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27" iMac Hard Drive Noise

gnasher729 said:
Well, that's really smart. You just got a new iMac, turned it on, so the first thing it will do is build its Spotlight index. And it does that when it notices that you haven't been doing anything for a while (because it doesn't slow your machine down while you are doing something). And at some point, after an hour or so, it will start running at full speed.

So you shut your Mac down. And turned it on. Guess what happens when you turn it on: It finds an incomplete Spotlight index. And it does the same thing again. And you start "troubleshooting" when all you need is a bit of patience. It will go away by itself. The more you "troubleshoot" and mess with it, the longer it will take.
Click to expand...

How do you know spotlight is building it's index? I thought it would show an indication when you click on the spotlight icon right? (and you wouldn't be able to search). So that's not the issue here if so.
 
frenchie0101 said:
Is anyone noticing if there hard drive is making an annoying noise, ive gone from the 24" which had a 640gb in and all of sudden with the 27" im getting loud hard drive noise, i have time machine backing up which goes to the time capsule.... and lets say i open up iphoto it goes into a bit of frenzy..anyone got similar noises
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Hi,
Pleased to say I got my i7 yesterday. Sorry to say I have the sound also-to me it's like a faint heart beat-regular then irregular. It is NOT a minor detail for me & very different & louder than the noise from a keyboard.
Spoke to Apple this morning-very helpful man could hear it over the phone & said it should NOT be making that noise. Did some repair disk permissions on the disk & also from the installation disk-there were loads of 'unable to find...' messages that were then repaired. At that stage the noise stopped BUT on restart it was back again.


He said it sounded like a faulty hard disk. I'm now waiting for an RMA & they've ordered a replacement straightaway.

Currently I'm wiping the disk (I transferred files from my old iMac) & reinstalling Snow Leopard ready for its return. Be interesting to see if the noise has gone-I'll let you know.
All the best,
Roger
 
rogerram said:
Hi,
Pleased to say I got my i7 yesterday. Sorry to say I have the sound also-to me it's like a faint heart beat-regular then irregular. It is NOT a minor detail for me & very different & louder than the noise from a keyboard.
Spoke to Apple this morning-very helpful man could hear it over the phone & said it should NOT be making that noise. Did some repair disk permissions on the disk & also from the installation disk-there were loads of 'unable to find...' messages that were then repaired. At that stage the noise stopped BUT on restart it was back again.


He said it sounded like a faulty hard disk. I'm now waiting for an RMA & they've ordered a replacement straightaway.

Currently I'm wiping the disk (I transferred files from my old iMac) & reinstalling Snow Leopard ready for its return. Be interesting to see if the noise has gone-I'll let you know.
All the best,
Roger
Click to expand...

I've already done a reinstall, it doesn't make a difference. Can you tell me, do they ship the new unit to you and can you keep the old one until you receive it?
 
wesleyh said:
I've already done a reinstall, it doesn't make a difference. Can you tell me, do they ship the new unit to you and can you keep the old one until you receive it?
Click to expand...

They've ordered a new one for me that I hope will not take that long. I should get an RMA within 24 hours. Then get a call from the carrier next week for the old one to be picked up. We're away then so the pickup won't be until the week after at the earliest. So I guess you could arrange the pickup after you've got the new one. I ordered mine by phone direct from the Apple education store in UK.
Hope this helps..
Roger
 
rogerram said:
They've ordered a new one for me that I hope will not take that long. I should get an RMA within 24 hours. Then get a call from the carrier next week for the old one to be picked up. We're away then so the pickup won't be until the week after at the earliest. So I guess you could arrange the pickup after you've got the new one. I ordered mine by phone direct from the Apple education store in UK.
Hope this helps..
Roger
Click to expand...

The problem is I ordered from the apple business store, there is no 14 day return policy on there (I did not know that), would they still agree to an exchange? What is an RMA anyway?
 
wesleyh said:
The problem is I ordered from the apple business store, there is no 14 day return policy on there (I did not know that), would they still agree to an exchange? What is an RMA anyway?
Click to expand...

