24" Wacom Cintiq Touch HD or 13" Cintiq for ID

Discussion in 'Design and Graphics' started by hulk2012, May 18, 2014.

  1. hulk2012 macrumors 6502

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    #1
    Im a industrial designer 3rd student as well as photographer and thinking of upgrading my intuos4 to Cintiq - 13" HD or 24" HD touch. What are your thoughts on that?
     
  2. Jim Campbell macrumors 6502a

    Jim Campbell

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    #2
    If you're using Adobe products, I believe that they don't play very well with the touch features of the 24HD Touch, reducing the feature to a massively expensive gimmick.

    The plain 24HD however, is a nice piece of kit. Over the years, I've used the 12WX, 21UX and 24HD. I found the smallest one a dissatisfying experience, feeling very much as though you're peering at small areas of your document through a little window. The 21UX was decent, but I prefer the ergonomics of the 24HD, which feels very much like working on a traditional document on a drawing board.

    Hope that's some help…
     
  3. chaosbunny macrumors 68000

    chaosbunny

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    #3
    I have the 13" hd since february and I'm very happy with it. Considering the price it makes the most sense in my opinion, since it has pretty much the same resolution as the bigger ones. When I'm drawing I'm very close to the screen and with 1920x1080 on 13" I can't see any pixels. And it is about the same size as an A4 sheet I would draw on with a pencil.
     
  4. hulk2012, May 19, 2014
    Last edited: May 19, 2014

    hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #4
    24" Wacom Cintiq Touch HD or 13" Cintiq for ID


    Don't play well? Really? Yeah I will mainly use for Photoshop cc, illustrator or idraw, modo and maybe other 3d softwares and obviously good old sketchbook pro

    I love touch gestures and would love to get the 24" touch as compared to 22" and keep rotating it with cables. I'm planning to replace my 2nd 27" iMac (late 2009) which I just use as secondary display with Cintiq 24". I'm using intuos4 but hate getting back to the keyboard or keep rotating small circle button just to increase the pens size or rotate the canvas. Doing a 3d modeling is even more pain in a butt. Being able to rotate, increase brush size and more by using my 2nd hand which is free anyway lol is for me massive time saver and would speed up my workflow. I do edit photos, sketch and draw as well as sculpture models in 3d softwares for example..
     
  5. Jim Campbell macrumors 6502a

    Jim Campbell

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    #5
    Ah, no — ignore me. Sounds like Adobe and Wacom have fixed whatever issues I'd been hearing about. Old info — sorry!
     
  6. hulk2012, May 19, 2014
    Last edited: May 19, 2014

    hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #6
    24" Wacom Cintiq Touch HD or 13" Cintiq for ID


    You mean touch interface works fine? I've heard few rumours sometime ago but wasn't sure whether they still exist or not.

    Do you also use it as 2nd screen? Any lag?

    How u finding drawing on it compare to other Wacom non Cintiq tablets?
     
  7. Jim Campbell macrumors 6502a

    Jim Campbell

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    #7
    I don't have a Touch model — I wanted one, but got bored waiting for them to release it and sprung for a 24HD only for Wacom to bring out the Touch version a few months later. (Turned out it was out of my price range anyway!)

    There were a lot of complaints at the end of last year about the touch features either being unreliable or just not working with Adobe products, but those seem to have cleared up now.

    As I said in my previous post further up-thread, I've used 12WX, 21UX and 24HD and the 24HD is hands down my preferred model. (Mapping document rotate to the left hand wheel comfortably meets that need, although pinch-to-zoom would be nice…)

    I'm currently using the 24HD as my main screen, driven by a MacBook Air which acts as my second screen and there's no brush lag in Photoshop or MangaStudio. I have hooked up a third screen via DisplayLink over USB and there was some brush slowdown at that point, but none in normal use.
     
  8. hulk2012, May 20, 2014
    Last edited: May 20, 2014

    hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #8
    24" Wacom Cintiq Touch HD or 13" Cintiq for ID




    I see I see. Well if I sacrifice one iMac and and $1500 - this big buddy and me will get together and who knows.. Maybe we will become a couple one day. Let me tell you this: if I make step 1, i normally do make step 2.
    Buying Cintiq to have natural sketch ability is one thing. Adding multitouch is another. Both combine makes Cintiq a complete tool to me. Can't imaging rotating small wheels to adjust things or turning the whole thing to rotate etc. If Cintiq meant to help me - nothing can come between me and the device in terms of interaction. Less buttons the better. More intuitive the better. More touch gestures the better. It has to be extension of my mind and soul not hands. Design around me in mind. And i think the touch model gets quite close. Extension of my hands would turn Cintiq to a manual device which i can have by buying intros pro (having 4 at the moment).
     
