AMD in MacBook Pros [merged]

[w4rm]

AMD just announced 7nm CPU chips coming out this year. Intel over a year behind.

Do you think Apple would ever put an AMD CPU in a Mac in the future?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveal...al-and-first-silicon-will-ship-this-year/amp/

 

[Falhófnir]

I guess it depends how it stacks up performance wise? I expect Apple are constantly evaluating and weighing the options - though it seems currently their path is towards in-house ARM chips.

 

[leman]

If they are better, why not? So far AMD is still lagging behind on single-core performance

 

[Lennyvalentin]

AMD just announced 7nm CPU chips coming out this year. Intel over a year behind.

Apples and oranges. Intel's 7nm is not comparable to Globalfoundries' 7nm (AMD doesn't own any fabs anymore, they were all spun off years and years ago.) If anything, Intel is still ahead, as their 10nm process is generally superior to their competitors' so-called 7nm - although the gap is clearly shrinking, and unless Intel can fix their execution problems they will be left behind within another node shrink or two...

If they are better, why not? So far AMD is still lagging behind on single-core performance

Bah. The difference isn't even noticeable except in benchmarks, and 2nd-gen ryzen is basically even-toed with Intel's core-series chips. It's nothing worth to get hung up on, especially in these post-meltdown times (which Intel suffers worse from than AMD ryzen.)

Ryzen doesn't support 256/512-bit AVX tho, so if you REALLY need that intel is the way to go (GPU compute is taking over more and more tho these days, so maybe not that important really.)

 

[tubeexperience]

That's a good question.

Intel can't get its 10nm working, so next years, Intel is going to launch Whiskey Lake and Amber Lake on 14nm+++

Meanwhile, AMD will be launching Picasso on 7nm.

 

[cube]

Intel can't get its 10nm working, so next years, Intel is going to launch Whiskey Lake

Will that be subject to tariffs?

It seems there are largely no wine lakes left besides Wine Lake.

 

[jerryk]

My 2 cents is that Apple wants an Apple processor and GPU in all of the Mac line.

No more being dependent on vendor's schedules, conflicting priorities, and financial stability. And this goes way back to Steve Job and his "Sand" initiative. Where sand, for the silicon, goes in one end of a factory, and computers come out the other.

Also, it seems to the trend in the Valley now. With Google, Microsoft and others all building their own special purpose processors for things like Machine Learning and server architectures.

 

[goobot]

Just because it has less nm doesn’t automatically make it better tho.

 

[w4rm]

Just because it has less nm doesn’t automatically make it better tho.

It's more so a sign that AMD are sticking to there roadmap, Intel was supposed to have 7nm around the same time as AMD but Intel has been having major delays the last few years.

AMD has been handling there technological advancements way better than Intel the last while, and Intel is playing catch up. The CEO at Intel was just fired, so Intel is aware it's behind.

And these delays are trickling down to the Apple consumer.

In terms of size Intel is currently at 14nm, smaller chips means less power consumption and a host of other benefits. It's basically a generation ahead.

I think Apple is eventually moving to it's own chip like for iOS, but that's not until around 2020, since they already use AMD GPU's I don't think it's that farfetched that they may move to AMD for the CPU's until then.

 

[tubeexperience]

It's more so a sign that AMD are sticking to there roadmap, Intel was supposed to have 7nm around the same time as AMD but Intel has been having major delays the last few years.

AMD has been handling there technological advancements way better than Intel the last while, and Intel is playing catch up. The CEO at Intel was just fired, so Intel is aware it's behind.

And these delays are trickling down to the Apple consumer.

In terms of size Intel is currently at 14nm, smaller chips means less power consumption and a host of other benefits. It's basically a generation ahead.

I think Apple is eventually moving to it's own chip like for iOS, but that's not until around 2020, since they already use AMD GPU's I don't think it's that farfetched that they may move to AMD for the CPU's until then.

Historically, Intel has been the more reliable of the two major x86 manufactures.

Now, things has changed.

Intel used to execute like clockwork, but now it's AMD.

 

[Miltz]

I doubt it. Apple and Intel probably have some sort of contract in place. I also don't see them completely redesigning everything to use AMD. At least not yet. In time if AMD keeps at it's pace, Apple will use the "better CPU" in their systems. As of now battery life seems pretty terrible on the AMD mobile CPUs so I doubt Apple is even considering them.

 

[elppa]

How do graphics compare - is there a clear advantage to either Intel or AMD now for portables?

 

[maflynn]

Its possible, especially since they use AMD GPUs, but I think they'll stick with Intel as they develop their own A series Mac replacement.

 

[Lennyvalentin]

Intel used to execute like clockwork, but now it's AMD.

Intel got increasingly complacent during the era between the end of Athlon 64 and the introduction of Ryzen as AMD stumbled again and again, and in particular post Ivy Bridge generation when they started to get REALLY lazy. Basically they've been iterating the same core with some quite minor tweaks here and there for multiple generations of chips now, and performance improvements post-Haswell especially have been so poor it's been difficult to detect them even in benchmarks.

How do graphics compare - is there a clear advantage to either Intel or AMD now for portables?

AMD has the clearly superior integrated graphics, and Intel has no discrete graphics at all (yet.) Of course, there are no Macs with AMD CPUs, so it doesn't matter...

