2006 Mac Pro (5150) Running HOT?

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by jsurpless, Aug 6, 2009.

  1. jsurpless macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #1
    Hi everyone

    I was wondering if anyone might have some insight into this...

    I've got a 2006 Mac Pro (Xeon 5150 x2) - when I first bought the machine, I believe that the CPU Core temps would idle around 85F or so... under 100% load, they'd top out around 105F... a short time ago, I noticed that the CPU core temps were around 130F or so at idle; under 100%, they'd increase to maybe 140F or so...

    I'm a bit concerned as to why the temperatures seem to have increased so drastically... can anyone tell me what this chip is supposed to idle at?

    I cleaned out all the dust and had a shop re-apply the thermal compound to the CPU - no effect... if anything, the temps *increased* and ramping up the fans only takes it to 115F, whereas before it dropped to around 105F...

    I should mention that I've installed additional memory and drives since '06 so that could account for the temperature increase but I restored the machine to its original config with no apparent change...

    Any thoughts?

    Many thanks!

    -Justin
     
  2. Tesselator macrumors 601

    Tesselator

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Location:
    Japan
    #2
    The cores themselves or the heatsinks?

    I have a 2006 with two x5355 processors installed and the heatsinks idle at around 30c to 38c on summer days when the room is 28c to 32c or so.

    In winter it's about 5c less meaning 25c to 32c.

    At a complete 100% idle the cores will be about the same or maybe 5c higher. But cores change temperature extremely rapidly and just loading a webpage can send a core or two up to 50c from 40c almost instantly.

    With all 8 cores at 100% for 30min. Apple's default fan setup should NEVER allow the cores to reach 80c. and the heatsinks at that point should be around 50c. When the cores hit 70c to 75c Apple says "too hot", and begins to ramp up the fans. 75c is actually too late so we should use smcFanControl.

    Ambient should be about the same temperature as the room or the exhaust fans aren't doing their jobs. Hopefully never more than room temp + 2c at any rate.

    Since I started writing this my CPUs have been 100% the whole time (about 16 min. 51 sec.) and here's what I got:

    Room temperature 27.6c
    28.0℃/82.4℉ Ambient Air
    45.0℃/113.0℉ CPU A Heatsink
    50.0℃/122.0℉ CPU B Heatsink
    45.0℃/113.0℉ Expansion Slots
    31.0℃/87.8℉ Hard Drive Bay 1
    31.0℃/87.8℉ Hard Drive Bay 2
    31.0℃/87.8℉ Hard Drive Bay 3
    31.0℃/87.8℉ Hard Drive Bay 4
    68.0℃/154.4℉ Memory Module A1
    70.0℃/158.0℉ Memory Module A2
    65.0℃/149.0℉ Memory Module B1
    68.0℃/154.4℉ Memory Module B2
    43.0℃/109.4℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 1
    48.0℃/118.4℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 2
    45.0℃/113.0℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 3
    45.0℃/113.0℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 1
    48.0℃/118.4℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 2
    51.0℃/123.8℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 3
    55.0℃/131.0℉ Power Supply Location 1
    58.0℃/136.4℉ Power Supply Location 2
    59.0℃/138.2℉ Northbridge Heat Sink
    75.0℃/167.0℉ CPU Core 1
    74.0℃/165.2℉ CPU Core 2
    75.0℃/167.0℉ CPU Core 3
    70.0℃/158.0℉ CPU Core 4
    66.0℃/150.8℉ CPU Core 5
    67.0℃/152.6℉ CPU Core 6
    61.0℃/141.8℉ CPU Core 7
    62.0℃/143.6℉ CPU Core 8
    97 % Processor Load (average)
    110 Number of Processes
    100 % Processor Load A
    97 % Processor Load B
    100 % Processor Load C
    97 % Processor Load D
    97 % Processor Load E
    97 % Processor Load F
    97 % Processor Load G
    94 % Processor Load H
    1.2891 V CPU A
    1.2852 V CPU B
    64.61 A CPU A
    69.29 A CPU B
    83.3 W CPU A
    89.1 W CPU B
    11.7383 V Memory VRM Supply A
    11.8008 V Memory VRM Supply B
    2.87 A Memory VRM Supply A
    3.03 A Memory VRM Supply B
    33.7 W Memory VRM Supply A
    35.7 W Memory VRM Supply B
    12.1172 V Power Supply 1 Line 1
    27.75 A Power Supply 1 Line 1
    336.2 W Power Supply 1 Line 1
    16.23 A Northbridge
    1.4844 V Northbridge
    24.1 W Northbridge
    0 % Graphics Processor
    64.0℃/147.2℉ Memory Module A3
    55.0℃/131.0℉ Memory Module A4
    67.0℃/152.6℉ Memory Module B3
    67.0℃/152.6℉ Memory Module B4
    2667 MHz CPU Clock Frequency
    8019.5 MB Free Memory
    34.0℃/93.2℉ SMART Disk WDC WD10EACS-00ZJB0 (WD-WCASJ0522351)
    27.0℃/80.6℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS404071)
    26.0℃/78.8℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS404074)
    28.0℃/82.4℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS418992)
    33.0℃/91.4℉ SMART Disk WDC WD2500JS-41SGB0 (WD-WCANY1534301)

