, apparent suicide

wdlove

macrumors P6
Original poster
Oct 20, 2002
16,570
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OMAHA, Neb. -- A musical prodigy who completed high school at age 10 apparently killed himself at 14, authorities said.

Brandenn E. Bremmer, who taught himself how to read at 18 months and began playing the piano at 3, was found dead Tuesday at his home in southwest Nebraska with a gunshot wound to the head, sheriff's officials said.
It's so sad, such a promising life has been lost. My prayers go out to his family and friends.
 

iLikeMyiMac

macrumors 6502a
Jul 17, 2004
898
1
St. Louis
CanadaRAM said:
What a tragedy.
It's sad that he had easy access to a firearm.
If he was determined to kill himself I don't think whether or not he had access to a firearm would have stopped him.
 

bousozoku

Moderator emeritus
Jun 25, 2002
13,951
3
Gone but not forgotten.
PlaceofDis said:
i wonder what caused him to do this?

its sad, especially since he was so young :(
Most likely that he was so young and had nothing but work. Everyone needs some fun in their life, an outlet for the frustration and anger of living.

I feel bad for his family and friends and I hope that he'll find rest now.
 

PlaceofDis

macrumors Core
Jan 6, 2004
19,232
4
bousozoku said:
Most likely that he was so young and had nothing but work. Everyone needs some fun in their life, an outlet for the frustration and anger of living.

I feel bad for his family and friends and I hope that he'll find rest now.
very true, i guess its hard to imagine yourself in someone elses shoes, especially a child like this.....

still very sad, i hope his family copes okay...
 

Lacero

macrumors 604
Jan 20, 2005
6,639
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Sad event but not entirely surprising. The majority of people we consider geniuses lead lives of depression and poverty. Most genius maybe be extremely intelligent, but rarely are they well-rounded enough to handle the stresses of day-to-day living.
 

wdlove

macrumors P6
Original poster
Oct 20, 2002
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Oops I forgot to give the link. :eek:

http://www.heraldsun.com/firstnews/37-588097.html

The pressure that he was under must have been tremendous. Brandenn trull accomplished a lot in his short life. Chances are he had signs of depression, that now one picked up. He did have a little pleasure, his favorite character was Harry Potter.
 

BillHarrison

macrumors 6502
Jul 25, 2003
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I am not sure that one can use the words "genuis" and "suicide" in one posting.

They are pretty much mutually exclusive.
 

brap

macrumors 68000
May 10, 2004
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Nottingham
BillHarrison said:
They are pretty much mutually exclusive.
That's really quite narrowminded. Can you imagine the depth of hurt this kid must have felt to do such a thing?

The little goth kid cutting her arms up for attention is simply that, but to go for something you know there's no way out of, that's not something I could comprehend.
 

jlewis2k1

macrumors 6502a
Jan 14, 2005
720
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in your closet
whoa i never heard about this ... i really need to get out more in my own city. damn that sucks :-\ its shocking to see a kid that young doing this especially in my city.
 

rainman::|:|

macrumors 603
Feb 2, 2002
5,438
2
iowa
BillHarrison said:
I am not sure that one can use the words "genuis" and "suicide" in one posting.

They are pretty much mutually exclusive.
any idea how many geniuses, both scientific and artistic, have died at their own hands?

For instance, the guy that in the 1800s pioneered nanotechnology to mass produce cameras? Kodak killed himself... that one's on the top of my head since the anniversary was last week.

What an absurd thing for you to say. Every so often someone says something so false that i'm embarrassed for them.
 

amnesiac1984

macrumors 6502a
Jun 9, 2002
760
0
Europe
BillHarrison said:
I am not sure that one can use the words "genuis" and "suicide" in one posting.

They are pretty much mutually exclusive.
Perhaps the real point is that it is sad that he didn't get to reach the status of genius and to be renowned for it. Just imagine what he could have achieved.

Personally I believe there is a link between genius and depression, and its only that people who could be called genius' probably are smart enough to realise how truly messed up we are as a civilization, and perhaps that is what helps drive so many 'genius'' to madness. Albert Einstein is known for his physics but he had a lot of views on the human condition in general, especially when they were using his research for nuclear warfare.
 

AppleMatt

macrumors 68000
Mar 17, 2003
1,779
9
UK
So there's a lot of interesting issues here.

It would appear to me that this person was determined. Overdosing or poison *could* be seen as a more...less successful...method and therefore perhaps a "help me" attempt, however that's not to say I'm discrediting people who have committed or attempted suicide like this - everyone is different. If you have the determination to draw a weapon on yourself it makes no difference how you intend to kill yourself you're going to do it; firearm or piece of paper (forced choking).

The poster who said about genius and suicide being mutually exclusive. I'm not sure what you mean, perhaps that killing yourself is not clever and therefore...'un-genius' like?
I think the main issue is over-thinking. Many very intelligent people can't "switch off", and become increasingly frustrated by ideas that they can't perfect, opportunities they know they could realise if given the resources and most importantly of all being misunderstood. Also there seems to be a tendency to overanalyze what they notice in people. Once again however - everyone is different.

It's hard to gauge "genius". Is it limited to someone with a talent for science, art or literature or is it broader? What makes it really sad is that a firearm is messy, I can't imagine what finding someone who's killed themselves this way would be like, never-mind finding a small child.

edit: Interesting points from amnesiac1984 too. I completely agree on the idea that genius and depression show strong evidence of linkage.

AppleMatt
 

BillHarrison

macrumors 6502
Jul 25, 2003
332
0
paulwhannel said:
any idea how many geniuses, both scientific and artistic, have died at their own hands?

For instance, the guy that in the 1800s pioneered nanotechnology to mass produce cameras? Kodak killed himself... that one's on the top of my head since the anniversary was last week.

