A12 Apple TV in October?

[cypressc]

Here is my thinking:

-Apple TV 4k is over two years old
-Apple has had an "October Event" 6 of the last 8 years
-Apple TV+ launches November 1 so timing of new Apple TV unit perfect.
-Apple is promoting Apple TV as a gaming device using Xbox controller. A10 will not keep up with games they will want to promote over the next year in "Apple Arcade".
-Apple expects Catalina's TV app will sell a lot of Apple TV units. Why not launch the 2019 Apple TV at same time as new TV app and Apple TV+?

 

[Macintoshrumors]

If you follow the pattern of October events over the last 5 years, this year isn’t gonna happen.

 

[Juicy Box]

A10 will not keep up with games they will want to promote over the next year in "Apple Arcade".

The A12 is hardly an upgrade when it comes to GPU performance over the A10X.

 

[D.T.]

The A12 is hardly an upgrade when it comes to GPU performance over the A10X.

I'd assume if they offered an upgraded model - especially a eye towards improved gaming - they'd tap the A12X variant.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

Here is my thinking:

-Apple TV 4k is over two years old
-Apple has had an "October Event" 6 of the last 8 years
-Apple TV+ launches November 1 so timing of new Apple TV unit perfect.
-Apple is promoting Apple TV as a gaming device using Xbox controller. A10 will not keep up with games they will want to promote over the next year in "Apple Arcade".
-Apple expects Catalina's TV app will sell a lot of Apple TV units. Why not launch the 2019 Apple TV at same time as new TV app and Apple TV+?

Some great points there. Don't forget HDMI 2.1 - it's pretty essential.

Since they've already gone the X route with the A10X then it would make sense to go with the A12X. Mind you, why not go the A13X route which is no doubt coming to the iPad Pro

Maybe the ATV will simply get a 'quiet' spec update in October - mind you no use for me then as I start my 8+ months of travelling again in October - only been in the UK since Wednesday and I'm sick of the rain & dark clouds already!!! Brexit weather in the UK!

 

[Juicy Box]

The A12 is hardly an upgrade when it comes to GPU performance over the A10X.

I'd assume if they offered an upgraded model - especially a eye towards improved gaming - they'd tap the A12X variant.

This would be my assumption as well.

The issue with this is that it doesn't fit with recent rumors.

When the rumors of the new ATV surfaced with the A12 being use over the A12X, someone in another thread theorized that use of the A12 is not performance based, and has more to do with cost cutting measures.

This fits with today's Apple, so it could be correct.

 

[Juicy Box]

Since they've already gone the X route with the A10X then it would make sense to go with the A12X.

I completely agree with you, if performance and user experience was Apple's priority. But, it doesn't fit with the rumors of the use of the A12 in the new ATV.

Mind you, why not go the A13X route which is no doubt coming to the iPad Pro

This would be really cool, and it would show that Apple is serious about making the ATV more than just a streaming box. I would get one at launch.

I just don't think it would happen. I think the A12 rumors will end up being true, and Apple is doing it to cut costs.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I completely agree with you, if performance and user experience was Apple's priority. But, it doesn't fit with the rumors of the use of the A12 in the new ATV.


This would be really cool, and it would show that Apple is serious about making the ATV more than just a streaming box. I would get one at launch.

I just don't think it would happen. I think the A12 rumors will end up being true, and Apple is doing it to cut costs.

I still think that they'll go with an X. It looks highly unprofessional for a company to have offered the X Fusion chip and then replaced that will a basic one for a newer model. Shame on any company that considers that. That's greed over customers.

To me, the only way that a A12 chip and not a A12X chip would be used is if they were to offer a 20% to 25% reduction on the current RRP for the ATV 4K which they'd never do. But then I was really surprised with Apple's greed at fitting the A8 to the ATV 4 at the time of launch.