  9. librarian macrumors regular

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    Sep 24, 2011
    #9
    I own a 22HD touch and a cintiq 13 model, and have used the 24hd for a while. I prefer the 22hd over the 24 because you can rotate it up to 90 degrees, and because of the Touch strips on the back like the older classic 21" cintiq (for brush size/zoom/rotate), has a lot of hotkeys but that's just a personal preference.
    Performance wise they're similar: nearly the same resolution, same feeling on the surface, same pen and sensitivity.
    The 24 has a higher quality display, and is HUGE (you need a lot of desk space) and it has less hotkeys compared to the 22.
    The 24 weights a lot, you need a second person to move it around, while the 22 is similar to a 27" iMac weight and bulk.
    The touch inputs are very useful for 3d applications and I use them often (touch rotate and scale are great and much more precise than dragging around the pen + hotkeys).
    I dont use touch controls on 2d applications such as photoshop, the hotkeys are more convenient most of the time for me.
    The 13" model is just amazing. The display quality is fantastic and has a good level of comfort. It Also has less parallax than the 24 and the 22, and sketching on it is more natural, not to mention that you can easily carry it with you with you when you need it.
    If you are tight on cash the 22 and the 13 have the best value, personally I think the 24hd touch is overpriced.
    I recommend you to try all the models to see wich one is more comfortable for your needs before investing the cash :)
     
  10. NST macrumors newbie

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    May 22, 2014
    #10
    Stop and think!

    Unless you have actually tested one of these and you're happy with them, DO NOT get any of the Cintiq models if you are a photographer!!!!!!!!!

    I'm a graphic designer / photographer and I spent months reviewing online the 24HD Touch, looking at all the pro's and cons, watching countless Youtube videos on the product etc. I decided to take the plunge, kept it for two weeks and then sent it back for a full refund.....just upgraded my Intuos instead

    I'll start with the good stuff:

    Its SOLID, the build quality is absolutely brilliant. It just feels right, very industrial and 'tool' like. Its a joy to use and adjust, although the buttons on the top right of the screen bevel are a pain in the ass and unusable - apart from that, I couldnt fault the engineering itself. Oh, its massive...truly massive and very heavy.

    I like the screen estate personally. I do a lot of broad strokes in my design work so its nice having the large canvas, and its also nice having youre entire field of view occupied/absorbed, its an engaging experience. Its also v useful for photography working on the larger screen, simply being able to see a lot more of your shot is great!

    Its also very good for parties - boost up itunes and go full screen, you have yourself a touch screen duke box ;)

    VERY responsive. I was worried about delay/lag and a slight feeling of disconnect when using the pen directly on the screens - none existent, its beautifully 'connected' and although there is a slight jump in sensation coming from a traditional tablet, you soon get very accustomed to the screen experience. There was no delay at all and its really quite amazing seeing your work just flow out of the pen like real ink etc! You find yourself chuckling to yourself quite a lot!

    Oh, and its really good with Adobe CC, I used it a lot with P.S and A.i and all the packaged custom brushes specifically designed for Wacom products work brilliantly. A strong recommendation for designers out there, if youre interested in Cintiqs, Coral Painter is a DREAM to use on them - perfect harmony and tons of fun!

    Photography - I'll come on to this in a moment

    What else is good......Uhmmmm......it comes in a huge box which would make an excellent house for your kids

    And now the bad. All of the above becomes null and void as soon as you switch this monster on.

    The screen is awful, just utterly completely catastrophically awful. When I switched on for the first time, I sighed, looked at my girlfriend and said "great, its broken". Talk about disappointed! You'd think a product costing the best part of a months wages, advertising itself as HD and being targeted towards high end pro users would be astonishingly good. The point of this thing is to engage with the screen right?

    Apparently not. I've had better looking screens for under £150, ten years ago.

    Everything looks dull, flat, no 'pop' at all despite trying every which way to calibrate. But worse than that its pixel density, its completely pathetic! Honestly, I can't understand how Wacom put this out to market, its embarrassingly bad and completely distracts you from doing the work. I just spent the whole time groaning and looking up at my beautiful 27" Apple display, then back to the Wacom and thinking "I'm sure I'll get used to it"

    I never did, and if like me your work relies heavily on detail and complete accuracy, then I'd totally avoid the Cintiq's until Wacom get right up to speed on their screen resolutions. With retina displays and 4k screens in the mix, the 24" HD touch looks like a dinosaur in comparison. I understand that touch enabled screens are a different beast (and at 24" might be pushing the tech a bit) but the cost of this model, for the crapola resolution that you get is unjustifiable.

    Its THAT bad, and its a real shame because apart from the very sub standard screen, it was a complete joy to use.