It's a Return Merchandise Authorisation. Don't know about apple business-here in the UK we've got a legislation protection where stuff has to be 'fit for purpose'. Personally with some work I do I need reasonable quiet & the HD noise on my iMac is not reasonable as the gent at Apple agreed. Play iTunes reminds me of the advice for someone with noise from an old banger (car that is!)-turn the radio up and forget it. My iMac is a beautiful machine, not an old banger, and we've a right to expect a reasonably quiet bit of kit. I'm typing this on my MBP & I can hear a slight noise that is not in the least off putting.
My HD is a Seagate & there's a similar thread on AppleInsider.
Good luck,
Roger
 
rogerram said:
It's a Return Merchandise Authorisation. Don't know about apple business-here in the UK we've got a legislation protection where stuff has to be 'fit for purpose'. Personally with some work I do I need reasonable quiet & the HD noise on my iMac is not reasonable as the gent at Apple agreed. Play iTunes reminds me of the advice for someone with noise from an old banger (car that is!)-turn the radio up and forget it. My iMac is a beautiful machine, not an old banger, and we've a right to expect a reasonably quiet bit of kit. I'm typing this on my MBP & I can hear a slight noise that is not in the least off putting.
My HD is a Seagate & there's a similar thread on AppleInsider.
Good luck,
Roger
Click to expand...

im really thinking there is nothing wrong with the hdd's i have had 2 base 27" with the same noisy HDD in which both have gone back, tonight i am picking up my i5 if thats just as noisy well i shall be accepting whats meant to be, even though i am one of the most pickiest people you can come across, but at the same time i dont want to be without a mac for any longer
 
Kronie said:
Maybe the 27" enclosure somehow amplifies the sound of the disk?
Click to expand...

yeah could be, but whats annoying apple care just say they should not make a noise!! well i know thats untrue cause all hdd's make noise its how you notice it but the ones in the base model was just unacceptable especially when you in a complete sound cut off area
 
Would it in any way be possible to get a new imac and request (via telephone) that it does not contain the seagate drive? I'm unsure that would be possible, but it seems the problem is to do with the seagate drive and just ordering another imac there's still a big chance you'll get another seagate.
 
wesleyh said:
Would it in any way be possible to get a new imac and request (via telephone) that it does not contain the seagate drive? I'm unsure that would be possible, but it seems the problem is to do with the seagate drive and just ordering another imac there's still a big chance you'll get another seagate.
Click to expand...

the 2 bases i had both drives were western digital??
 
Long post while I wait on hold with Apple........

I'm talking to Brian at support now. As soon as I explained my problem he he said he was going to put me on hold and check to see if there was any known issues.

He came back with a no, (Sounds like he has had this call before)? He put me on hold again to see if the company wants my iMac back as part of some retrieval of bad Macs. They didn't. Maybe they already have a handful?

Anyway, did a few tests and he tells me that the iMac shouldn't make any noises like I have and the drive should be dead silent. He is now saying that if I had Applecare I could have had someone come to my house and look at the iMac. He wants me to drive two hours to the closest apple repair place. I told him I HAVE Applecare for the first year and he is saying no, I only have a warranty. ??

I came back with "then just set me up for a replacement" and now he is checking to see if they can get an override and have someone come out to my house.

Ok, so no home support, No biggie really because I really just want a replacement. I am now transferred to sales, who is telling me that I should be talking to customer support.

I'm going to hit Apple up for a 2 TB drive for all of this hassle.


So I'm now transferred back to apple care (even though I technically don't have apple care) An Applecare manager, Steve, basically tells me I can get a new replacement machine. Didn't we already know that?

OK, so I'm now on hold again. I'm being transferred to "sales" where I will set up my replacement......and hit them up for the 2TB drive!

Brandy....has a sense of humor! I told her my drive sounds like a hungry grumbling stomach and she says, "why don't you feed it"? HA...

