Adobe's Flash CS5 can export to HTML5 for devices like iPad!

[bnerd]

For all those people who thought Adobe was against HTML5 ... sorry you're wrong. in fact upcoming Flash CS5 can export animations right to the HTML5 Canvas!! Check it out.

Its toward the end of the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v69S22ZBBqA

This means it will be simple for a flash developer to quickly use Flash to create HTML5 content. This should not only make Adobe happy (because they can still sell their Flash products) but should make Apple happy too.. because now they have all these millions of Flash developers that can port their Flash stuff to HTML5 with the new Adobe CS5 tools.

Another thing.. people should remember Adobe doesn't make profit off the Flash player... they make money off the tools that create flash. So even though the Flash Player team is pushing Flash on iPad, Adobe the company could care less... as you can see from the video above.

 

[Mr. Anderson]

As a flash developer, this will be nice. But its still a very small market compared to the rest of the web.

D

 

[bnerd]

Right now HTML5 doesn't have that killer IDE to create kool HTML5 stuff.

Wouldn't it be amazing if Flash CS5 became the tool of choice for creating HTML5 interactive content!

I would poop my pants if thats what happens. I guess we'll see when CS5 is released.

One other thought I had... now that flash games on the web will be able to convert their stuff to HTML5 ... will this still be a threat to the App Store?? How will Apple fight against this? I know they won't block HTML5 content.

 

[doug in albq]

This is obviously the way things are going. Of course Adobe was going to make
Flash (the application) be able to output their animations to html5, or whatever format is the format of choice for the moment.

Flash Catalyst will soon be available as well, making it even easier to produce dynamic web content without having to be a code-monkey.

This still will not make Apple happy, because their goal is to "stick it" to Adobe in any way possible.

This is more about a corporate grudge match than a format war...

I surf the net every day and i notice Flash animation / dynamic content is EVERYWHERE!

I am not sure where the extreme Apple fanboys surf the internet--saying they do not miss Flash content--it seems to still exist at 75% of the major websites in the US.

Still see advertisements hiring "Flash Programmers" all the time.

The format is not dead, and will not be dead ever! (It may change its name though)...really this is just how we choose to format the output of the animation, and Adobe (with a bit of work) can most likely output their "Flash" animations / dynamic content to whatever format the world wants...

 

[samcraig]

This is obviously the way things are going. Of course Adobe was going to make
Flash (the application) be able to output their animations to html5, or whatever format is the format of choice for the moment.

Flash Catalyst will soon be available as well, making it even easier to produce dynamic web content without having to be a code-monkey.

This still will not make Apple happy, because their goal is to "stick it" to Adobe in any way possible.

This is more about a corporate grudge match than a format war...

I surf the net every day and i notice Flash animation / dynamic content is EVERYWHERE!

I am not sure where the extreme Apple fanboys surf the internet--saying they do not miss Flash content--it seems to still exist at 75% of the major websites in the US.

Still see advertisements hiring "Flash Programmers" all the time.

The format is not dead, and will not be dead ever! (It may change its name though)...really this is just how we choose to format the output of the animation, and Adobe (with a bit of work) can most likely output their "Flash" animations / dynamic content to whatever format the world wants...

Thanks for your additional voice of reason.

And there is room for multiple formats. Heck - real player still exists, wmv, and lots of other formats which aren't as widely used. To "suppose" that Flash is dying ANYTIME soon is ludicrous.

 

[bossxii]

This is obviously the way things are going. Of course Adobe was going to make
Flash (the application) be able to output their animations to html5, or whatever format is the format of choice for the moment.

Flash Catalyst will soon be available as well, making it even easier to produce dynamic web content without having to be a code-monkey.

This still will not make Apple happy, because their goal is to "stick it" to Adobe in any way possible.

This is more about a corporate grudge match than a format war...

I surf the net every day and i notice Flash animation / dynamic content is EVERYWHERE!

I am not sure where the extreme Apple fanboys surf the internet--saying they do not miss Flash content--it seems to still exist at 75% of the major websites in the US.

Still see advertisements hiring "Flash Programmers" all the time.

The format is not dead, and will not be dead ever! (It may change its name though)...really this is just how we choose to format the output of the animation, and Adobe (with a bit of work) can most likely output their "Flash" animations / dynamic content to whatever format the world wants...

The only flash I find that "click2flash" blocks that I use on sites such as Hulu, ESPN360 and a few others is streaming video. The 1" tall x 6" long boxes that say "FLASH" in the middle are ads... I don't miss them and I don't waste time loading them.

I don't doubt teens and college kids play alot of flash games and such but I can view tons of the web and only have to click on a video if I chose to watch it in flash. I don't find it an issue on my iPhone as I have apps for sites such as Youtube, ESPN, CNN, NYT etc.. that deliver their video content via the app. Just as they will deliver their video content via an app to the iPad.

