2013 MBA - No "Computer Sleep" Setting - WTF? - Here's Why

Discussion in 'MacBook Air' started by techn0lady, Jun 17, 2013.

  1. techn0lady macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #1
    OK I just got my new MBA and have been futzing around reinstalling everything when I noticed i had NO "computer sleep" setting in my energy saver pane - just "Display Sleep"

    WTF??
    Google gave me no answers so I just called Apple Support and they told me that in the new MBAs the "Display Sleep" functions as the computer sleep setting - they aren't independent. Changed due to new Haswell chipset.

    Just thought I'd put this out there and save you 30 mins of useless googeling sometime this week.
     
  2. Mrbobb macrumors 601

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    Aug 27, 2012
    #2
    I know Apple likes simple, austere etc, but a HD activity light and a sleep light, like all other laptops sure would skip all the silliness guessing.
     
  3. flight macrumors regular

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    Mar 4, 2010
    #3
    Yet it still lists "Put hard disks to sleep whenever possible." Is this for connected external hard drives?
     
  4. mayuka macrumors 6502a

    mayuka

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    Feb 15, 2009
    #4
    Have I understood this correctly?

    You can't independently set the timeout of the display to 5 minutes and the computer sleep to say 1 hour when using Haswell? :confused:
     
  5. scaredpoet macrumors 604

    scaredpoet

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    #5
    Yes it is.
     
  6. Mr. Retrofire macrumors 601

    Mr. Retrofire

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    #6
  7. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #7
    Yes :( People on the Apple support forums are starting to complain. In a related thread I posted how you can still do this via the terminal pmset command but for some reason, yet unknown to me, they took the UI away for that . :mad:
     
  8. mayuka macrumors 6502a

    mayuka

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    Feb 15, 2009
    #8
    That's a classic Apple redux. Whereas I absolutely agree that silly clutterish or even obsolete things can be removed, Apple has a tendency lately to remove practical and even important things. That annoys me. For example: All versions prior to ML (<10.8) had the option to ask for the user password after wake-up. In ML they removed the option and replaced it with a single option to ask for the password after a specific time period. That sucks. I want the computer to ask for a password when the lid is opened not when the screen went to sleep...

    ----------

    Thanks for the advice. I'll definetely try that when my 11" 2013 MBA arrives.
     
  9. Puonti macrumors 6502a

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    Mar 14, 2011
    #9
    Does the computer also go to sleep if you assign a "Hot Corner" to "Put Display to Sleep"?
     
  10. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #10
    The display blanks but I am unsure if the entire machine actually sleeps or not - I'll have to test in a different way for that.

    The thing is, as I'm sure you know, that sometimes you want the machine running a long time on battery power doing a task - but you don't need the display on and want to blank it out to conserve power. Sometimes you want that to be an automatic behavior and not have to use a hot corner. Currently Apple has no easy way to do that although I was able to get that behavior using the terminal pmset command ( and 30 minutes research).

    I'm still waiting to hear from any Apple source why this behavior was changed (or if its a bug)
     
  11. DavidC1, Jun 19, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2013

    DavidC1 macrumors member

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    Jul 26, 2006
    #11
    In the 4th Gen Core Haswell generation, the U and Y parts implement the S0iX power state.

    S0iX replaces both S0 and S3. S3 is your sleep mode where it suspends everything to RAM, while S0 is the active state, but can clock devices to minimal speed and such. S0iX is called "power use of S3 with wake time of S0". The biggest trick of Haswell is allowing wake up times that are near-instant when it used to take at least few seconds to do so. Think of Smartphones for example.

    That's why just turning off the Display is nearly same thing as the sleep we know. Since the hardware sans the display would use extremely low power just being idle.
     
  12. Puonti macrumors 6502a

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    Mar 14, 2011
    #12
    I'm interested to hear what your results are.

    Absolutely. I use both Hot Corners and the automatic display shut-off feature and am curious how these have changed with the move to Haswell. I'm currently considering switching from my 2010 iMac to a Macbook of some sort and although plugged-in clamshell mode does not appear to be affected, I wouldn't want to keep the laptop on external power whenever I'm sitting at the desk.