    Side note, I hardly used the touch functionality other than when using certain tools in PS to actually paint with my fingers (that was good fun, but hardly worth spending an extra 1k for). If you are used to Intuos, you know how easy it is to customise the buttons, youre really not missing out if you dont get the touch model.

    So there you go. I had a guy come and look at my Cintiq to make sure it wasnt actually faulty, and he said it was working perfectly fine. There is a slight screen fuzz in any case, I think its some kind of coating to give the screen a little bit of tooth for the pen (it needs more tooth really, but I guess that would screw things up even more) but its really not this fuzz thats the problem here, its the resolution itself.

    My best advice would be to absolutely 100% try these models out before you buy. Not many retailers will stock them given their cost, so it might be worth trying to get to a trade fair, see where Wacom will be and go and have a look. But don't do what I did. If you rely on these for your work, especially if you are a photographer or a designer (and you're very anal about the fine detail!) then I'd stay well away from the Cintiq 24HD (HD!!!! As IF!!!!).

    Hope that helps!
     
  11. hulk2012, May 22, 2014
    Last edited: May 22, 2014

    hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #11
    24" Wacom Cintiq Touch HD or 13" Cintiq for ID

    @NST don't know where to start. I think "those" who keep saying:"amazing quality screen" maybe never work on retina screen or iMac 27" (cinema display). I do graphic design/web design, photography and product design (making beats sometimes also). I own two 27" iMacs as well as 15" MacBook Pro retina. I work on Capture One Pro. I shoot with 36mp Nikon D800 (almost medium format). All that just to be precise paying the attention to slightest details. And I'm not even the capitalising yet. Just mastering the skills for years really. About to come out to start "biting" real soon once my use of the light standard is higher (few more months of practise).

    So that's how I roll. I believe in quality therefore Cintiq touch HD was ideal but after reading your review I might upgrade my intuos 4 to 5 just for touch capabilities.

    Thanks for your time and input. Really appreciate.
     
  12. NST macrumors newbie

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    May 22, 2014
    #12
    I don't know what the newer smaller Cintiqs are like for resolution, but the big brother just doesnt cut it unfortunately.

    If you're shooting on a D800, I think the 24" would drive you crazy. I use a Sigma Merrill DP3 (also close to medium format) and on the 24 Cintiq I spent most of my time Switching the images back to my Apple Display to see how they 'really looked' - on the Cintiq they looked dreadful.

    Like I say, its a damn shame because the engineering of the thing is first class and it feels like a bit of a design icon actually, something you could imagine using for many many years. I just can't understand how Wacom can consider this a HD screen at all, its not even close.

    I don't know what panels Apple use (probably Sharp) but if Wacom could somehow make the same panel into a tablet they would have an incredible machine.

    Likewise, if Apple re-formatted the design of the Imac so it was hinged on a floating arm like the Cintiq, and made the screen touchable/pen friendly....now that would be quite something!

    But yes, overall the 24HD touch was a big fat disappointment. Always try before you buy though, I'll remember that. For some people, they will LOVE this thing. It just made my eyes go crazy :cool:
     
  13. hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #13
    You on point here mate. What's your portfolio details btw?
     
  14. NST macrumors newbie

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    May 22, 2014
    #14
    I don't have a photography folio online, but you can find my design site here

    http://bit.ly/1nuvLeC

    Sorry for the cryptic links, I just dont really want my business site posting on a forum if you get my drift!
     
  15. hulk2012 thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #15

    No probs. Tell u what - i will actually wait for something better to come on the market and stick to my intuos4 and also get proper Adonis pen for my iPad Air to use with sketchbook pro, artrage and others.
     
  16. Acorn, May 24, 2014
    Last edited: May 31, 2014

    Acorn macrumors 68020

    Acorn

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    #16
    The 24HD is to big. Your essentially buying a desk. I would choose option 3. The cintiq companion hybrid. This will give you 13HD functionality plus touch screen functionality. Using it as a portable android device is just a bonus. Its about the size of a sheet of paper so if your comfortable working on a sheet of paper the hybrid companion shouldn't be a problem.
     
  17. james777 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2007
    #17
    Good for 3-D graphics? 24" Cintig

    Due to severe tendinitis after years of therapy I'm looking for something other than using the mouse for graphics. I was thinking about getting one of these so I can discard using the mouse because I can no longer do fine motor movements with mouse. I'm mainly going to use it for 3d such as Modo 3d or Maya on the PC Side. Any advice

    Thanks
     
  18. librarian macrumors regular

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    Sep 24, 2011
    #18
    I think an Intuos Pro M may be better for you, because those programs rely heavily on keyboard commands.
    With a Cintiq you have to use a keyboard sideways and that can be uncomfortable and very stressful.
     

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