What I do feel though is no matter how pro they make the device, a streaming box can never sell for more than £199. People just wouldn't pay for it. Maybe also because so many people either don't know what the Apple TV is or can do OR have even heard of it. When I mention it to friends & people at the gym and on my travels, i'd say that maybe 2 to 5% have heard of Apple TV. Some have even said "Oh wow, do Apple make a TV?"

All I can say is that i'm truly happy that I discovered it in late 2010 by one of my best friend's - he was/is a model & travels a lot. He had a MacBook Pro and iPhone 4 at the time and watched film on his phone whilst on a plane etc. Then he'd watch a film at home etc and this is where multi platform came in. I was instantly hooked on his idea and it totally fits my travel lifestyle So i've got him to thank for introducing me to Apple TV 2

 

[triangletechie]

Perhaps also a higher storage model? 128 gb?

 

[jbachandouris]

I have a 4th generation that I barely use. I would be curious to see if anything new comes out to coincide with the Apple+ launch.

 

[TrenttonY]

I think they will release a new one in October. I think they will even lower the price to $150.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I think they will release a new one in October. I think they will even lower the price to $150.

Maybe one with the A12 at £150 and the Apple TV Pro with A12X chip at £199. Or is that the Pro name over used?
Both with HDMI 2.1 and 120fps for gaming and UI

 

[clayj]

Perhaps also a higher storage model? 128 gb?

Why more storage? Does anything beyond the screensaver videos ever really get downloaded to the Apple TV? I have two (Apple TV 4K and Apple TV) and for the life of me I couldn't tell you how having the maximum amount of storage has ever helped.

 

[triangletechie]

To download games from Arcade and movies/shows from Apple TV+.

 

[colmaclean]

Maybe they’ll release a “stick” version for considerably less, but obviously with basic features and storage.

 

[JamonBull]

A12x, HDMI 2.1, Wi-Fi 6, one year of Apple TV+ for free, take my $$$.

 

[Corsig]

Was thinking of upgrading to the 4K but really holding out to see if they update in October. With my luck as soon as I buy one a new model will come out right after the return policy is over.

 

[Juicy Box]

It looks highly unprofessional for a company to have offered the X Fusion chip and then replaced that will a basic one for a newer model. Shame on any company that considers that. That's greed over customers.

I am surprised that anyone would be surprised to see Apple do something like this.

I am thinking that this is what is about to happen, and when it does, they will have a graph showing the A12 CPU performance over the A10X, but conveniently leave out the GPU benchmarks.

It makes sense from Apple's point of view to use the A12 over the A10X, even with the weak GPU gains, because of economies of scale.

There isn't any other device that Apple currently sells that has the A10X in it, but there are several devices that Apple currently that has the A12.

Don't misunderstand me, I don't want to see the A12 in the next ATV, I just have a feeling that it will happen.

the only way that a A12 chip and not a A12X chip would be used is if they were to offer a 20% to 25% reduction on the current RRP for the ATV 4K which they'd never do.

Again, I am surprised you would think this. I think that not only would Apple do this, but they would do this with less of a reduction in retail price.

Don't be surprised to see the next Apple TV with the A12 priced @ $149 for the 32GB.

Perhaps also a higher storage model? 128 gb?

I would say that a 128GB ATV would only be necessary if Apple successfully turns the device into a gaming device. The way it is now, 64GB is more than plenty, and the 32GB is fine for most.

Why more storage? Does anything beyond the screensaver videos ever really get downloaded to the Apple TV? I have two (Apple TV 4K and Apple TV) and for the life of me I couldn't tell you how having the maximum amount of storage has ever helped.

I would agree that with the ATV4k being basically a streaming box that more storage isn't really necessary, but if it did have more storage, it could be utilized as a larger cache.

tvOS can use many, many GBs of data for temporary use. I have seen the OS free up over 10GBs of the cached data at one time before. So, if there was larger storage, it could be used, just it wouldn't be necessary to have.

Another note, it is possible to run out of space on an ATV. I have seen it a few times. Although, it takes a crap load of apps to do.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I am surprised that anyone would be surprised to see Apple do something like this.

