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I would like to see the ATI Radeon 5870.

Not graphics card options that are two or more generations old already. :rolleyes:

Mainly this. The only thing that still sucks monkey phallus about owning a Mac is the lack of current gen graphics hardware. We have the great processors, we have the great software, GIVE US THE INSANELY GREAT GRAPHICS HARDWARE!
 
Physical media has another advantage. No downloads required, even if there's sufficient bandwidth, as data caps are gaining popularity and being implemented by ISP's (definitely the Accounting Depts. on up). So that amount of data per movie could get prohibitively expensive (i.e. 25GB for a single layer BD). :(

Purchased BD's can be loaded onto HDD's for an HTPC to allow for whole house availability without the need for dedicated players for each set (then archive physical BD's for safe keeping). And as it's been mentioned, shipping optical media is much less expensive than an HDD.

Yes, other good points for sure. I forgot about rising data caps. Sorry if this is getting slightly off topic, but going back to internet speeds, if I may, I just came across a new interesting CNET article ranking the fastest internet countries in the world, referenced by 9to5mac.com:

http://www.9to5mac.com/us-internet-speed-67544567

America is ranked #18 and actually decreased in internet speed in 2009. :eek:

I'm well aware that other countries totally outpace the US, but its a bit appalling to find out through the actual data that its far worse than anticipated. Just thought I'd share.
 
I couldn't agree more. It really amazes me how people instantly accept everything Apple pushes their way, even if it only serves Apple's interests.

gugucom,

How do you get around the whole HDCP compliant issue in Windows, or is it not an issue with your hardware / display?

I have a 46" LED backlight Samsung TV which I run from MDP and VGA adapter. The quality is superb and the native resolution is exactly 1920x1080. Because it is VGA I have no problems with HDCP at all. I can run the HDTV HD with my GT120 on a very low energy budget. If I need graphic power I can fit a 4870 which I do not need very often.
 
I'm hoping they come soon. I'm letting go my 2006 MacPro in this few days. I wish Apple will offer 2 full-size DVI port on top of their Mini-Display Port. I find it too much for a desktop to utilize a "mini" port where space is not an issue. And we have to spend extra to get the adapter just to do dual screen on the stock spec.

And please put the Airport card as default like 5 years ago?
 
Always wishing for a sub-$2000 headless Mac tower

I will continue to hope for a sub-$2000 headless Mac (tower) until Apple releases one. Being in a smaller case than the Mac Pro would also be nice and I would accept just one optical drive instead of current two and 3 PCIe slots instead of 4 in order to get the smaller case. iMac just isn't expandable enough but Mac Pro is a bit overkill for my needs.

Since a sub-$2000 headless Mac tower is unlikely to ever be released (or if it is, it will likely be crippled in other ways like the single processor G5 tower was) my wishes for a 2010 Mac Pro include a single quad core i7 processor, at least mid-level graphics (no more of this GF7300 and GF120GT garbage in a "Pro" workstation) and eSATA or the new USB 3.0. Would also like to see fan assemblies which are easy to remove and clean, like in my old G5 Power Mac.

And for the love of Pete, is it so difficult to give me direct access to the hardware eject button on the optical drive? I broke the tray mechanism on mine when an audio CD I inserted couldn't be read and continually spun up/down in an endless loop. Apple's purely-software eject system couldn't get the drive's attention long enough to open the drawer and I had to blindly poke with a straightened paperclip to find that little emergency eject hole through the cheese grater grill of my case. It was not pretty.
 
http://www.9to5mac.com/us-internet-speed-67544567

America is ranked #18 and actually decreased in internet speed in 2009. :eek:

I'm well aware that other countries totally outpace the US, but its a bit appalling to find out through the actual data that its far worse than anticipated. Just thought I'd share.
And people think DL movie content is going to proliferate and suplant physical media the US anytime soon? :eek: Yeah right. :rolleyes: ;) :p

The existing infrastructure is just too far behind, and needs a massive infusion of funds for upgrades (instead, it's sat essentially stagnant for years, even when they could have been laying more fibre to the exchange for future equipment).

There's quite a few areas that aren't even fibre from the exchange to the neighborhood yet (FTTC), which is needed. FiOS and UVerse are just too under-developed (coverage area) to improve matters for most, even if they're willing to pay for it. You simply can't get what isn't there.
 
More on that subject: FiOS is crap. It may be better than nearly every other ISP, but that doesn't keep it from being crummy. They refuse to support the use of a router that isn't the crappy one bundled with their service, and you have to pay a ton for 15 mbps down/5 mbps up.

And the service/support is lousy for $130 month. Why is it that paying $15/month for an MMORPG will net you better service?