    1190 RPM Exhaust Fan
    1188 RPM Fan CPU/Memory
    1110 RPM Fan Expansion Slots
    739 RPM Power Supply Fan


    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Three minutes after my CPUs went idle the dump looked like this:

    Room temperature 27.4c
    28.0℃/82.4℉ Ambient Air
    33.0℃/91.4℉ CPU A Heatsink
    34.0℃/93.2℉ CPU B Heatsink
    34.0℃/93.2℉ Expansion Slots
    31.0℃/87.8℉ Hard Drive Bay 1
    30.0℃/86.0℉ Hard Drive Bay 2
    30.0℃/86.0℉ Hard Drive Bay 3
    30.0℃/86.0℉ Hard Drive Bay 4
    52.0℃/125.6℉ Memory Module A1
    52.0℃/125.6℉ Memory Module A2
    49.0℃/120.2℉ Memory Module B1
    49.0℃/120.2℉ Memory Module B2
    33.0℃/91.4℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 1
    36.0℃/96.8℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 2
    36.0℃/96.8℉ Memory Riser Card A Position 3
    34.0℃/93.2℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 1
    37.0℃/98.6℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 2
    39.0℃/102.2℉ Memory Riser Card B Position 3
    51.0℃/123.8℉ Power Supply Location 1
    47.0℃/116.6℉ Power Supply Location 2
    47.0℃/116.6℉ Northbridge Heat Sink
    48.0℃/118.4℉ CPU Core 1
    46.0℃/114.8℉ CPU Core 2
    47.0℃/116.6℉ CPU Core 3
    45.0℃/113.0℉ CPU Core 4
    42.0℃/107.6℉ CPU Core 5
    40.0℃/104.0℉ CPU Core 6
    35.0℃/95.0℉ CPU Core 7
    37.0℃/98.6℉ CPU Core 8
    2 % Processor Load (average)
    102 Number of Processes
    1 % Processor Load A
    0 % Processor Load B
    1 % Processor Load C
    1 % Processor Load D
    2 % Processor Load E
    4 % Processor Load F
    2 % Processor Load G
    2 % Processor Load H
    1.2031 V CPU A
    1.1914 V CPU B
    22.07 A CPU A
    21.59 A CPU B
    26.8 W CPU A
    25.8 W CPU B
    11.8008 V Memory VRM Supply A
    11.8633 V Memory VRM Supply B
    2.27 A Memory VRM Supply A
    2.30 A Memory VRM Supply B
    26.7 W Memory VRM Supply A
    27.3 W Memory VRM Supply B
    20.9 W Northbridge
    14.10 A Northbridge
    1.4844 V Northbridge
    12.0703 V Power Supply 1 Line 1
    17.09 A Power Supply 1 Line 1
    206.3 W Power Supply 1 Line 1
    0 % Graphics Processor
    47.0℃/116.6℉ Memory Module A3
    40.0℃/104.0℉ Memory Module A4
    48.0℃/118.4℉ Memory Module B3
    47.0℃/116.6℉ Memory Module B4
    2667 MHz CPU Clock Frequency
    8608.9 MB Free Memory
    34.0℃/93.2℉ SMART Disk WDC WD10EACS-00ZJB0 (WD-WCASJ0522351)
    26.0℃/78.8℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS404071)
    25.0℃/77.0℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS404074)
    27.0℃/80.6℉ SMART Disk SAMSUNG HD154UI (S1XJJ1LS418992)
    32.0℃/89.6℉ SMART Disk WDC WD2500JS-41SGB0 (WD-WCANY1534301)

    1120 RPM Exhaust Fan
    1155 RPM Fan CPU/Memory
    1109 RPM Fan Expansion Slots
    711 RPM Power Supply Fan​

    And that's about the gist of it. If you're in the lower hemisphere and it's winter there then just subtract about 5c from almost every sensor reading above. If you're getting much higher than this then you might need to clean out the system. Do the fan blades and the heatsink fins especially. If that don't help enough then install smcFanControl and set the fans to about 1500 RPM all around.
     