    Is there any chance you could test clamshell mode with an external display while on battery power?
     
  13. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #13
    Yes, I can do that - what do yu want me to look for - to test ?

    Also the poster above seems to say that with the new chipset that sleep mode is unnecessary - only display sleep. An interesting idea if true.
     
  14. Puonti macrumors 6502a

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    Mar 14, 2011
    #14
    I just realized that my understanding of the clamshell mode was incorrect - there actually is no battery-powered clamshell mode on Macbooks. Apple's own documentation mentions power adapter as a requirement for operating a Macbook in closed clamshell mode:

    http://support.apple.com/kb/ht3131

    So... never mind :)
     
  15. mayuka macrumors 6502a

    mayuka

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    Feb 15, 2009
    #15
    Lets assume you download a large file and the display is getting to sleep. Will the download continue? :confused:
     
  16. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #16
    Apparently so - I just tested that and things still go on in the background
     
  17. DavidC1 macrumors member

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    Jul 26, 2006
    #17
    That's actually the new sleep mode. It just wakes up so fast that you don't know it is. The wake up time certifications are under 300ms, or 0.3 seconds. At the lowest state, it does everything the normal sleep mode does, like moving contents into RAM.

    Interesting. :)

    That sounds similar to Windows 8 Connected Standby, and the new Mac feature Power Nap. The new sleep not only allows fast wake up times but for the network connection to be active - just like a Smartphone.
     
  18. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #18
    I tested it by running a torrent in the background, setting "display sleep" to 1 minute and a couple minutes after the display blanked out I checked the progress of the torrent and it was still running and connected.

    There still is a separate settable sleep mode setting in the terminal pmset command . I haven't actually tested whether that sleep mode kicks in or not at the allotted time setting.
     
  19. mayuka macrumors 6502a

    mayuka

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    Feb 15, 2009
    #19
    Would be very interesting indeed.

    I guess when you close the lid, the download would stop? :confused:
     
  20. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #20
    Yes - that is what happens.
    I am beginning to understand the change thanks to that great write up a few posts above that explained the new power states.
     
  21. knodi macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2013
    #21
    I have the same problem. I just got a new Macbook Air and did a restore from time-machine backup. I also don't have the "Computer sleep" setting.

    Same issue: http://i.imgur.com/N6PJF0W.png
     
  22. gloryunited macrumors 6502

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    Oct 29, 2010
    #22
    So closing the lid is not the same as sleep now?

    When would Power Nap work then? (Like all those background software updates and stuff)
     
  23. techn0lady thread starter macrumors regular

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    Apr 10, 2010
    #23
    No, if I understand DavidC1's great explanation above, closing the lid works (more or less) the same but it is that "Display Sleep" works a bit differently. Instead of just sleeping the display (if I understood correctly) the new Haswell chip set sends the overall system into a deeper power savings mode (in which running programs still work) rendering the "Computer sleep" setting unnecessary.

    Closing the lid puts things into the kind of sleep we've been used to before.

    Power nap is a different thing and I'm unsure of the specifics on that.
     
  24. knodi macrumors newbie

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    Jun 20, 2013
    #24
    Here is a temp fix. run the command "pmset sleep 180" to change sleep from 1 to 180 (180x of the display sleep time). This seems to work, macbook air won't fall a sleep 2x from the display sleep time.
     
  25. DavidC1, Jun 20, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2013

    DavidC1 macrumors member

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    Jul 26, 2006
    #25
    Power Nap actually needs Haswell's new power states to work. It does look like it already works without Mavericks though.

    If I remember right, I read something about the 2013 Air's that after closing the lid for more than 2 hours, it would go into something similar to a Hibernate state, where it uses zero power and moves contents from RAM to drive.

    UPDATE: That's actually what Apple's page says

    http://www.apple.com/macbook-air/design.html

    That's identical to the Hibernate function. So leave it less than 3 hours, then you get your regular sleep with virtually zero wake up time courtesy of Haswell. Leave it for longer than 3 hours, than you get Hibernate-like sleep where it uses virtually zero power.
     

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