I am thinking that this is what is about to happen, and when it does, they will have a graph showing the A12 CPU performance over the A10X, but conveniently leave out the GPU benchmarks.

It makes sense from Apple's point of view to use the A12 over the A10X, even with the weak GPU gains, because of economies of scale.

There isn't any other device that Apple currently sells that has the A10X in it, but there are several devices that Apple currently that has the A12.

Don't misunderstand me, I don't want to see the A12 in the next ATV, I just have a feeling that it will happen.


Again, I am surprised you would think this. I think that not only would Apple do this, but they would do this with less of a reduction in retail price.

Don't be surprised to see the next Apple TV with the A12 priced @ $149 for the 32GB.



I would say that a 128GB ATV would only be necessary if Apple successfully turns the device into a gaming device. The way it is now, 64GB is more than plenty, and the 32GB is fine for most.


I would agree that with the ATV4k being basically a streaming box that more storage isn't really necessary, but if it did have more storage, it could be utilized as a larger cache.

tvOS can use many, many GBs of data for temporary use. I have seen the OS free up over 10GBs of the cached data at one time before. So, if there was larger storage, it could be used, just it wouldn't be necessary to have.

Another note, it is possible to run out of space on an ATV. I have seen it a few times. Although, it takes a crap load of apps to do.

Certainly an A12 would make sense for a £149/$149 ATV 4K which could also replace the HD version and since Apple are on a Pro roll (with rumoured AirPod Pro's on their way) let's have an Apple TV 4K Pro with the A12X with 64GB & 128GB options for the Arcade gamers.

Either way, HDMI 2.1 would be lovely though.

IF the Apple TV gets HDMI 2.1 will we need to use the 'Match' settings for frame rate & SDR/HDR/DV OR can we just leave it on HDR / DV 60hz and let the TV decide through HDMI 2.1???????

 

[x-evil-x]

What’s the point of hdmi 2.1 really?

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

What’s the point of hdmi 2.1 really?

Instant frame rate switching which is soooooooooooo important on a streaming box due to the fact that you can be watching 23.976, 24, 25, 50, 50 or 60fps and that's just on YouTube along with auto SDR, HDR & DV switching with no blanc screens and flicker. It's a more modern approach basically.
To me that's the most exciting aspect of 2.1 along with 120fps which would be exceptional for UI scrolling along with gaming of course.

Enhanced refresh rate features ensure an added level of smooth and seamless motion and transitions for gaming, movies and video. They include:

• Variable Refresh Rate (VRR) reduces or eliminates lag, stutter and frame tearing for more fluid and better detailed gameplay.
• Quick Media Switching (QMS) for movies and video eliminates the delay that can result in blank screens before content is displayed.
• Quick Frame Transport (QFT) reduces latency for smoother no-lag gaming, and real-time interactive virtual reality.
• Auto Low Latency Mode (ALLM) allows the ideal latency setting to automatically be set allowing for smooth, lag-free and uninterrupted viewing and interactivity.

2.1 on a TV is essential also due to eARC - essential for Dolby True HD / DTS MA etc.

It's the standard of today and the next five years or so, so it really does need to be on ATV.

If it's not for you, then fine, but for me, it's essential - it's a bit like buying a computer today with only USB-A when now and the next five years is all about USB-C.

 

[Sakurambo-kun]

I'd love to see a new Apple TV. More than anything it needs more storage. I filled up my paltry 32gb 4K ATV with 5 Apple Arcade games. It's utterly pathetic, and with no SD card slot or access to even flash drives the only way out is a new device.

As for performance, some Apple Arcade games run well, but most don't. Look at Chu Chu Rocket, Frogger, Shin Sekai (which runs at an incredibly low resolution) Oceanhorn 2 for example. They're struggling to run properly.

I don't expect PS5 or even PS4 Pro performance, but PS4 Amateur should be well within reach. Couple that with a proper amount of storage which is expandable, and things get more interesting.

