2018 Mac mini Teardown: User-Upgradeable RAM, But Soldered Down CPU and Storage

[justperry]

Is that possible? I thought the bluetooth wire was connected to the mobo at one end, and the bottom cap on the other. One can't slide out the mobo to swap ram with that wire still attached, AFAIK

Correct, and 2 cables more, power and another one.

 

[Juicy Box]

this would probably require all 4 to be matched.

This has not been the case on many Macs. For example, the current 27" iMac has 4 slots, and do not require them to be matched.

Maybe I am miss understanding you.

 

[justperry]

Soldered SSD stinks 🙁

Does it really, iPhones have that too you know....😉

 

[lilrush]

The math has already been done elsewhere: it's worth getting a base iMac Pro vs a comparable Mac mini + eGPU + LG 5K monitor + mouse and keyboard.

That math was not done with a vega 64. Ive seen what you're talking about.

 

[Sabelonada]

This has not been the case on many Macs. For example, the current 27" iMac has 4 slots, and do not require them to be matched.

Maybe I am miss understanding you.

For best performance, memory is installed in matching pairs. That's why there are two 4GB chips instead of one 8GB chip.

Because for every person whining about the 8GB taking up two slots, there are many more people who won't ever upgrade their Mac mini and would get worse performance if one SODIMM were used. It's really the right thing for Apple to do when installing memory, installing a matching pair of SODIMMs.

 

[arkmannj]

So, I'm sure I know the answer to this... but here it goes.

I really like that we can replace the RAM, and overall I like the mac mini. If I outgrow the GPU then I could do an eGPU I guess.

But Soldered in Storage, wouldn't that prevent user upgrades AND also make repairs or Apple provided upgrades impossible and/or far more expensive? I'm just struggling to see the logic in soldering that in.

This would affect both directions.
If you have storage go out and you then need to replace the Mobo (and all the components on it).
The reverse also being true, If a soundchip or thunderbold/USB controller, etc. goes out you now lose your storage and data on it even though storage was not the issue.

Every Mac (desktop and laptop) I have owned I have needed to replace the storage at some point, so this is concerning.

 

[justperry]

For best performance, memory is installed in matching pairs. That's why there are two 4GB chips instead of one 8GB chip.

Because for every person whining about the 8GB taking up two slots, there are many more people who won't ever upgrade their Mac mini and would get worse performance if one SODIMM were used. It's really the right thing for Apple to do when installing memory, installing a matching pair of SODIMMs.

Genuine question, why is that the case?

So, I'm sure I know the answer to this... but here it goes.

I really like that we can replace the RAM, and overall I like the mac mini. If I outgrow the GPU then I could do an eGPU I guess.

But Soldered in Storage, wouldn't that prevent user upgrades AND also make repairs or Apple provided upgrades impossible and/or far more expensive? I'm just struggling to see the logic in soldering that in.

This would affect both directions.
If you have storage go out and you then need to replace the Mobo (and all the components on it).
The reverse also being true, If a soundchip or thunderbold/USB controller, etc. goes out you now lose your storage and data on it even though storage was not the issue.

Every Mac (desktop and laptop) I have owned I have needed to replace the storage at some point, so this is concerning.

SSD's are far less prone to failure, especially MLC and even better SLC SSD's, they outlive your Mac easily.

 

[greenmeanie]

Really I didn't know that lol
I guess that is why I couldn't get my Hard drive to fit in it.

Does it really, iPhones have that too you know....😉

 

[iosuser]

No, it's def Apple's fault. How is this in any way a 'Pro' solution?

That totally triggers my OCD 😱
[doublepost=1541799179][/doublepost]

Genuine question, why is that the case?

Running the RAM in pairs allow for dual channel operation with higher memory bandwidth. It mainly benefits the onboard GPU. You’re not going to notice a difference in say Safari.

 

[cult hero]

Glad the RAM can be upgraded. It's the number one killer when it comes to extending the life of a machine. For the last few years I've always purchased my machines with the max RAM, but that's because they've been laptops.

For me, the main time upgrading the RAM makes sense is when I'm buying used. I tend to run with new machines since my laptop is my professional computer and I like warranties and just can't get worked up over a few hundred on a one-every-three-or-so-years purchase. However, when I am directing friends or family what want a more casual use machine, it's always used. For laptops, I've found the SSD is been more limiting than RAM these days, but on desktops it's all about the RAM. Adding external storage to a desktop is simply no big deal. It might harm the aesthetic a bit, but these days the only reason I tend to have a desktop laying around is external storage.