I'm getting a replacement. I just hit her up for the 2TB drive! She played totally dumb. "So wait I don't understand, you want to just send you a 2TB drive" I said "no I want Apple to bump me up to the 2TB drive free for sending me a bunk computer and spending 2 1/2 hours on the phone with Apple".

She said "she can put it in the notes" which is basically a "I don't want to deal with it"

I said "can you maybe ask a manager"? I know if it doesn't happen when I order, it aint happening.

I'm on hold again.......

No 2 TB drive but there crediting me $150.00 off the replacement! Even better as I didn't really want the 2TB drive. i just wanted the freebee.

The problem is that besides the drives occasional grumbling sound this machine is PERFECT! And I don't know if its a good idea to get a replacement and get a 2nd iMac that may have the same problem OR a different one....decisions, decisions.
 
Seems like the disk activity issue already exists a long time: (and we're just hearing it because of the loud HD) So in theory this could be fixed by a software update.. Still, I'd much rather have a quieter HD, and this issue already exists for more than a year so I doubt apple cares..

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2215418
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1795939&start=0&tstart=0
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=7163537&#7163537
http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=10019511

Perhaps someone could try the following?

Yes, use smartmontools (installation instructions below)

This is a terrible problem and we should be clamoring to our hard-disk manufacturers to ask them to fix it.

To find out if this problem effects you, do the following:

Somebody earlier suggested downloading fink, and then installing "smartmontools" that way.
But you don't have to download "fink" to do this. (fink is a huge installation and l'm not sure how well it is supported anymore -no offense to those who work on fink- I haven't looked at fink in a while.)

These next steps require you to log in as root and use a terminal. I tend to give verbose instructions. I hope that doesn't bother anyone.

You will have to install Xcode (another big installation, see below).

1) Install Xcode.
This should be included on your operating system DVD.
Or you can download it from
http://developer.apple.com/tools/download/

2) Go to:
http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net/

3) Download the source-code-tarball at
http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net/download.html
Click on the "Second Option")
(You get an ad. The link to actually download anything is hard to find. It's in the upper-right corner)

4) You can unpack it either by double-clicking it, or by entering the command:
tar -f smartmontools-5.38.tar -xv
from the directory where the .tar file was downloaded to (probably ~/Downloads)

5) Enter the newly created directory. In the terminal enter:
cd smartmontools-5.38
(Of course, the number "5.38" may be different depending on the version you downloaded.)

6) This next step is probably optional (but I want to reproduce exactly what I did). Enter:
sudo mkdir /usr/local/sbin
sudo mkdir /usr/local/etc

7) Compile the program using the following commands:

./configure
make
sudo make install

8) Now, in the shell, enter:
/usr/local/sbin/smartctl -a /dev/disk0

This will print out a lot of information. Scroll to the line that says "193 Load_Cycle_Count":
When I do this, I get:
193 Load_Cycle_Count 0x0032 167 167 000 Old_age Always - 100113

That last number, (in my case 100113 !!) is the load cycle count. (I've had my hard drive about 4.5 months. Divided by the number of days I have been using my laptop, that's over 1000 cycles per day. It should not be anywhere near that high.

So please try this procedure on your apple laptop. If you are getting more than a hundred load cycles per day, please complain to your hard drive manufacturer about it. They need to fix this!

(Incidentally, I have been running ubuntu on this computer most of the time, so the high load-cycle-count doesn't appear to be related to OSX or leopard. It's the hardware manufacturer's fault.)
Click to expand...

..

I chose to vent about it in my own blog...
http://dougitdesign.com/blog.html
___________________________________________________
12.5.08: Does your notebook computer's hard drive (HDD) ever sound like little mice are playing table tennis inside of it? Or, why your HDD is pre-programmed for quick failure.

[I might start writing a monthly anti-Apple column as a new means to add content to this blog. I have a backlog of personal gripes about Apple of late, and this would be a great palace to vent and rant.]