  3. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #3
    Hi

    Thanks for the detailed reply back... to answer your questions...

    I think in central Massachusetts and today the ambient of my office is ~78F/26C...

    I just woke the machine from sleep (~9hrs) and the temps were as follows

    CPU A Heatsink: ~90F
    CPU B Heatsink: ~90F
    CPU Core 1: ~115℉
    CPU Core 2: ~115℉
    CPU Core 3: ~115℉
    CPU Core 4: ~115℉

    After about 10 minutes of checking email, etc... they looked like this...

    CPU A Heatsink: 98.6℉/37.0℃
    CPU B Heatsink: 102.2℉/39.0℃
    CPU Core 1: 127.4℉/53.0℃
    CPU Core 2: 123.8℉/51.0℃
    CPU Core 3: 127.4℉/53.0℃
    CPU Core 4: 123.8℉/51.0℃
    Northbridge Heat Sink: 152.6℉/67.0℃

    I just used SystemLoad to generate a 100% CPU across the system and it resulted in only a relatively minor temp increase (140 from 127 on CPU3, for instance)

    I'll have to check the heatsinks for dust build but as I mentioned, the service shop said they cleaned everything out and I have observed a 20F drop since they did so...

    Something that it's interesting - my DIMM temps; they seem a good deal warmer than yours... and this is at idle, mind you...

    Memory Module A1: 147.2℉/64.0℃
    Memory Module A2: 152.6℉/67.0℃
    Memory Module A3: 143.6℉/62.0℃
    Memory Module A4: 136.4℉/58.0℃
    Memory Module B1: 140.0℉/60.0℃
    Memory Module B2: 152.6℉/67.0℃

    In fact, my temps just seem to be higher than yours...

    Any more thoughts?
     
  4. Tesselator macrumors 601

    Tesselator

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Location:
    Japan
    #4
    Those temps look fine to me.

    If you want them lower just install that smcFanControl and set the min. speed to between 1200 and 1500.
     
  5. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #5
    I don't 'want' to lower the temps - I'm mostly curious as to why they *used* to be so much lower, compared to today... that large delta is just a concern...
     
  6. bearcatrp macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Location:
    Boon Docks USA
    #6
    Pull all your upgrades out to see if the temps go back down. With more lines of code on the OS updates, that alone will require the cpu's to crunch more data. Check your processes to see if a program is running high all the time too.
     
  7. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #7
    When you say "lower", what was the ambient?

    As already mentioned by bearcatrp, any upgrades could explain it, but given the processors, it might need to have the CPU's paste replaced with fresh material (it does dry out over time, and 3yrs seems to be common).
     
  8. Eidorian macrumors Penryn

    Eidorian

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    Location:
    Indianapolis
    #8
    What's with all these users thinking their computers run hot?

    I can understand the notebooks and iMac but the Mac Pro is a cooling wonder. 50° C at full load is petty stuff.
     
  9. Tesselator macrumors 601

    Tesselator

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Location:
    Japan
    #9
    Exactly. My guess would also be that you're noticing the seasonal differences. ;)
     
  10. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #10
    I'm figuring summer and possibly no A/C to help keep it a little more comfortable (for the computer, forget the user :eek: :p), the ambient has climbed enough the OP's noticed a difference.

    The TIM was changed, but I've no idea how long ago. So it's possible it's too thick or dryed out already (hot climate?). A more reasonable cause if there is an A/C system to keep the ambient reasonable (25C or a tad lower).
     
  11. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #11
    Hi everyone

    I should have provided more information but to address your comments...

    I first got the Mac Pro in Aug '06 so my thinking is that the ambient should be approx. the same... this was one of my initial thoughts but actually, I first noticed this issue in May of this year and we had a pretty cool spring in MA this year... so I'm thinking that the ambient's not a real factor - plus even if it were, we're not talking a 40F delta in ambient (which is what the MP is experiencing)

    I've also restored the machine to its original configuration (2x512MB and two SATA) - no significant impact...

    I also had a technician replace the thermal compound on the heatsinks earlier this week... he also cleaned out the CPU intake channel...

    Regarding a process running, I've already checked the activity monitor - nothing other than a few blips to 3-4%...

    Eidorian - as I mentioned, it's not so much that I feel that my machine is running warm - it's more that nothing has really changed regarding the ambient and the internals (user-supplied), yet there's a significant temperature increase on the CPU cores... still within the thermal spec but a concern (again, mostly due to the lack of an apparent reason) to me...

