About installing Lion os x in new SSD

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by Sashaidar, Feb 24, 2013.

  1. Sashaidar macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2012
    #1
    Dear all

    I switched to mac before a year or so.but i’m still don’t know many about this new environment (in deep).

    I have few questions I would like to ask, & seeking for your generosity in providing me the necessary knowledge.

    I recently bought Macbook pro (i7, third generation-non retina).it came with slow 5400 rpm HDD.i decided to buy SSD (SATA III), & to replace-it.

    Now, I read many posts about it is not wisable to clone from HDD to SSD using software like SuperDuper or CCCloner, due to different sector alignments & something like that..Instead, download a copy from apple store, & burn it to DVD.(but this method is not reachable for me at this time).

    I always prefer to perform clean install (in windows pc).

    My question about this matter is:

    My friend gave me old copy (on bootable DVD) of Mac “Lion” OS.(he downloaded before 1 year from the internet, from some “warez” software website ).he said that I can used this dvd to boot & install Lion on new SSD.
    But..is this early version from Lion will be compatible with new MBP? Meaning when he download this OS Lion, it was (Lion) designed for MBP with 2nd generation intel, & most important designed for READON graphic card, & 2.0 USB.while what I have is nvidia DDR5 with 1 GB with 3.0 USB.
    Is this will be compatible to install on my new mac? Also, is this “Clean” copy of Lion? No adds-on on it?
    No hidden mall software? No tweaking is made?(usually they do on windows), Please advice.

    Also please:
    Regarding SSD, I choose Kingston SSD with sata3..& this drive built in sandforce (I do not know what does this mean)..however, I read that many people advised to make “Trim” process after installing any new SSD on mac, while many others advised NOT to do so (to leave the drive as it is).
    What is the best approach please?

    Thank you in advance for given me some from your precious time.
     
  2. runebinder macrumors 6502a

    runebinder

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2009
    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    #2
    If lion wasn't obtained from official sources then there is no guarantees that it won't have some kind of Software. Also it might have been specifically put together for loading on non Apple hardware (a hackintosh), if that's the case then it won't work on a Mac.

    The 3rd gen i7 Macs came out when Lion was still the main OS so should have the relevant built in drivers for your model if it is just a standard copy of the store version.

    Also modern Macs have a built in internet recovery, put in your SSD and restart holding cmd+R keys. You'll be asked to join a wireless network if that's how you connect or detect a LAN connection if you use that and download the necessary files to boot to install environment and install a fresh copy of OS X.

    On the whole Trim business, from what I've read Sandforce is the firmware controller for the SSD you have and one of the functions of that is called Garbage Collection which does a similar function to Trim. I have heard that GC and Trim together can cause issues on a Mac so best just to let Garbage Collection do it's work. I'm sure someone who has a Sandforce based SSD will tell you whether this is correct or not.
     
  3. Sashaidar thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2012
    #3
    Thank you for that
    the copy that i obtained from my friend is not "Hackintoch" type.but it is old before the intel 3rd release.i am affraid if i use-it will make conflict in hardware (nvidia - USB 3.0).& i believe this old version of Lion OS is not included drivers for newly graphic card (nvidia) or peripherals (USB).
    what do you think please?
     
  4. runebinder macrumors 6502a

    runebinder

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2009
    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    #4
    Depend on what point release it is, however you really should be getting it through official channels. If it's an old version before your model was released you may experience issues, if you haven't got a decent connection at home to do a Internet recovery could you not take it round your friends and use his connection?
     
  5. Mr MM macrumors 65816

    Mr MM

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2011
    #5
    1) Installing Lion:

    Open the mbp, put remove the old HDD, put the new one, close

    turn on the machine, it should try to read the OS, it wont be able to, it will appear a globo pic in the middle of the screen, click on it. Read a book, depending on your internet connection read a sizeable one.

    Install Lion.

    2) Sandforce is the controller of the SSD, it distributes the data and several other tasks, the problem with that is that this controller is unreliable, there are some problems with it, despite the several firmwares updates that have been applied, good ones are the Crucial m4 or the samsung 840 or the 840 pro, would also wait for the crucial m500, it will come with a new controller and its going to be cheaper than what most offer

    3) Yes you should enable trim with your SSD, there is an app called trim enabler, download it and follow the instructions.

    That was easy wasnt it? I would return that kingston pos and get a crucial or samsung.
     
  6. johnnnw macrumors 65816

    johnnnw

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2013
    #6

    I wouldn't say it's a POS. The speeds on it are alright, and if he got a good deal then that's cool. The sandforce controller isn't ideal, I agree, but it's not the end of the world if he can't return it. There's videos on youtube of people with the Kingston and it works fine.
     
  7. Mr MM macrumors 65816

    Mr MM

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    Jun 29, 2011
    #7
    I have a sandforce controller, it just barely works.
     
  8. johnnnw macrumors 65816

    johnnnw

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    Feb 7, 2013
    #8
    What just barely works about it? The speeds?
     
