ABC Previews 'Nightline' Visit to Foxconn's Chinese Factories

[marksman]

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By the way apple does not pay Foxconn employees nor run factories.

People can start their own factories here in the Us and try to outbid Foxconn for the work. As far as I know no American business is offering apple their factories to make the products

So all you business geniuses build and staff factories and pitch apple. Should be easy.

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Oh yeah and when you do that get a medal if you can make apple devices in the us for only 68 dollars more than Foxconn because that is a fantasy.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

If you can't distinguish between board level factories and fab, then maybe you should stay off this topic. If there is enough confidence in building cutting edge fabs in China en-mass, then it's the official final nail in the coffin for the US of A. And dont' get me wrong, these cutting edge tech and high paid jobs will be going to China sooner rather than later for the exact reason that Jobs have said; China is chewing out more and better tech personell everyday. In fact I already have many co-workers (many caucasians even) going to China from the US to lead up management and architect positions in Chinese firms, bringing up design and fab capacities in China.

Look at how much a typical computer costs in 2005 vs now.... Then you'll know why.

China leads no one in tech, the US has transfered tech to china, they then sell it as their own. Any american that builds up a china firm should be charged with treason. Remember, china had no industry a few decades ago, we opened china at their request and they have broken every promise. China today is western creation. No nation should ever move their industrial base overseas, if they do it will destroy their economy and way of life and one more thing, the nations where the jobs were moved had no industry at all, corporations can get what they want in any market so why did they move?

 

[BiscottiGelato]

yeah ok dude, the reason they use china is not because its cutting edge asshat, its because labor is dirt cheap, they're a communist nation that barely has running water you think they care how much mecury they kick out into rivers?thats why apple uses foxconn. and awesome for your company maybe one day you can pack up and move to china since its the only future. Sadly your corporate worship missed the fact that the 2005 Mac assembled in the USA cost less than todays comparable assembled in china model, it didnt bring one penny in cost down, it enabled apple to sell you a cheaper product at a higher cost, allowing them to make more money and make you feel is if you got the same quality product.

Cutting edge fabs still exists in the US, that's why Samsung chose to open a fab in Texas. But at the current pacing, US will be out paced by a lot of other countries. The fab business used to be all US and Japan. Currently the leader is Taiwan and Singapore. Soon China will over-take due to the simlar dynamics as previously told by Steve Jobs.

Chinese labor is just more bang for the buck in manufacturing. It's just comparative advantage. Just like if one wants to raise cash, one goes to New York. If one wanna make a chip, they go Taiwan these days, sometimes Singapore, and the most cutting edge is still US and Japan. One wants to do board level assembly, one goes go China.

I said typical price of a computer in 05 vs now, not the price of a Mac. The Mac today packs a lot more than the one in 05 for the same cost. Partly due to low cost manufacturing. Partly, you simply can't make a Mac in the US anymore as all the component manufacturers have moved to China. The cost in additional logistics to remain in the US will cost even more than it used to be.

And saying that China barely has running water is utmost ignorant and almost insulting to the nation in general. If Apple and Foxconn is doing a bad deed to provide jobs to the Chinese populace and raising their living standard, I don't know what your degratory remarks should even be considered as.

I think a lot of the negative spin here is just out of the anger that all these jobs have went to China and other low cost countries. I don't see why these jobs shouldn't as Chinese factory workers are just simply more diligent and harder working than most of the Unionized counterparts in the Western world. Things are not for granted, and if a nation wants to be competitive, there's no substitute for hard work and prudent economic policies.

Besides, there are still a lot of good jobs in the US. Look at the SW development and design space. It's still largely based in California and propering like it have never been before. Most SW firms in Cali can't hire fast enough and have huge number of openings. It's more like they can't find enough qualified candidates than anything else.

 

[Dbrown]

Oh, now that were talking about that. Even on base, the rooms are much bigger.

But due to budget cuts we were forced two people inside of a room designed for one. So double the amount of furniture, barely left much room to move around in but we made it work.