My most recent and fresh complaint with Apple has to do with an annoying clicking sound coming from the hard drive (HDD) of my early 2008 Macbook. This is not to be confused with a much louder and constant clicking sound of a soon-to-fail HDD. This is a more subtile, yet annoying click that is most obvious when the computer is not under heavy processing use. I just purchased this product directly from Apple as a refurbished unit. Although the machine is technically a refurb., it is actually completely new, at least the HDD was, as that is easy to check. This "click" sound is yet another example of when a "bug" is actually considered a "feature."

It turns out that this "clicking" is part of a "power management system" that functions to save energy and, more importantly, generate less heat. For every "click" what is happening is the heads of the HDD are parking, and the disk platters begin to stop spinning. But then the HDD's heads quickly unpark, and then park again, and then unpark, and sometimes this happens every couple of seconds and becomes very annoying. It is most especially annoying when using a notebook computer in a very quiet setting. The click(s) can sound just like a ping pong ball being dropped on a hard surface.

This problem is most recognizable when one's computer does not have many applications in use, and is sitting in a fairly idle state, like when one is trying to read from a website through a browser, and not doing much else that will tax the CPU and the HDD. It is when the computer is in this state that the HDD manufacturer's (or is it Apple's/*nix's) power management system and the Operating system seem to not get along too well, and then come the click, click, clicks. What is most bizarre to me is that the clicks are somewhat random, at least to my limited knowledge. Sometimes, in what appear to be similar computer-use situations, there will be clicks, and sometimes no clicks.

This problem actually occurs on all Operating Systems based on Unix/Linux, including the Mac OS. As far as Windows is concerned, many say this problem does not exist, and some say it does. The folks who say that Windows Vista is not plagued with this problem claim it is because the OS accesses the HDD so very often, like every 4 seconds at a minimum, the HDD's aggressive power management scheme never has a chance to kick-in and sleep the HDD and park the heads. Whereas the Mac OS Leopard 10.5 may access, or touch, the HDD every 8 seconds at the least, allowing the HDD's over aggressive power management to sleep the drive (hence park the heads, and make an audible "click") every few seconds. The same seems to apply to open source distros of Linux, however they seem to be on top of a fix. Maybe this is because the average linux user is quite computer-savvy, unlike today's average Mac user.

This issue is not just about an annoying noise emitting from the HDD, all those clicks might be drastically shortening the life of the HDD. To computer geeks each one of those annoying ping-pong ball sounding clicks is known as a "Load_Cycle_Count" and every HDD manufactured has a limited number of allowable load cycle counts before the HDD fails! My particular drive will fail at around 600,000 load cycle counts. that number may seem high, but considering that the HDD in question is already at 22,731 "clicks" or load cycle counts (this number is easily ascertainable with the use of specific software) in under one month's use, well, do the math. My HDD is pre-programmed to fail in 2 years. Many people have reported a much higher rate of accumulated "clicks" than my HDD has. I have an old external 80 gig firewire HDD that is running strong after 8 years of use!

The big mystery here is who is to blame? It is either the OS manufacturers, i.e. Apple, Windows, Ubuntu, or we need to look at the manufacturers of the HDD's themselves. I actually think they both are to share the blame.

There are numerous forum threads running all over the web about this issue. Here are links to some of the best: (there are also many great threads at Apple's support forums, however Apple will not allow me to create a working link to those threads. Bad Apple, bad.)

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=591503
https://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-258751.html
http://forums.msiwind.net/general-discussion/advent-4211-making-clicking-noise-t863.html

UPDATE:

Starting to wonder if this will be one of those extremely annoying "bugs" that will never be fixed in 10.5.x, thus forcing us to buy Snow(Job) Leopard? (Pun intended). One of the key OS functons being "improved" upon with Apple's "Snow Leopard" OS 10.6 due to be released next year is "Power Management!" I am starting to think the real fix will be purchasing a still-too-expensive solid state Hard Drive.

The clicks are annoying as all hell in a quiet room!

None of the "fixes" to be found on the web seem to work, none!