  9. Mr MM macrumors 65816

    Mr MM

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    Jun 29, 2011
    #9
    consistency, bsods, controller failure and some other stuff, you can google it. One annoying thing is the inability to wake from hibernation, the last issue is not as widespread as it once was, but its frustrating.
     
  10. Sashaidar thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2012
    #10
    something i cannot understand
    in windows..you install the OS..then install the needed/designated drivers.
    how about Lion? is the drivers are [built-in]? if so..then each release of MBP should have its own OS.right? meaning MBP with nvidia & USB 3.0 well need OS that built especially for that. correct?..
     
  11. johnnnw macrumors 65816

    johnnnw

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    Feb 7, 2013
    #11
    Wow, that does sound ******. I saw a bunch of youtube videos with them in Macbooks and they said they worked fine I guess they were new owners and hadnt experienced the problems.
     
  12. Wolfpup macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2006
    #12
    Yeah, just do that. There's nooooooo way I'd use some weird/scary OS on my PC.

    I reaaaaaally wish Apple still included recovery media, but unfortunately few do now :(

    Actually you can just download the installer from *Apple* before swapping drives too.

    All SSDs have "garbage collection" of some sort, and it kind of helps to make up for not having TRIM.

    A Sandforce drive is one of the worst you can get if you don't have TRIM support. Your first choice should probably be Intel's 320 drive, then Crucial's M4 (and the M500 will probably be better still when it's available). Avoid Sandforce without Trim, and I'd avoid them anyway...if for some reason you have to have Sandforce, at least get one from Intel, I.E. the 520 or 330/335. Samsung's even worse without TRIM I think, and buggy too.
     
  13. Sashaidar thread starter macrumors newbie

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    Jun 3, 2012
    #13
    it is "Kingston SSDNow Enterprise Class E100 400GB SATA 3.0 6GB/s"
    please to check this type/spec on kingston website.you might change your mind.
     
  14. Mr MM macrumors 65816

    Mr MM

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    Jun 29, 2011
    #14
    no it wont. the problem is in the controller not in the firmware, intel uses sandforce for some of its SSDs, despite writing their own firmware, they still suffer from the same issues, albeit less.

    There are 2 important things when looking at a SSD:

    1) Random read and write at lower queue depths, which means random read and write with very small sizes, which is one of the most executed operations in the OS, and by the OS

    2) Consistency of performance, the SSDs of the past and some from now lack that, and lack badly, sandforce before had a shameful performance with files that werent compressed, now its not that bad.

    In the end it really doesnt matter if I sell you hot dogs and slap on some premium hot dogs using the same components, they are still hot dogs. Barely meat most of the time
     
  15. peterson12 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2012
    #15
    Mr.MM, you are not totally right here. For that matter, currently any SSD you name is not very reliable. SSDs are still in premature stage and it is obvious that there will be cut-throat competition in this phase. I have been using SandForce Controllers in my test lab and believe me they are not bad as the current perception is. As you stated, Intel SSDs still had issues after their prioperity firmware updates, the catch here is Intel firmware is a layer on SF controller firmware and hence the issue will be resolved if the SF firmware is up to date before Intel firmware is applied. Many people would not be knowing this and keep disputing. :)

    ----------

    Yes, Wolfpup is right. New series of SandForce controllers like Intel 520 come with TRIM support and they seriously outperform their predecessors. I think in this category, SandForce rules than any of their nearest counterparts. Was just going through a blog post which has speculations of new controller from SandForce. Quite eager for this launch!! ;)
     
  16. robvas macrumors 68020

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    Mar 29, 2009
    Location:
    USA
    #16
    You either have a bad drive or POS motherboard/SATA controller.
     
  17. runebinder macrumors 6502a

    runebinder

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    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    #17
    The drivers are baked into the OS and updated on point releases. So there is not specific versions for different types of Macs, however your model will probably need a minimum point version. Not sure what it'd be but as far as I'm aware the latest is 10.7.5 so that'd work OK with your Mac whereas 10.7.1 would not.

    Hope that makes a bit more sense. If you have not swapped the HDD for the SSD you can find out what version it is running by selecting the Apple logo in the top left hand corner of the Menu bar and clicking on About this Mac.

    If you do an Internet recovery it will automatically download the correct version for your MBP.
     
  18. minifridge1138 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2010
    #18
    Personally, I'd just use Carbon Copy Cloner/SuperDuper/Disk Utility to clone the old hard drive's content to your new SSD. There's no problem doing that (there's nothing strange about disk sectors, you'll be fine).

    If you don't want to do that (again, no reason not to) then Internet recovery is going to be your best option. It will download the correct version of OS X for your hardware (including the drivers).

    I wouldn't trust a strange ISO from a friend (for several reasons).
     
  19. Mr MM macrumors 65816

    Mr MM

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2011
    #19


    Not really, the problem is that despite numerous firmware updates, they keep committing the same mistakes.

    My guess is that the design of the controller is problematic.

    not really at all, been used in 3 notebooks, all had the same problem. Granted this is a 2nd gen controller of sandforce, not the current 3rd gen
     

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