Then the air conditioning to the building went out which the never fixed for a year.

I'm just giving you a bit of clarity on how things can go, even inside a country that has a better economy, its not all rainbows and puppy dogs.

Oh please, I'm well aware of our military's BS. Servicemembers also don't have due process and their civil rights and liberties are severely limited. Foxconn isnt military. The people who work for Foxconn aren't servicemembers. Theyre civilians.

Which US company makes their factory workers work in the same conditions that foxconn employees have to?

 

[BiscottiGelato]

China leads no one in tech, the US has transfered tech to china, they then sell it as their own. Any american that builds up a china firm should be charged with treason. Remember, china had no industry a few decades ago, we opened china at their request and they have broken every promise. China today is western creation. No nation should ever move their industrial base overseas, if they do it will destroy their economy and way of life and one more thing, the nations where the jobs were moved had no industry at all, corporations can get what they want in any market so why did they move?

That's global free market economy for you. The ones who gets complacent get surpassed. The lagger learns and leaps. It happened to UK, being outpaced by the US, it's happening to the US. It will happen to China one day too if they get complacent and lazy.

Charging someone with treason for setting up shop in more fertile ground is as civilized as North Korea. That's just like shooting someone a few hundred years back for moving from the UK to the US.

There's no destroying an economy if the economy is competitive. It simply can't be done. If an economy is not competitive and complacent, you don't have to do much, and it'll collapse on it's own.

 

[marksman]

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It's such a disappointment that these factories can't be in America.

Only if you think progress is disappointing

Or if one is xenophobic then they also might hate other countries employing people.

 

[linuxcooldude]

Oh please, I'm well aware of our military's BS. Servicemembers also don't have due process and their civil rights and liberties are severely limited. Foxconn isnt military. The people who work for Foxconn aren't servicemembers. Theyre civilians.

Which US company makes their factory workers work in the same conditions that foxconn employees have to?

I forgot to add the adverse working conditions while underway at sea.

If you worked in the engineering spaces, temperatures could reach anywhere from 90-130 degrees Fahrenheit in the summertime. Thats with no air conditioning. We did have ventilation fans that helped, but only a little. Of course if it got too hot, we would have stay times of maybe 4 hours at a time to help prevent heat stroke.

Oh, by the way, they put the thermometer right where the ventilation fans were, so everywhere else it was quite a bit hotter.

In boiler room #3, is located in a very small room. Temperatures could get as high as 160 degrees. But we only stayed in long enough to take readings or adjust the equipment and leave.

Then if you worked outside during the winter time, with the wind chill factor it could get as low as -35 degrees. The watches would wear survival suits to stay warm. Then often stay outside to refuel or resupply the ship.

 

[jackc]

China leads no one in tech, the US has transfered tech to china, they then sell it as their own. Any american that builds up a china firm should be charged with treason. Remember, china had no industry a few decades ago, we opened china at their request and they have broken every promise. China today is western creation. No nation should ever move their industrial base overseas, if they do it will destroy their economy and way of life and one more thing, the nations where the jobs were moved had no industry at all, corporations can get what they want in any market so why did they move?

It's this kind of economic ignorance that will destroy the country.

You should stop trading with other states, it's hurting your own. Then you can stop trading with other towns.

 

[Misaki]

Let's hope they put the Foxconn salaries in context. Living over there does not cost anywhere as much as living here in the US or Europe.

As an example, the US Federal minimum wage is 7.25$, in which you get no medical care, no housing subsidy, no food in any job that pays that.

The living wage (a wage high enough to cover basic living expenses including housing, medical, food and clothing) for a major metro center in the US or Canada is somewhere in the 18-20$/hr range. Before tax.

The minimum wage in China(Shenzhen) is 1320RMB/mo, which at the current exchange rate is 209.52 USD (in US style full time of 37.5 hours is 1.39$/hr)

So the minimum wage here is 40% of a living wage. So a 40% boost in China would be 1848RMB or 293.32

To make that wage a Chinese worker at 1.73$ would need to work 170 hours in a month. So either they're working 42.5 hours a week, or Foxconn doesn't pay a living wage.