I'd also like to see support for HLG, which is the HDR standard used by broadcasters such as the BBC and NHK, and support for AV1 and VP9 so we can finally get 4K YouTube.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I'd love to see a new Apple TV. More than anything it needs more storage. I filled up my paltry 32gb 4K ATV with 5 Apple Arcade games. It's utterly pathetic, and with no SD card slot or access to even flash drives the only way out is a new device.

As for performance, some Apple Arcade games run well, but most don't. Look at Chu Chu Rocket, Frogger, Shin Sekai (which runs at an incredibly low resolution) Oceanhorn 2 for example. They're struggling to run properly.

I don't expect PS5 or even PS4 Pro performance, but PS4 Amateur should be well within reach. Couple that with a proper amount of storage which is expandable, and things get more interesting.

I'd also like to see support for HLG, which is the HDR standard used by broadcasters such as the BBC and NHK, and support for AV1 and VP9 so we can finally get 4K YouTube.

WOW First review from an Apple Arcade user and it does not look good does it!

Very interesting regarding storage as I've always believed that the 64GB model is the one to go for at only £20 difference.

Hopefully AV1 will come to ATV but I reckon next year as that's the year that YouTube will fully replace VP9 with it. And of course, Apple is now part of the AV1 agreement.
From your experience with Arcade, it sounds as though the A12X chip is required over the A12 for gaming.

 

[Abazigal]

Here is my thinking:

-Apple TV 4k is over two years old
-Apple has had an "October Event" 6 of the last 8 years
-Apple TV+ launches November 1 so timing of new Apple TV unit perfect.
-Apple is promoting Apple TV as a gaming device using Xbox controller. A10 will not keep up with games they will want to promote over the next year in "Apple Arcade".
-Apple expects Catalina's TV app will sell a lot of Apple TV units. Why not launch the 2019 Apple TV at same time as new TV app and Apple TV+?

Right now, tvOS 13 is running a bit slow on my Apple TV (the one with the A8 chip) and Oceanhorn 2 lags noticeably from time to time. The hardware is really starting to show its age.

I wonder if Apple might decide to just consolidate everything by dropping both Apple TV models (the ones with the A8 and A10x chips; can't recall offhand what they are called at the moment), and streamline everything with a single A12 version.

 

[x-evil-x]

Instant frame rate switching which is soooooooooooo important on a streaming box due to the fact that you can be watching 23.976, 24, 25, 50, 50 or 60fps and that's just on YouTube along with auto SDR, HDR & DV switching with no blanc screens and flicker. It's a more modern approach basically.
To me that's the most exciting aspect of 2.1 along with 120fps which would be exceptional for UI scrolling along with gaming of course.

Enhanced refresh rate features ensure an added level of smooth and seamless motion and transitions for gaming, movies and video. They include:

• Variable Refresh Rate (VRR) reduces or eliminates lag, stutter and frame tearing for more fluid and better detailed gameplay.
• Quick Media Switching (QMS) for movies and video eliminates the delay that can result in blank screens before content is displayed.
• Quick Frame Transport (QFT) reduces latency for smoother no-lag gaming, and real-time interactive virtual reality.
• Auto Low Latency Mode (ALLM) allows the ideal latency setting to automatically be set allowing for smooth, lag-free and uninterrupted viewing and interactivity.

2.1 on a TV is essential also due to eARC - essential for Dolby True HD / DTS MA etc.

It's the standard of today and the next five years or so, so it really does need to be on ATV.

If it's not for you, then fine, but for me, it's essential - it's a bit like buying a computer today with only USB-A when now and the next five years is all about USB-C.

not too sure about how many people would upgrade their tv/receiver to make it all work anyway. Cant use anything bought recently and I think there's only a few 2.1 tv's out there not sure about receivers yet. You'd have to go from the appletv to the tv but then have that pass out the audio to the receiver I guess.