What an absurd thing for you to say. Every so often someone says something so false that i'm embarrassed for them.
No need to be, I don't feel the least bit embarrassed. I am aware of how many people, both "geniuses" and otherwise have died at their own hands. However, how is it possible to feel the slightest amount of pity for someone that kills themselves? Depressed? Perhaps, who here has not been. Sad? Lonely? I doubt those are "unique" feelings that only they experience.

They made a choice, and a VERY UNINTELLIGENT one. I don't care if they invented the single most important thing ever - They still made THE STUPIDEST decision in life they could have -

And that brings them well below the level of the "non-genius" that deals with life, his / her problems, and moves on, still striving to become and be something better. Every day someone deals with these issues, and makes themselves a better person. This "genius" shot himself. IMHO, anyone that lacks that sort of intelligence does not fall into the genius category.

Does this sound cruel? Did he have "issues" that "noone" but him could ever know? Who knows. We all have "issues". We ALL (especially a "supposed" genius who is capable of completeing high school by age 10) should know that there are options for help. So he was NOT nearly as intelligent as claimed.

I guess to each their own, but trust me, I don't believe anyone should waste a moment of pity on someone who takes their own life - Atleast do it in a hospital so that your organs can be harvested and put to some good use in someone that DOES need and WANT life - Your throwing away something others die yearning for.

Now those are the ones that deserve our pity and compassion.
 

AppleMatt

macrumors 68000
Mar 17, 2003
1,779
9
UK
BillHarrison said:
However, how is it possible to feel the slightest amount of pity for someone that kills themselves?
Depressed? Perhaps, who here has not been.
Because it is a wasted opportunity.

It has been known for years that nearly everyone will go through a period of depression at some point in their lives. What you are implying however is that it is transient, which for many people is very untrue.

BillHarrison said:
They made a choice, and a VERY UNINTELLIGENT one. I don't care if they invented the single most important thing ever - They still made THE STUPIDEST decision in life they could have
If your life isn't a happy one, why shouldn't you have the right to take it? After all, it is yours. If someone had suffers with painful cancer for 8 years and wants to die it hits the news and the courts. Why should it be so different with mental anguish?

BillHarrison said:
We ALL (especially a "supposed" genius who is capable of completeing high school by age 10) should know that there are options for help. So he was NOT nearly as intelligent as claimed.
[/QUOTE]

Reductionism at it's best.
The second crucial (and well known...) fact about depression is that current figures of suffers are wildly understated. Most people do not seek help.

AppleMatt
 

jsw

Moderator emeritus
Mar 16, 2004
22,819
41
Andover, MA
Genius and depression often go hand in hand because the genius feels isolated - not only because there are so few at his or her level to whom s/he can truly relate, but also because they are often (usually) ostracized to some extent. Certainly, they don't feel "normal". And 14 year old kids are very much interested in being normal and belonging, genius or not.

Additionally, your typical "genius" isn't as religious as an average person (obviously, there are exceptions), and so the religious implications of suicide are unimportant to them.

To say that one cannot both be a genius and commit suicide, or that committing suicide is an act of total stupidity, is wrong. An intelligent person, suffering emotionally, seeing no end to the suffering, sees death as an out. They do not suffer after their death; their action has ended their suffering. It is their option to take their own life. It is an immature choice, but not a "stupid" choice.

Also, someone clinically depressed who commits suicide is not being "stupid", as they are under the influence of powerful emotions they cannot control. Clinical depression is not something people can just "get over". Untreated, it often leads to suicide or at least attempted suicide.

I see much proof that this child was a genius. I see no reason to believe he was stupid. I see reason to believe he was either clinically depressed or had convinced himself life would get no better and so made either an irrational (if clinically depressed) or immature (if not) decision to end his life.
 

BrianKonarsMac

macrumors 65816
Apr 28, 2004
1,102
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i find it amusing how nobody gives a thread to all the other children who commit suicide, but for some reason this one was a "special case"
 

amin

macrumors 6502a
Aug 17, 2003
977
9
Boston, MA
When I was 12, I took the SATs in order to qualify for a summer camp run by Hopkins called CTY. At this camp, we had the opportunity to take 2-week courses which were meant to cover a one-year high-school curriculum (I took latin and some sort of math). I remember that many of the kids there were socially poorly-adjusted. Several had attempted suicide. Parental pressure is often contributory, but not in all cases. Kids put a lot of pressure on themselves, and those who can score a 1600 in the SATs at age 11 are often developmentally disordered in areas that go untested.

In this day, I think having kids that grow up happy takes a lot of luck. As I parent, I really feel for this kid's family. I'm sure they would have rather died in his stead.
 

Mav451

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2003
1,657
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Maryland
amin said:
When I was 12, I took the SATs in order to qualify for a summer camp run by Hopkins called CTY. At this camp, we had the opportunity to take 2-week courses which were meant to cover a one-year high-school curriculum (I took latin and some sort of math). I remember that many of the kids there were socially poorly-adjusted. Several had attempted suicide. Parental pressure is often contributory, but not in all cases. Kids put a lot of pressure on themselves, and those who can score a 1600 in the SATs at age 11 are often developmentally disordered in areas that go untested.

In this day, I think having kids that grow up happy takes a lot of luck. As I parent, I really feel for this kid's family. I'm sure they would have rather died in his stead.
I actually got into CTY, but I rejected it to go to this Aerospace camp. Needless to say, even though I got higher scores than a TON of a my peers, they wouldn't let me in. I believe CTY gave me sour grapes for that -_-.

Anyway, from my experience, I've met quite a bunch of people who HAVE been to CTY, but those were people my age (11 then, 20 now), so in terms of having a relevancy to the "child prodigies", its not really there. But, if you were there when you were like 5-7 years old...that's another thing.