 

[jerryk]

I think Apple is eventually moving to it's own chip like for iOS, but that's not until around 2020, since they already use AMD GPU's I don't think it's that farfetched that they may move to AMD for the CPU's until then.

2020 is 18 months away. If an A series process for Macs is going to be available that soon, it makes no sense for Apple move away from Intel for essentially one model year. Just stick in Intel's current chips, and run out the clock. Then do a major rev in the hardware as part of the Axx launch.

 

[cube]

2020 is 18 months away. If an A series process for Macs is going to be available that soon, it makes no sense for Apple move away from Intel for essentially one model year. Just stick in Intel's current chips, and run out the clock. Then do a major rev in the hardware as part of the Axx launch.

If Apple makes an ARM Mac, it will just be an iBook series.

 

[lec0rsaire]

No and I believe it would be a terrible move. I’ve had notebooks with AMD CPUs and it was always a mistake. AMD CPUs are budget chips and Apple as a premium manufacturer has to go with Intel. Intel is always better and this will never change. AMD gives people a lot for their money in sub-$1000 stuff. It’s the same thing with nVidia. ATI and AMD sometimes get close but nVidia always quickly makes a giant leap ahead.

What would be possible is Kaby Lake w/ integrated Vega on the CPU. This gets up to 200 GB of memory bandwidth and would dramatically improve GPU performance on the MBP from the current 80 GB bandwidth that the 450/455/460/555/560 have.

 

[cube]

Kaby Lake would be "fake" Vega.

 

[lec0rsaire]

If Apple makes an ARM Mac, it will just be an iBook series.

Yeah, it’s extremely likely that if there is an ARM Mac, the 12” MacBook will be the first to get it. It already uses a fanless design. The problem would be getting developers to port offer essential 3rd party apps to support them. At least MS Office and Adobe CC otherwise it would be similar to the neutered Windows Surface Laptop without running the full Windows 10 version instead of the store only version it comes loaded with.

 

[w4rm]

Yeah, it’s extremely likely that if there is an ARM Mac, the 12” MacBook will be the first to get it. It already uses a fanless design. The problem would be getting developers to port offer essential 3rd party apps to support them. At least MS Office and Adobe CC otherwise it would be similar to the neutered Windows Surface Laptop without running the full Windows 10 version instead of the store only version it comes loaded with.

Yeah though seems that's what Apple is moving towards with allowing Universal iOS/Mac apps, helping devs get their apps updated earlier.

Maybe when we get closer to 3rd party Universal iOS/Mac apps there will be leaks of ARM Macs in the code.

 

[tubeexperience]

No and I believe it would be a terrible move. I’ve had notebooks with AMD CPUs and it was always a mistake. AMD CPUs are budget chips and Apple as a premium manufacturer has to go with Intel. Intel is always better and this will never change. AMD gives people a lot for their money in sub-$1000 stuff. It’s the same thing with nVidia. ATI and AMD sometimes get close but nVidia always quickly makes a giant leap ahead.

You don't know what you are talking about.

Maybe you should actually do some research BEFORE commenting.

 

[lec0rsaire]

You don't know what you are talking about.

Maybe you should actually do some research BEFORE commenting.

I’m sorry but AMD CPUs just don’t belong in $2-4k machine. It’s Intel or nothing.

 

[jsnuff1]

I’m sorry but AMD CPUs just don’t belong in $2-4k machine. It’s Intel or nothing.

lol AMD is currently making CPUs that destroy anything Intel has to offer. They are so behind they had to demo a 28 core CPU thats overclocked to 5GHz using a crazy cooling solution consumers would not use in order to look competitive with AMDs high end.

AMD is back in the game and making Intel sweat badly.

 

[lec0rsaire]

lol AMD is currently making CPUs that destroy anything Intel has to offer. They are so behind they had to demo a 28 core CPU thats overclocked to 5GHz using a crazy cooling solution consumers would not use in order to look competitive with AMDs high end.

AMD is back in the game and making Intel sweat badly.

I’ve been around long enough to know that AMD loses any competitive edge pretty quickly. They came out with Athlon and beat Intel to 64-bit. It looked good for them for a while but Intel destroyed them for more than a decade with Core. In fact they had supposedly killed Intel with the K6. Intel always delivers under pressure and I don’t see why it’s going to be any different this time around.

 

[Falhófnir]

If Apple makes an ARM Mac, it will just be an iBook series.

It might start that way but they will quickly start depreciating the intel “legacy” machines and software and move it all in house under their control... why I’m a little reticent going for a MBP 2018 or 2019 (not that I do a lot that requires a hugely flourishing software ecosystem)
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I’ve been around long enough to know that AMD loses any competitive edge pretty quickly. They came out with Athlon and beat Intel to 64-bit. It looked good for them for a while but Intel destroyed them for more than a decade with Core. In fact they had supposedly killed Intel with the K6. Intel always delivers under pressure and I don’t see why it’s going to be any different this time around.

Intel are seriously struggling with 10nm having seemingly bit off more than they can chew - they have a decent lead on single core performance but that’s being eaten into each passing month their 10nm are still backfiring in the garage. It’s a shame as they are effectively being punished for being ambitious, and going for an extra-large leg up between 14 and 10nm (2.7x density increase).