I've added a second drive to my current mini and swapped out a dead SSD twice (never getting an OWC SSD again). The RAM swap here looks easier.

I really think these glued/soldered on SSDs is a seriously douche move though. I get integration and all, but for a company that pays lip service to environmental concerns, not being able to update the storage on these machines greatly reduces the lifespan of all but the most expensive models.

 

[Sabelonada]

Genuine question, why is that the case?

I don't know all the details, but it's to enable dual channel memory and increase the memory bandwidth.

 

[arkmannj]

...
SSD's are far less prone to failure, especially MLC and even better SLC SSD's, they outlive your Mac easily.

I hope that to be true for future macs but even devices purchased as recent as 2014 (machine is a 2014 model, I don't remember if it was purchased 2014 or 2015) have needed to have the SSD replaced.

 

[twistedpixel8]

Why can’t a soldered SSD be removed and a new one soldered in it’s place?

I could be wrong but I THINK it’s because Apple uses custom SSDs that you can’t buy as a consumer.

 

[PJivan]

If you're running any OS without antivirus in 2018 then you are clueless.....

Wow Google and Apple itself are clueless than, not sure about Facebook but I would be surprise if they run antivirus on their mac.

And why 2018 is different from say, 2012.
[doublepost=1541802973][/doublepost]

So, I'm sure I know the answer to this... but here it goes.

I really like that we can replace the RAM, and overall I like the mac mini. If I outgrow the GPU then I could do an eGPU I guess.

But Soldered in Storage, wouldn't that prevent user upgrades AND also make repairs or Apple provided upgrades impossible and/or far more expensive? I'm just struggling to see the logic in soldering that in.

This would affect both directions.
If you have storage go out and you then need to replace the Mobo (and all the components on it).
The reverse also being true, If a soundchip or thunderbold/USB controller, etc. goes out you now lose your storage and data on it even though storage was not the issue.

Every Mac (desktop and laptop) I have owned I have needed to replace the storage at some point, so this is concerning.

why would you loose data? I never lost data and if I did it would be my fault, but since you guys are burning ssd like crasy and writing tb every day and MLC is no different can’t you use one of the thunderbolt port you paid to plug beloved samsung ssd on it? I don’t think anyone runs computer without backup so you can plug 2ss in the esternal enclosure and use one of them as primary and the other as backup

 

[twistedpixel8]

As vocal as the techy type like us can be... the reality is that a very small percentage of users ever upgrade anything in their computers. They buy something that works for them, and their use case doesn't change very much in the several years they use it. This debate comes up all the time... and over the years I've seen people link to a lot of statistics about what a small percentage of people ever upgrade.
Reading the complaints here make or sound like 'everyine' wants/needs upgradeability. And for most of the people that frequent a site like this, that may be true. But us users here are the exception, not the rule.

That is completely beside the point and looking at it the wrong way. Apple bang on about how much they care about the environment and yet they create machines that cannot have their life extended once a part fails. If they made it extremely simple for users to upgrade/replace components in their machines, more people would do it, or pay their local repair company to do it for them. I guarantee that.
[doublepost=1541803379][/doublepost]

Just curious, what is locking you into the system and why can't you switch to PC? Is it required for your job? Are you an iOS developer? Or is it really the average Apple fanboy's hatred of PC that has "locked" you in?

They have the best operating system currently available. That’s what’s locking us in. The only alternative system Adobe software runs on is Windows (which is awful). That’s what’s locking us in. We have other devices that integrate very usefully into our workflows with macOS. That’s what’s locking us in. Are you getting it?

 

[PJivan]

That is completely beside the point and looking at it the wrong way. Apple bang on about how much they care about the environment and yet they create machines that cannot have their life extended once a part fails. If they made it extremely simple for users to upgrade/replace components in their machines, more people would do it, or pay their local repair company to do it for them. I guarantee that.

They recicle almost everything from the boards they get back,

That is completely beside the point and looking at it the wrong way. Apple bang on about how much they care about the environment and yet they create machines that cannot have their life extended once a part fails. If they made it extremely simple for users to upgrade/replace components in their machines, more people would do it, or pay their local repair company to do it for them. I guarantee that.
[doublepost=1541803379][/doublepost]

They have the best operating system currently available. That’s what’s locking us in. The only alternative system Adobe software runs on is Windows (which is awful). That’s what’s locking us in. We have other devices that integrate very usefully into our workflows with macOS. That’s what’s locking us in. Are you getting it?