I want that $15/month 100mbps down/100mbps up service offered in Hong Kong. Heck, I'd settle for a quarter of that at twice the price and love it. Our network telco systems in the US are broken, and they only even try to compete when towns start laying in municipal fiber :mad:.

Yes, I'm a little bitter. Sorry for the off-topic discourse, but put bluntly:

Network infrastructure in this country is lousy. We'll be on physical media long after everybody else is.
 
nd please put the Airport card as default like 5 years ago?

YESSS..please do. It absolutely perplexes me to no end as to why it was removed in the first place. Surely at a starting price point of $2499 what more is a $45 CTO option? :( What really gets me is that airport wireless is standard across Apple's entire computer lineup......except for its most premium grade computer. That just sounds wrong to me.

I feel like its one of those things that forces you to buy a Mac Pro directly from Apple and not other resellers. And to think how much cheaper I could get a Mac Pro elsewhere that doesn't include tax and shipping :(
 
YESSS..please do. It absolutely perplexes me to no end as to why it was removed in the first place. Surely at a starting price point of $2499 what more is a $45 CTO option? :( What really gets me is that airport wireless is standard across Apple's entire computer lineup......except for its most premium grade computer. That just sounds wrong to me.

I feel like its one of those things that forces you to buy a Mac Pro directly from Apple and not other resellers. And to think how much cheaper I could get a Mac Pro elsewhere that doesn't include tax and shipping :(

It's not included for the same reason the stock graphics card is low end: Some people don't need it and don't want to pay for it. The MP is basically the only Mac meant to sit under a desk. The laptops are...well, laptops, and iMac and Mini are meant to sit on your desk and look pretty. MP? Nope. Just hardwire it. It blocks the view of the cable with its enormous* bulk anyway. MP owners are also much more likely to be pushing big files around. (Qmaster/XGrid on Wifi? HELL NO).

Same thing with the graphics. You folks seem to forget these are also used for audio and scientific work, and those tasks really only need enough graphics dakka to drive a monitor. So that's as much as Apple gives you for the stock option. Those who need more, can get more.

The BTO cards are always decent at the time of release. The 1900, 8800GT, and 4870 were all GREAT cards when their respective MPs were released. They just aren't anymore, and Apple never bothers to update things until they refresh the whole line. Which is done when there are new CPUs. So when a graphics advance comes out in between Intel's DP server updates, MP owners just get it up the rear. I have no doubts you will be able to get that 6-mini DP 5870 on your 2010 MP. For $499 extra...(hey, don't blame Apple. The card actually retails for about that much)


*Frankly, the MP is not that big for a workstation/tower-of-power. The handles make it look bigger than it is. It's just barely big enough to be called a "full tower"
 
More on that subject: FiOS is crap. It may be better than nearly every other ISP, but that doesn't keep it from being crummy. They refuse to support the use of a router that isn't the crappy one bundled with their service, and you have to pay a ton for 15 mbps down/5 mbps up.

And the service/support is lousy for $130 month. Why is it that paying $15/month for an MMORPG will net you better service?

I want that $15/month 100mbps down/100mbps up service offered in Hong Kong. Heck, I'd settle for a quarter of that at twice the price and love it. Our network telco systems in the US are broken, and they only even try to compete when towns start laying in municipal fiber :mad:.

Yes, I'm a little bitter. Sorry for the off-topic discourse, but put bluntly:

Network infrastructure in this country is lousy. We'll be on physical media long after everybody else is.
I only listed FiOS and UVerse due to the advertised bandwidth, as I'm not willing to pay what they want for it. Combine that with reports of inconsistent service,... I won't touch it.

As for the state of the infrastructure, that's corporate greed for you. :mad: They don't want to update, just keep milking the existing equipment for every cent they can. So few new lines are being run, and there's equipment older than some of the members here on MR still in service. :eek: Seriously.
 
As for the state of the infrastructure, that's corporate greed for you. :mad: They don't want to update, just keep milking the existing equipment for every cent they can. So few new lines are being run, and there's equipment older than some of the members here on MR still in service. :eek: Seriously.

Well, what service offered in the US would you perfer, Nano? Just curious.

As for FIOS and corporate greed, there's a line that runs along the State Route a stone's throw away from my residence, and nobody along said State Route is offered service. The only service besides satellite that I can get at my residence is Broadstripe.

unrelated note; In a twist of irony, I fought *very* hard at my residence for an ISP change away from Hughesnet. Now I'm using Wildblue, the other major satellite provider. Upside, I can finally download a Linux ISO without running into a limit. Downside, ping times are higher. Needless to say, I'm not amused.