1. HDAPM, nope.
2. declunk, nope.
3. APM tuner, nope.
4. Turning off "put hard disk to sleep whenever possible," nope.
5. disabling the motion sensor, nope.

this problem has been around a long time!

None of the various discussions on this issue seem to come up with a workable resolution.

What the frack, Apple?
Click to expand...
 
Heh, I'll probably call tomorrow and ask for a 2TB drive as well :) Does anyone have this issue with the 2TB HD? Just so I can be sure that it won't have the same issue. Where are you located btw?
 
Hi all,

I recently noticed hard drive sounds on my i5 27 iMac as well, but they have not been consistent.. I brought the machine home on Sunday, set it up, ran the migration assistant to bring over about 60GB of music and photo content from my old G4 Powerbook, and no HD noise. Monday was quiet also. Tuesday morning we downloaded some music from iTunes/synced ipod. Tuesday night I definitely noticed some clicking/ticking HD noises that were not loud but not faint and quiet either, definitely noticeable. They would also appear at times while in iPhoto, iTunes and while surfing web pages. The strange thing is that they got quieter the longer I used the computer. Last night almost did not hear them at all while using iPhoto, etc. So it is pretty inconsistent.. I plan to check tonight to see if it is a Seagate versus Hitachi.. I may also drop into the Apple store to ask a Genius what I should/should not be hearing.

The good news is the noise did not sound like scratching or anything bad, but it is tough to hear noises at all when other folks are posting that their computers are dead quiet.

EDIT: Hi, I confirmed tonight that I have the dreaded Seagate (ST31000528ASQ)... The first thing it did tonight when I woke up the mac was make a bunch of loud clicking noise, then every now and then make clicking noises as I surf the web... Again, not really loud but not super quiet either.. I plan to chat with the Genius at the Apple Store tomorrow, but unfortunately it seems that the majority of the iMacs are Seagate, and that even some of the other drives are making noise as well. Of course it is not making any noise right now... strange... Looks like something we will have to get used to! If I have an update after speaking with the Genius at the Apple store, I will update..
 
nando2323 said:
OK where is your evidence to support this crazy statement?
Click to expand...

Probably referring to the seagate drives. I think there was some pretty bad issues with the 1TB versions. This is from earlier this year.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/seagate-7200.11-failing,6844.html

Also, based on my own experience seagate drives are WAY noisier than Western Digital drives. I would never ever again buy a seagate for my PC. Loud as heck. Plus with their known failure rate problems, I'm quite surprised Apple chose to use them (or maybe I'm not). For the prices you pay, they should absolutely be using the WD Caviar blue or black drives.

It's really a huge shame they don't just give you easy HD access on the iMac. That really is a complete joke, considering it is one of the most likely to fail parts of the machine.
 
Are there 2TB seagates as well (in the imacs) ? May as well ask for a 2TB to ensure I don't get another seagate..
 
wesleyh said:
Are there 2TB seagates as well (in the imacs) ? May as well ask for a 2TB to ensure I don't get another seagate..
Click to expand...

I think the 2TB are Hitachi's. Search other threads. Plus check NewEgg, the only 2 TB 7200 RM drives they have are made by Hitachi.
 
Let's put it this way... if I was buying a used iMac and the person selling it demonstrated it and it sounded like my i5, I'd laugh and ask him why he thinks he can get away with selling me old, malfunctioning junk. The chugging is appalling (worse than when I first heard it, probably because I'm using it more intensively now).
I changed it today at the Apple Store, but haven't opened the replacement box yet. If it makes the same noise, there's no way I want it. Trouble is, I sold my Macbook Pro and Apple LED Display to get this iMac. To say I'm disappointed is an understatement. I have never heard such a disconcerting noise from a computer – my old Powerbook sounds like it must have the latest advanced technology next to this chugging monster. The bumping sound actually had me thinking it was an alert once, and I went to system preferences to reset the alert sound!
 
Anyone who got it exchanged, do you get to keep the old imac until the new one arrives? Don't want to be a week or more without it..
 
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