So Apple hase locked you inn because you don’t like other Os? So Mercedes lock me to them because I like their cars? Ok..

Btw they do recycle the boards, yes they want to make money from repair, yes they are greedy.

Also user touching computer it’s pretty scarry, what precautions do you take when you install your components? I bet 95% of the people just pick them up and plug them inside.

 

[twistedpixel8]

They recicle almost everything from the boards they get back,


So Apple hase locked you inn because you don’t like other Os? So Mercedes lock me to them because I like their cars? Ok..

Btw they do recycle the boards, yes they want to make money from repair, yes they are greedy.

Also user touching computer it’s pretty scarry, what precautions do you take when you install your components? I bet 95% of the people just pick them up and plug them inside.

You, sir, are a buffoon.

 

[imageWIS]

That math was not done with a vega 64. Ive seen what you're talking about.

iMac Pro w/ Vega 64: $5,599.00

Mac Mini with same amount of RAM and SSD as the iMac Pro + 6-Core 17 + 10 Gigabit Ethernet = $2,599.00 + LG UltraFine 5K 27" ($1,299.95) + Blackmagic eGPU (which is only a Vega 56 and not a 64) ($1,199.00) + Magic Mouse 2 Space Gray ($99) + Magic Keyboard Space Gray ($149) = $5347.

For an extra $252 you get a better GPU and a better CPU with 2 extra cores. It's a no brainer.

 

[lilrush]

iMac Pro w/ Vega 64: $5,599.00

Mac Mini with same amount of RAM and SSD as the iMac Pro + 6-Core 17 + 10 Gigabit Ethernet = $2,599.00 + LG UltraFine 5K 27" ($1,299.95) + Blackmagic eGPU (which is only a Vega 56 and not a 64) ($1,199.00) + Magic Mouse 2 Space Gray ($99) + Magic Keyboard Space Gray ($149) = $5347.

For an extra $252 you get a better GPU and a better CPU with 2 extra cores. It's a no brainer.

Lol at blackmagic GPU.
Razercore with vega 64. Upgrade ram yourself.

 

[steve333]

Soldering down what should be easily replaceable parts is inexcusable, both from a consumer and environmental point of view.

 

[patentshark]

Really?? I can think of three reasons to replace the native drive:
1. Outgrow your storage
2. The native drive is lousy
3. Net cost of a 3rd party is less

As to 1, if 2TB isn’t enough, you should probably be looking at external storage options.
As to 2, I’m sure it isn’t.
As to 3, might well be, but deal breaker over maybe a couple of hundred bucks?

I also prefer swappable drive and have done so on my 2012 Mini (loving the OWC Mercury), but I don’t understand not buying a new Mini over this. Am I missing something?

Net cost of the SSD is the biggest problem.
I don't know what "couple of hundred bucks" you are referring to. Apple charges $800 for upgrade to 1TB SSD (more than the cost of the Mac Mini ) and $1600 for upgrade to 2TB SSD!

For comparison:
- 1TB Samsung 860 EVO M.2 SATA SSD sells for $163
- 1TB Crucial NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD sells for $220

These are retail prices for a single unit on Amazon.com as of today. You would think the cost to Apple of similar SSD options would be significantly less.

128GB is a ridiculous amount of base storage for a desktop in this day and age.

 

[Onexy]

Why can’t a soldered SSD be removed and a new one soldered in it’s place?

Soldering is a lot easier and cheaper when done by machines in the manufacturing process. The manual process takes expensive labor for making sure the solder joints are perfect.

 

[kingofwale]

the difference in price between 8gb ram and 16gb is 70 dollars on amazon.


Apple charges 200 dollars for that.


F*** YOU, you greedy bastard.

 

[PJivan]

You, sir, are a buffoon.

I’m when I retype your logic, so please don’t let me steal your show again.

 

[jbekin800]

Now that the RAM is not soldered so that's nice but who really cares about the SSD or CPU? It comes with a huge assortment of plugs - thunderbolt or regular USB and if you have any issues with that SSD, you can easily replace it or it's the external is Time Machinesd, you can just switch over instead of having to crack it open, insert a drive and hoping that's the issue or isnt it easier just to plug in an external? and the CPU? Come on - it's not 1996 where you "might" want to spend $500 to upgrade a $2,500 PC - you really going to spend $400 to fix a $799 Mac Mini CPU in 2028? If you need the speed, you can spend $400-$600 for the GPU external or of course, buy a faster mac anyway. It's AN OPTION.