Next year (even though I will have moved) AT&T will put in cellular internet. For all intents and purposes, while providing a broadband option over air seems cool and all, nothing will replace wire. After I move I'm getting internet over a wire, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This is my perspective on "broadband" in Rural America. Sickening.
 
I bet Nanofrog would prefer municipal fiber, such as they offer in Lafayette, Louisiana. $30/month for symmetrical 10 mbps. Or $58/month for symmetrical 50 mbps. They rolled it out and then the local cable companies started offering better services.

Only the threat of competition from the government moves these cheap jerks. Few other industries can get away with this crap.
 
It's not included for the same reason the stock graphics card is low end: Some people don't need it and don't want to pay for it.

I would venture to say that a large portion of Mac Pro users wishes Apple would have put a substantial GPU in their workstation, especially considering the fact that Apple is charging out the wazoo for upgrades proves that they aren't including it just to make a ridiculous profit on people forced to upgrade
 
Only the threat of competition from the government moves these cheap jerks. Few other industries can get away with this crap.

But...But....running a cellular network is reeealy expensive/hard and that makes it ok for us to say that texting is stressful enough on the network to justify higher charges than data plans!
 
It's not included for the same reason the stock graphics card is low end: Some people don't need it and don't want to pay for it.(Qmaster/XGrid on Wifi? HELL NO).

But...but....its only $45.....Compromises in graphics hardware I can understand, but I mean, really? With as small of a user base the Mac Pro has today, does Apple have to be that strict?

Same thing with the graphics. You folks seem to forget these are also used for audio and scientific work, and those tasks really only need enough graphics dakka to drive a monitor. So that's as much as Apple gives you for the stock option. Those who need more, can get more.

The BTO cards are always decent at the time of release. The 1900, 8800GT, and 4870 were all GREAT cards when their respective MPs were released. They just aren't anymore, and Apple never bothers to update things until they refresh the whole line. Which is done when there are new CPUs. So when a graphics advance comes out in between Intel's DP server updates, MP owners just get it up the rear. I have no doubts you will be able to get that 6-mini DP 5870 on your 2010 MP. For $499 extra...(hey, don't blame Apple. The card actually retails for about that much)

I agree. I do audio work and am not as sensitive as others when it comes to Apple's standard graphic options. However I'm a pretty hardcore gamer as well, so aftermarket graphics options are fine for me. But more options at the CTO process would only benefit everyone and I don't think anyone should be against that.

Next year (even though I will have moved) AT&T will put in cellular internet. For all intents and purposes, while providing a broadband option over air seems cool and all, nothing will replace wire. After I move I'm getting internet over a wire, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This is my perspective on "broadband" in Rural America. Sickening.

Ha, cellular internet. :rolleyes: Another compromise that won't at all give leverage to iTunes HD movie downloads. I agree though, its a cool idea and probably a step in the right direction for future broadband for general consumers.
 
But...but....its only $45.....Compromises in graphics hardware I can understand, but I mean, really? With as small of a user base the Mac Pro has today, does Apple have to be that strict?

While it may not have relevance to why Apple do this; some customers can't buy computers with wireless hardware built in due security reasons. Perhaps the more likely reason is that they know that something like that isn't going to stop someone buying a Mac Pro so they have no reason to include it.
 
Well, what service offered in the US would you perfer, Nano? Just curious.
DSL via FTTH.

The best there is here ATM, is FTTC, but since the entire system isn't yet, they won't upgrade the equipment to offer faster service. Not until the copper lines have been replaced.

It makes sense, as it prevents the need to run dual systems in the exchange. But since such cable replacement has been so slow due to very little funding set aside for it (this is classed at the lowest priority = non existant ATM), it's going to be some time before additional bandwidth service is available. They keep pushing the date back everywhere, and it was supposed to be completed years ago. Here that means "indefinite hold".

Given the cost of laying fibre (or copper for that matter), it would make more sense IMO to go ahead and lay enough for an FTTH system. It's cheaper in the long run, as the cables that run parallel can be set at the same time to reduce labor & equipment costs. That way upgrades would only need to be made to the exchange equipment for future increases in bandwidth.

As for FIOS and corporate greed, there's a line that runs along the State Route a stone's throw away from my residence, and nobody along said State Route is offered service. The only service besides satellite that I can get at my residence is Broadstripe.
Unfortunately, this isn't uncommon. :( It tends to be a large pipe from one area to another, but it's too saturated to allow for additional connections to serve other users along it's route.

unrelated note; In a twist of irony, I fought *very* hard at my residence for an ISP change away from Hughesnet. Now I'm using Wildblue, the other major satellite provider. Upside, I can finally download a Linux ISO without running into a limit. Downside, ping times are higher. Needless to say, I'm not amused.

