5k Cinema Display requirements

Celedral

macrumors 6502
Original poster
May 29, 2008
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Los Angeles
So on topic with the recent 5k iMac release. I would dump my money as quick as possibly once a 5k Cinema Display shows up, but looks like I might have to hold out on it for one limitation. Is displayport 1.2 fast enough to even support 5k/60hz? Probably not, but what about dual 1.2 with MST?


My main question is would Apple forgo the current generation of Mac Pro users with a 5k display, which it desperately needs. I'm quite sure when the New Mac pro gets announced, it will have thunderbolt 3/DP 1.3 to compliment the newly released Cinema Display.

Man! I could really use that 5k display.
 

Gav Mack

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Jun 15, 2008
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Until Apple make a tb2 version it's the Dell UltraSharp 27 Ultra HD 5K folks.

Same panel as the iMac and if MVC doesn't get his mitts on one as soon as they hit the streets before nearly everyone else I'll be shocked.
 
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edry.hilario

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Aug 1, 2010
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so if a thunderbolt display were to come out, would the current nMP be able to handle it?

I dont want an imac anymore a mac pro is much more attractive to me, its just i dont want to be left behind if new TB display is out and the mac pro i get doesnt support it.
 

mikeboss

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Aug 13, 2009
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switzerland
The Dell uses a pair of dp connectors so it should surely with tb2?
in theory this should work. but this needs specifically to be supported by the operating system. and IMHO it's a hack. I don't know if Yosemite/nMP will be compatible with this setup.
 

Gav Mack

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Jun 15, 2008
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in theory this should work. but this needs specifically to be supported by the operating system. and IMHO it's a hack. I don't know if Yosemite/nMP will be compatible with this setup.
I'm pretty confident by the time the dell ships it will work using a pair of DP cables aggregated. Doubling the standard tb resolution makes it far easier scenario than the other non standard ones I've read about driving a certain graphics mod bloke nuts.

If they don't there will be trouble - as a 'prosumer' all in one desktop has 5k and the pro has sweet fanny Adams from Apple so the Dell will no doubt be working in time.
 
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fuchsdh

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Jun 19, 2014
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The iMac with retina display is a single panel--the reason Dell can use two DP is because it's two panels.

I wouldn't expect any options for driving it through one cable any time soon.
 

MacVidCards

Suspended
Nov 17, 2008
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The iMac with retina display is a single panel--the reason Dell can use two DP is because it's two panels.

I wouldn't expect any options for driving it through one cable any time soon.
Same panel, different controllers.

But I would concur tha there isn't an easy way to run one through a single cable.
 

handsome pete

macrumors 68000
Aug 15, 2008
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Pretty sure people had the same thought when the Retina Macbook Pros came along. You're right, desperately is a strong word, maybe "need" would be better suited.
No, "need" probably doesn't apply either. Sure, it would be nice, but the added resolution over 4K isn't an absolute need for anything.
 

goMac

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Apr 15, 2004
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I think at this point it's up in the air if Apple will do a MST solution or use Thunderbolt 3.

Apple's pro gear all has two Thunderbolt ports so I think MST is still a possibility, especially if Apple wants to be able to sell to users of older gear. Does anyone know if the two TB2 ports together on a Macbook Pro would be able to have enough bandwidth, or do they share the bandwidth to such an extent it wouldn't be possible?
 

xav8tor

macrumors 6502a
Mar 30, 2011
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No, "need" probably doesn't apply either. Sure, it would be nice, but the added resolution over 4K isn't an absolute need for anything.
Maybe not absolute, but it sure would be more than just nice to edit 4K at full rez while still viewing at least part of the timeline, media lists, effects, audio meters, etc. Apple has a perfect example of this on the features page. Ditto for really high rez stills. That said, 5K strikes me as really oddball, especially since straight 4K/UHD is so poorly supported at present, despite all the marketing hype. Word has it Yosemite fixes some of the problems getting 60 Hz. SST on the nMP. I'll believe it when I see it.
 

VirtualRain

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2008
6,304
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Vancouver, BC
I think at this point it's up in the air if Apple will do a MST solution or use Thunderbolt 3.

Apple's pro gear all has two Thunderbolt ports so I think MST is still a possibility, especially if Apple wants to be able to sell to users of older gear. Does anyone know if the two TB2 ports together on a Macbook Pro would be able to have enough bandwidth, or do they share the bandwidth to such an extent it wouldn't be possible?
To answer your question, DP1.2 (and therefore TB2) is just short of the bandwidth required to support 5K at 60Hz. But two connections would offer more than enough bandwidth if the display could aggregate it or treat the LCD panel as two displays each driven by one connection (MST).