Without hearing from several Chinese Foxconn employees about their wages, it would be hard to make an equivalence between US wages and Chinese wages. All we really have to go on is that Chinese workers are paid 1/8th, what US workers are paid, based entirely on exchange rate. If the USD and RMB were at par (roughly 8 times as much) we wouldn't be making such silly comparisons at all, because the Foxconn employees would be making the same wages or better than US minimum wage workers.

So every time you see someone look at the 1.73 wage and go "foxconn is paying slave wages" remember that the Chinese are paid in RMB, not USD.

As for the rest of the story... American minimum wage employers are notorious slave drivers anyway. Before you point the finger at Apple and Foxconn for poor working conditions in China, go look in your own backyard. No medical coverage, no housing, no food, no clothing. Someone working minimum wage in the US has poorer working conditions than what someone working for Foxconn making iPhones has.

People want to work for Foxconn in China. People don't want to work for minimum wage jobs in the US instead of having no job... no instead Americans hire Mexicans who do want those jobs that few Americans want to do.

 

[Evan_11]

I have to say that I'm somewhat bothered that my expensive Macbook Pro and iPad are made in China by workers making a buck-fifty an hour. Meanwhile Apple earns billions of dollars and their stock vaults higher and higher. I feel like there's something wrong with the world. I know most other tech companies manufacture their products in China and to sometimes lesser standards, but they're also not setting record profits. To me Apple was a better company before the iPod / iPhone.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

It's this kind of economic ignorance that will destroy the country.

You should stop trading with other states, it's hurting your own. Then you can stop trading with other towns.

Really when did I sat stop trading?! I said only fair trade with those that trade fair and china does not trade fair with what they did not invent.

 

[Peace]

I'm sure this has been asked so pardon my ignorance but can someone give me a reason Apple asked ABC/Nightline to do this just before a new iPad comes out ?

Seems like if the show is negative it would have a negative impact on sales.

 

[justperry]

I'm sure this has been asked so pardon my ignorance but can someone give me a reason Apple asked ABC/Nightline to do this just before a new iPad comes out ?

Seems like if the show is negative it would have a negative impact on sales.

Why do you think it's negative, isn't it so that ABC, Disney and Apple are related?
Do you think there will be any negative things shown?


Love your Avatar, wanted to upvote you there

Edit: Want to see it but sadly I am in Asia and unable to see it.

 

[dr Dunkel]

This type of documentation must be done undercover. Always.

 

[Xenc]

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why isnt there this same level of scrutiny of america's chicken farms?

Humans take priority. I know that may be difficult for you to understand if you're a chicken, but it's just the way it is.

 

[DanHolderman]

Last I checked US corporate profits are up 200-300%.

Really? WHERE did you check? When you say "US corporate" are you talking about blue chip companies, medium sized companies, mom and pop start ups or all of them combined? Can you name companies that had its profits jump 200-300% in 2011? Throwing made-up numbers behind your statement doesn't give it credibility, it makes you look desperate to make your point.

Besides cruising int MacRumors website, I spend far too much time researching and investing in stocks. I can from memory recite the biggest gainers in each market in 2011 (I know where I made my money and where I lost it!). Your numbers are off, WAY OFF.

cheap labor is the future I don't see you bragging about how you can conservatively live off $50/wk.

It's all about the local economy, genius. The cost of living varies depending on where you are in the world. I have lived in third world countries and yes, I can live off of $50 a week (I chose the location!).

You can't compare skilled labor to unskilled labor and cry foul about the wage difference. Using your logic, a dentist should not make more than the kid cleaning out the restrooms at Taco Bell.

The world that you dream of where everyone makes the same wage no matter what job they have is the same dream Stalin had for Russia. No thanks!

Even in communist China they understand the value of educated skilled people and pay them MORE than the undereducated and unskilled peasant workforce that is flocking to the Foxconn factories.

keep on feeling sorry for Apple. I'm sure having suicide nets hanging off the front of buildings shows that it is really a top notch factory to work at.