Next year (even though I will have moved) AT&T will put in cellular internet. For all intents and purposes, while providing a broadband option over air seems cool and all, nothing will replace wire. After I move I'm getting internet over a wire, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This is my perspective on "broadband" in Rural America. Sickening.
I've been that rural in the past (PA). Internet was dial-up or satellite. No DSL or Cable access whatsoever. So you can opt for molases covered granny in sub zero temps or an expensive and rather flakey faster service (i.e. fast as heck at late night, but during peak hours, not so wonderful, and then there's bad whether to cause dropouts).

I bet Nanofrog would prefer municipal fiber, such as they offer in Lafayette, Louisiana. $30/month for symmetrical 10 mbps. Or $58/month for symmetrical 50 mbps. They rolled it out and then the local cable companies started offering better services.

Only the threat of competition from the government moves these cheap jerks. Few other industries can get away with this crap.
Yep. I actually live in NE Louisiana. It's sort of dismal. I'm too far away from the exchange to get the faster plans, which is only 6Mb/s max anyway. :( Here, I have to consider myself lucky just to have access to DSL.

And you've hit the nerve directly. Without competition, there's zero motivation to invest one cent to improve service. They're actually hoping the government will pay for the lines that are necessary (or at least part of it), so they don't have to.

While it may not have relevance to why Apple do this; some customers can't buy computers with wireless hardware built in due security reasons. Perhaps the more likely reason is that they know that something like that isn't going to stop someone buying a Mac Pro so they have no reason to include it.
It's also cheaper to leave such things out = more $ to the bottom line.
 
More on that subject: FiOS is crap. It may be better than nearly every other ISP, but that doesn't keep it from being crummy. They refuse to support the use of a router that isn't the crappy one bundled with their service, and you have to pay a ton for 15 mbps down/5 mbps up.

And the service/support is lousy for $130 month. Why is it that paying $15/month for an MMORPG will net you better service?

20/5 is $44.95 per month (less if you bundle it with other Verizon services).....where are you getting $130 a month?

I'm not sure about your router complaint, either. I have my FIOS router acting as a passthrough, with my dual band "N" Airport Extreme doing all the actual work, so you can use FIOS with 3rd party routers. IMHO it's crazy to think that Verizon should have to SUPPORT the use of dozens of 3rd-party routers, though. Doesn't mean you can't use one.

Anyway, count me in as happy FIOS user, obviously.......
 
20/5 is $44.95 per month (less if you bundle it with other Verizon services).....where are you getting $130 a month?

I'm not sure about your router complaint, either. I have my FIOS router acting as a passthrough, with my dual band "N" Airport Extreme doing all the actual work, so you can use FIOS with 3rd party routers. IMHO it's crazy to think that Verizon should have to SUPPORT the use of dozens of 3rd-party routers, though. Doesn't mean you can't use one.

Anyway, count me in as happy FIOS user, obviously.......

It's $130 a month because it's got TV and phone service bundled with it. Not my choice, but I don't live alone here.

I'm saying the level of service they offer for that price is horribly bad. It'd be bad at $45/month. The router complaint is legitimate because they refuse to allow the possibility. Yes, I know you can, but you know, Airport routers are far easier to set up than other routers, and not everybody wanted to pay up for the privilege. But even on passthrough that Actiontec piece of crap is causing problems. I'm not saying that Verizon should support routers explicitly: just that they shouldn't disallow your use of a router and basically not release any information on how to do it.

More to the point, I'm questioning why on earth they would hobble a service with terrible hardware. Why would you advertise a high bandwidth connection, then constrain everybody's access to it through garbage hardware?

Because you don't care about the consumer. We have a lot of complaints on the Mac Pro forums here, but frankly,  doesn't know how to hate the consumer the way cable and telco companies do. Witness the loss of food network on Cablevision.

Now that this digression is in full swing, let me say that I'm completely okay with  making things configure-to-order, like Airport cards. CTO is a good compromise between people who want extras and people who don't want to pay more for it. Then some people can get their Blu-ray burner from  at the inflated price, while the rest of us can install our own far cheaper. All we want is the full software support package.

To summarize: We want some basic logic board capabilities expanded befitting what we expect from this workstation, which I listed previously, and the rest can be CTO options.
 
An Extra PCI-e x16 slot
6 Ram Slots Per Processor
SD Card Slot in front Bezel (integrated along with Power Button, USB/FW and Audio, etc)
Possible Bluray Drive
LightPeak (if released by that time)

Agreed, but we probably won't get lightpeak, usb3 if anything like that.
 
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