As for Apple and 5K... did you read AnandTech's assessment above?

They're best guess is that the new iMac is using a non-standard DP connection (overclocked) to drive the 5K display with a single connection (SST). Of course, since it's all internal to the iMac, Apple can do whatever they want... no need for standards or inter-operability.

So it's very unlikely there will a stand-alone 5K display based on this product or support for any 5K display in a Mac until DP1.3 and TB3 comes along.

As for Dell's 5K display, it could either ship with DP1.3 support (SST) and/or support for dual DP1.2 connections (MST).
 

goMac

macrumors 604
Apr 15, 2004
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To answer your question, DP1.2 (and therefore TB2) is just short of the bandwidth required to support 5K at 60Hz. But two connections would offer more than enough bandwidth if the display could aggregate it or treat the LCD panel as two displays each driven by one connection (MST).

As for Apple and 5K... did you read AnandTech's assessment above?

They're best guess is that the new iMac is using a non-standard DP connection (overclocked) to drive the 5K display with a single connection (SST). Of course, since it's all internal to the iMac, Apple can do whatever they want... no need for standards or inter-operability.

So it's very unlikely there will a stand-alone 5K display based on this product or support for any 5K display in a Mac until DP1.3 and TB3 comes along.

As for Dell's 5K display, it could either ship with DP1.3 support (SST) and/or support for dual DP1.2 connections (MST).
Yes. I think Anand is very very wrong. See the other thread.

I strongly believe Apple is using MST, especially in since they use the same panel.
 

Celedral

macrumors 6502
Original poster
May 29, 2008
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Los Angeles
This is definitely making me regret my purchase of the nMP if there is no support for a 5k cinema display. I'm just a HiRes whore.
 

deconstruct60

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Mar 10, 2009
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Apple's pro gear all has two Thunderbolt ports so I think MST is still a possibility, especially if Apple wants to be able to sell to users of older gear.
If Apple's custom display controller is SST then they possibililty is probably very close to zero. The simpler solution would be to do what they have done for MST 4K connections..... namely enable 3rd party displays. So MST 5K displays ? Yeah that is possible, I just won't count on an Apple label on the display.

Does anyone know if the two TB2 ports together on a Macbook Pro would be able to have enough bandwidth, or do they share the bandwidth to such an extent it wouldn't be possible?
The upstream GPU (or minimally the connected display port paths) is just as likely a limitation.

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As for Dell's 5K display, it could either ship with DP1.3 support (SST) and/or support for dual DP1.2 connections (MST).
Unlikely, for the DP1.3 as there are no 1.3 sources coming any time soon. The standard just relatively recently passed and will likely have to sync up to the next design cycle for GPU (stuff coming onto market in next couple of months exited design phase long time ago). The hack of using two HDMI ports was used for very early, very high end 4K monitors was used.... probably will repeat with daul DP1.2 for 5K.

Also option that Dell's monitor would be coupled to custom/proprietary GPU set up just like Apple's is only with a standard PCIe GPU card to make it into a wider variety of systems.
 

handsome pete

macrumors 68000
Aug 15, 2008
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Maybe not absolute, but it sure would be more than just nice to edit 4K at full rez while still viewing at least part of the timeline, media lists, effects, audio meters, etc. Apple has a perfect example of this on the features page. Ditto for really high rez stills. That said, 5K strikes me as really oddball, especially since straight 4K/UHD is so poorly supported at present, despite all the marketing hype. Word has it Yosemite fixes some of the problems getting 60 Hz. SST on the nMP. I'll believe it when I see it.
Eh, I'll keep my full res preview relegated to the production monitor. I see no benefit from cutting in full resolution in the software monitor.
 

Cindori

macrumors 68040
Jan 17, 2008
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Sweden
We won't see a new display from Apple unless the Macbook Pro supports it.

Just look at the keynote video when they have a picture of their ecosystem. All their devices, except for the Mac Pro. The Mac Pro is not even included in Apple's vision.
 

seisend

macrumors 6502a
Feb 20, 2009
506
0
Switzerland
Where the hell is our new CINEMA DISPLAY ?!

If they want me to buy a nMP again just to support that **** I'm gonna smash my new Mac Pro through their damn Apple Store window.

They are talking about their super ECO SYSTEM all the time. So where the HELL is the new CINEMA DISPLAY ?!..... Can't be freaking difficult if they can manage freaking iMac with 5k :mad:

It's just a joke. I spent 5 grand on a nMP and all they offer is some 6 year old technology display crap. seriously. shame on you apple.