I don't feel sorry for Apple, as a shareholder I feel great! Those aren't APPLE'S suicide nets, those are FOXCONN suicide nets. Apple only buys products from Foxconn. The fact that so many people think Apple should become the world police and clean up the working conditions in other countries is funny to me.

I understand that since Apple and Foxconn are business partners, the bad publicity that Foxconn has bleeds over to Apple...I get that. I also understand the argument that states Apple should positively influence it's business partners. But I also understand that Apple is spending Billions of dollars in other countries and this is creating an economic boom there.

Cry about the low pay all you want but it is more than what was there BEFORE Apple. You can't deny the fact that despite what your opinion of the pay and working conditions are, thousands of people are flocking to the Foxconn factories for a CHANCE to work there. They just want a chance...if the pay and working conditions are so bad then they would be flocking in the opposite direction!

 

[superduperultra]

Has anyone recorded this so we can watch it online?

 

[applesith]

Really when did I sat stop trading?! I said only fair trade with those that trade fair and china does not trade fair with what they did not invent.

China never claimed to invent the iPad or other Apple device. Designed by Apple in California. China has the workers and assembly lines to manufacture the device/tech Apple made. It's called contracting out manufacturing, comparative advantage, specialization, etc.

 

[Windowlicker]

By making it richer. It's the same reason why you trade with people outside of your house.

By "it richer" you mean "a few people super rich"? Are you getting your data solely from Fox News?

Look at the world economy. Pretty much everyone is more or less screwed in the developed world.

Also, as long as we want to buy an Apple laptop for $999 there's just no way it would not be manufactured somewhere where the standards differ. And there is a way an American corporation can have an effect on how things go, but it's not good business.

Why do you think Apple is touting this enviromentally friendly thing all the time? It's not because they're nice and want to save the world. It's because it's one of the best businesses right now. That's not to say it wouldn't be a good thing. But still.

Just stop and think for a second.

 

[jackc]

By "it richer" you mean "a few people super rich"? Are you getting your data solely from Fox News?

Look at the world economy. Pretty much everyone is more or less screwed in the developed world.

No. Where are you getting your data? Oh, you don't know any. You think the recent recession means globalization has been a failure?

Look at growth in GDP per capita, poverty levels, human development indicators, etc. around the world over the last few decades. Look at countries that have opened up their economies to international trade.

 

[ixodes]

Considering the direct relationship between ABC, Disney & Apple. The feature is sure to be spun in Apple's favor. Despite the claim of openness @ full disclosure, it's not gonna happen. Apple is the master of control, wielding massive influence over all parties involved. This special will be protrayed in a light that shines away from Apple. Within weeks it will all be forgotten, and Apple will look better than ever.

 

[thewitt]

I'm sure this has been asked so pardon my ignorance but can someone give me a reason Apple asked ABC/Nightline to do this just before a new iPad comes out ?

Seems like if the show is negative it would have a negative impact on sales.

Apple did this in direct response to all the negative press that Foxconn was receiving. In a very timely manner at that. Responsiveness like this to customer dissatisfaction is rare today. I applaud Apple for all the steps they have taken.

 

[pmau]

Apple did this in direct response to all the negative press that Foxconn was receiving. In a very timely manner at that. Responsiveness like this to customer dissatisfaction is rare today. I applaud Apple for all the steps they have taken.

Yes, totally agree.

It's not only Apple that mass-produces in China.
The only reason Apple is so prominent are their sales numbers.

Everytime you hear "Apple sold XXX Million units", everyone shouts "Hey, look at all those workers!!!".

So, letting this documentary happen was a good thing.

 

[PracticalMac]

Just saw report:

Balanced reporting. Bill Wier made it clear 3 times Apple was the biggest face of the issue, but others equally culpable.

And it might not be an issue at all.


Link: (video is morning show for now) http://abcnews.go.com/nightline

(I would think workers could have iPods to listen to music, no?)

 

[MonkeyBrainz]

On in 30 minutes. Wee!