    Thanks to all for your thoughts...

    -Justin
     
  12. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #12
    You'd be surprised at how much the final temp is affected by a smaller ambient. And though you got it during a similar month, it could be different. Moved, maybe hotter this year vs. then,...

    So what is the ambient temp?
    Is there A/C?

    I'm thinking the new paste is too thick (as that could explain a 20C jump for the same loading previously), but the answers to the above questions could help. :)
     
  13. Eidorian macrumors Penryn

    Eidorian

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    Location:
    Indianapolis
    #13
    Ambient air is very important in the summer months.

    I was getting very warm results until I put the window AC in my room. It's the exact opposite in winter though!
     
  14. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #14
    The ambient temp in my office yesterday was approx 78F or so... no A/C... I can't recall the exact conditions of when I first got the machine but given that it was a "typical" August in MA, I'd have to say the temp was approximately the same... any higher, and the A/C would have been on to about 76F...

    Also, keep in mind what i mentioned about first noticing this issue back in May... MA had a very cool spring - it certainly wasn't above 70F...
     
  15. Eidorian macrumors Penryn

    Eidorian

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    Location:
    Indianapolis
    #15
    I noticed my computer temperature gains in the spring (April-May) as well but the ambient air doesn't get much above 76/78 F like yours too.
     
  16. bearcatrp macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Location:
    Boon Docks USA
    #16
    When you said your replaced it back to its original setup, did that include putting tiger back on? When I upgraded to leopard, i did see a rise in the temps. Not real big, but did see a difference.
     
  17. Tesselator macrumors 601

    Tesselator

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Location:
    Japan
    #17
    Yup, a 5c difference in Ambient can cause a 15c difference in component temps. It's not assured to but it can. But it is almost assured to be more than the ambient difference. For example if the ambient difference is 5c it's almost guaranteed to cause the CPU to run 7 to 8 c hotter.

    Anyway I would say just forget about it. You can't remember what the ambient temperatures were before and the system is running at very normal temperatures now so just accept this as the standard for a 2006 Mac Pro reading in the month of August.

    Also when you post temps you should use celsius c, as F is long dead and most people won't even know what you're talking about.
     
  18. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #18
    No, I didn't restore it to Tiger... that'd be an interesting test to try...
     
  19. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #19
    Actually, I do have a general idea of where the temperature was... and as I mentioned, I've experienced a 10F (5C) delta in the last few months with negligible impact on the CPU temps...

    Alas, I would declare F dead if I could... being an engineer, I despise all things non-SI but living in the US, I am forced to deal... :)
     
  20. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #20
    Yeah, I know this one well myself. ;) :p

    Thermal data's all metric from suppliers I like to use, and I have to convert everything. At least I can wait until the last second (final values). ;)
     
  21. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #21
    Well... I figured something out... well, only sort of because it raises some more questions...

    Last night, I decided to re-install OS X Leopard and to start with a brand-new User directory... so I do that and when I install Hardware Monitor after this, I'm shocked to discover the CPU temperatures down in the mid-90s degF...

    I'm like waaaaaaa?!? Did re-installing the OS have some sort of calibration effect not that everything's been cleaned, etc? Bit confused there for a moment until I remembered that I had taken a snapshot of my sensor readings just a few days before...

    I opened that snap up and what do I discover in comparison? Under my old install, the CPUs were pulling around 25-30W each and some 25A each... under 10.5.0, they pull around 10W each and some 10A each... that would definitely result in some serious increase in heat output...

    So I fire up SystemLoad and voila ! The system responds just as I had remembered, with a sharp increase in CPU diode temp on activity and then a drop shortly after the CPU idled...

    I just re-installed 10.5.8 and the power usage is back up where it used to be...

    What's going on here? Why are CPUs pulling more power in 10.5.8 than before?
     
  22. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #22
    :cool: You've discovered the cause.

    Unfortunately, I can't say as to why. I'd think they either had to increase the power for some reason (solve some other issue), or they accidentally "broke" it (power management).

    You might want to get into the power management settings, and take a look around. Something may have changed there, and you can adjust it back, and see how it works for you (experiment further). ;)
     
  23. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #23
    I would hope that it was accidentally broken...

    When you say "power management" settings... are you referring to pmset?
     
  24. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #24
    AFAIK, pmset is the area you'd need to look into. I'm just not sure if it's going to cover what you need.
     
  25. jsurpless thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2009
    #25
    Yeah, thanks for the suggestion but there doesn't seem to have much in there on the behavior of the CPU...

    Thanks!
     

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