2010 5,1 vs 2012 5,1

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by maccer99, Oct 1, 2015.

  1. maccer99 macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #1
    Simple question really, how does the 2012 refresh differ from the 2010? It looks like there is a constant model number through these years. Are they essentially the exact same computer, just with different slightly different internals, all of which make them the same computer if swapped/upgraded? Or are there other elements at play that make the 2012 better?

    I am referring to both at hypothetically Apple stock specs.
     
  2. Game64 macrumors member

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    #2
    New Processors - Pretty Much. W3680 vs W3690. 2012 had a spec bump. But the overall architecture is the same. If you grabbed a 2010 shell you could throw the upgraded components in it.
     
  3. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #3
    Right, that's what I thought. So putting a 2012's processor into a 2010 essentially make them the same exact computer (given the other parts are also same spec).

    With the 2010/2012 models that shipped with an SSD boot drive, are those connected straight to PCI (for fastest speed)? Can a third party SSD be easily swapped with that one, or does an IcyDock have to be installed first?
     
  4. Game64 macrumors member

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    #4
    I do not believe they're connected directly to the PCI. I think they're a 3.5" SSD or in a 3.5" Slot on Sata. You would save money by just getting a Dual Sata PCIe Card and two 240gb ssd's and run them in raid. It's what I do, I get 400mbps R/W Speeds. I would get higher but one SSD is SATA2.
     
  5. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #5
    Thanks. Why do you say a RAID setup is simpler/better? I was thinking of just going with one PCI connected SSD. In any case, how is the install/swap process and what needs to be purchased (besides SSD of course)? No IcyDock after all?
     
  6. Game64 macrumors member

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    #6

    You don't necessarily need it. I'm running 2.5" SATA Drives on an Velocity Duo x2 (http://www.apricorn.com/vel-duox2.html).

    But there are better ways of doing it. You could run a Quad PCIe mSata board which would allow up to 4 mSata drives. (http://www.addonics.com/products/ad4mspx2.php)

    I use raid to just increase performance.
     
  7. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #7
    Thanks. I thought RAID was more about reliability of data rather than performance, though? I was mentioning PCI strictly because I want fastest speed but if RAID helps too I will look into that.
     
  8. flowrider macrumors 601

    flowrider

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    Nov 23, 2012
    #8
    The fastest SSD speed is achieved with with an Samsung SM951 blade and a Lycom PCIe adapter. See this thread:

    http://forums.macrumors.com/threads/sata-express-meets-the-09-macpro-bootable-ngff-pcie-ssd.1685821/

    and my post on Page 51 here:

    The above shows SSD speeds in the HDD Bay, an Apricorn Velocity x2 Card, and an SM951.

    Lou
     
  9. flowrider, Oct 1, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2015
  10. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #10
    Thanks, will refer to that soon.

    Anyone know an easy way to tell a genuine 2012 5,1 from a flashed 5,1? (originally 4,1 or lower!) Ebay is full of this.
     
  11. h9826790 macrumors 604

    h9826790

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    #11
    RAID 1 is for reliability (redundancy actually, e.g. You boot from a RAID 1 array, and one of the HDD die, the system will still alive)

    However, RAID 0 is totally build for speed. (e.g. combine two 100MB/s HDD in a RAID 0 array, the resultant speed will become 200MB/s for that logical disk.)
     
  12. flowrider macrumors 601

    flowrider

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    Nov 23, 2012
    #12
    If you don't have the machine, the only way is with the SN. Ask the seller for the SN and look it up. There are various sites that show this. You could also ask the seller to show you the box that appears when you click on About This Mac.

    Lou
     
  13. Macsonic macrumors 65816

    Macsonic

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    #13
    Aside from asking for the SN, you may also ask the seller a screenshot showing the SMC firmware. A flashed 4,1 cMac Pro will still show a firmware of 1.39f5 even though it's model identifier shows 5,1. For checking the SN, you can try checking it on this SITE

    Choose a reputable seller. Some sellers disclosed if the cMac Pro they're selling is a flashed 4,1 to 5,1.
     
  14. MacVidCards Suspended

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    #14
    I seem to recall it still says 2009 someplace, I'll check next time I'm in office
     
  15. flowrider macrumors 601

    flowrider

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    #15
    ^^^^Yes it does, in the box that opens when you go to About This Mac.

    Lou
     
  16. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #16
    Wondering about RAM speed limitations on the 2010/2012 5,1, specifically with Snow Leopard. Is 1333 DDR3 the fastest allowed? And what specific type/brand?
     
  17. flowrider, Oct 2, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015

    flowrider macrumors 601

    flowrider

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    #17
    ^^^^RAM speed is dictated by the CPU (and the speed allowed by the RAM module) and is either 1066MHz or 1333MHz. And yes, the fastest CPUs that will work in a 5,1 Mac Pro will utilize 1333MHz RAM. Faster RAM will work in a 5,1, but will clock down to the speed allowed by the CPU.

    My RAM supplier since 1986 has been:

    http://www.datamemorysystems.com/ap...n-2-40ghz-md771ll/a-mid-2012-memory-upgrades/

    In all those years I have never received a bad Stick of RAM and they are extremely easy to work with.

    Lou
     
  18. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #19
    Thanks.

    How much better is the AMD 5870 than the 5770?
    Both have the same VRAM (1 GB), so was curious.
     
  19. h9826790 macrumors 604

    h9826790

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    #20
    AFAIK, the 5870 can perform up to 2x 5770, depends on your workflow of course.
     
  20. maccer99, Oct 2, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015

    maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #21
    I assume 5870 would yield the absolute best 10.6 graphics experience, then. Better than the other compatible ones such as NVIDIA Quadro 4000, which despite being 2 GB VRAM GDDR5, I hear has issues.

    How simple is it to install 2 5870s, is it even possible? New to the 5,1 sorry. No drivers needed since those were Apple-offered cards, right?
     
  21. h9826790, Oct 2, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015

    h9826790 macrumors 604

    h9826790

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    #22
    For 10.6, 5870 may be really the best one, it works particularly well in FCPX.

    However, it require 2x 6pin power input. And the Mac Pro only has 2x 6pin power output. So, technically you can only install one card.

    If you really want to install the 2nd 5870. You may...

    1) Get an extra PSU for the GPU.

    2) Go through the PSU mod.

    3) Use 6pin -> 2x 6pin adaptor and ignore the official 75W limit.

    I will say none of these are 100% safe + simple + clean solution. IMO, the PSU mod is the best choice. It's the hardest one, but if you figure out how to do it correctly, and only have to do it once, then almost all GPU options are available to your Mac Pro (in terms of hardware compatibility).
     
  22. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #23
    Thanks.

    Sounds like danger for 2 5870s, but may look into it. Two Quadro 4000s should be able to be installed, but again those have issues (correct me if I'm wrong).

    What is this about DisplayPort only being usable in 10.7 with the 5870? I assume this only pertains to the PC edition of it, but that is the only one I can find new.
     
  23. h9826790 macrumors 604

    h9826790

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    #24
    I never use the 5870 and not really know it well. So can't answer your question. However, by considering the 5,1 can ship with 5870 and 10.6. There is no point that a reference PC 5870's DP won't work on a 5,1. But it's just my guess, I am sure others members can tell you more on this matter.
     
  24. maccer99 thread starter macrumors member

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    Aug 31, 2015
    #25
    I'm referring to the normal PC edition of the 5870 I believe, seems like lots of compatibility hiccups. The Mac Edition that shipped with customized 2010/2012 MPs are probably the only viable choice for no frills.
     

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