I keep hearing these huge 75% of the web gone claims... and do my fair share of surfing and rarely find it a problem. Video seems to be the main thing we miss out on without flash, but clearly as Youtube has proven their are other means to deliver video which will make flash even less of a factor. I don't care why Apple, Mozilla, Virgin Mobile and even MS (WinMo 7)don't allow or have flash currently on their devices but I'm all for an open standard of delivering content created in flash or otherwise to all mobile devices without requiring desktop type hardware.

This looks promising for those who have already paid Adobe for the dev tools and can still put their content on many different devices vs locking everyone into a proprietary plug in that if flash.

 

[Night Spring]

I am not sure where the extreme Apple fanboys surf the internet--saying they do not miss Flash content--it seems to still exist at 75% of the major websites in the US.

And I'm wondering where *you* surf the internet, because in my impression, a lot more than 75% of the sites I visit don't require flash in order to access their main content. They may have flash videos/animations in sidebars, which I mostly ignore.

I'm not saying you are wrong or I am right, just pointing out that internet surfing habits vary widely, leading to wide disparity in people's impressions of how important flash is.

 

[samcraig]

This thing I have maintained from the "beginning" on this subject is that the average user won't know why they can't play videos/access content on the sites they DO visit that DO have/use flash. They will just see it as a limitation. And to think that all these sites will magically switch over anytime soon given the low adoption rate (to date) for desktop browsers - is a bit naive.

What you'll most likely see in the interim are sites offering both formats if they have the bandwidth (i.e. man power) to create the extra pages/video players until a wider adoption takes place.

Needless to say - it could very well be that HTML5 isn't pervasive enough to replace or be the "winner" on the web until the iPad is into a few more generations.

 

[Bodhi395]

I think this is a good idea, and hope it helps make the HTML5 standard more widespread. I also heard that Adobe is going to let you export flash-based apps to the iphone app format, so they then can be distributed in the app store. This is another great idea, and could eliminate alot of the complaints that people can't play their favorite flash games on the ipad(i.e. Farmville and such). If a game is sufficiently popular, the developer would obviously want to make it an iphone/ipad app and get millions of extra potential players. Making it as simple as exporting the flash game you already have into another format, instead of having to rewrite the entire code, would make that much more likely to happen.

 

[VenusianSky]

I think that Adobe will kill Flash themselves, just like how they are killing ColdFusion with crappy support

 

[smetvid]

I think that Adobe will kill Flash themselves, just like how they are killing ColdFusion with crappy support

And lets not forget how they killed Director and Shockwave.

 

[smetvid]

Flash isn't exporting html5 as much as exporting their new FXG format which is a special version of SVG. I'm not really sure if FXG will allow code or if it is just animation only. That means this will help with banner ads and cartoons but may not help with rich web applications built with Flash.

 

[Compile 'em all]

I am not sure where the extreme Apple fanboys surf the internet--saying they do not miss Flash content--it seems to still exist at 75% of the major websites in the US..

What the hell are you smoking?

The only time I ever need to enable click2flash is for youtube and embedded facebook videos. 99.9999% of what is served on the web with flash is video and ads. Period.

 

[Bodhi395]

What the hell are you smoking?

The only time I ever need to enable click2flash is for youtube and embedded facebook videos. 99.9999% of what is served on the web with flash is video and ads. Period.

Period? You forgot to mention web games and apps in there, which are almost all flash-based. Look at almost any game on facebook, which millions upon millions of people use everyday, and they're almost all flash.

 

[smetvid]

If you are somebody that views forums, social media websites and news sites all day then yes Flash is only really used for video and banners. There is a lot of sites out there however that are built with Flash that people don't look at everyday but they are still created in Flash. I'm talking about media companies, photographers, cartoon networks, car companies, clothing companies and pretty much any company that wants to offer more of a rich interactive experience other then menus bars and web links. Sure maybe a lot of people here don't view that stuff everyday but that does not change the fact that they are out there. I don't view porn on the internet but I can't go around and say it isn't there or nobody views it just because I do not.

As much as some people may want to think, the internet is not just Youtube, porn, news sites and forums. There is a whole movement of artists and designers that have been working to push the internet to levels that move it away from a publishing concept and into more of a desktop application with broadcast video environment. A lot of the design concepts that were limited to animation and video production are blending into the web. Some people think this is the wrong place for that type of content but if not here then where? TV is too expensive to deliver to and desktop applications are hard to share with users. Iphone apps help this a little bit but people cannot run those apps outside of a apple mobile device. That leaves the internet as the only place to evolve visual rich content.

 

[EssentialParado]

One other thought I had... now that flash games on the web will be able to convert their stuff to HTML5 ... will this still be a threat to the App Store?? How will Apple fight against this? I know they won't block HTML5 content.

Apple don't care if people make their Apps and games in HTML 5. Their reasons for blocking Flash were never out of fear of it being a threat to the App store.

And there is room for multiple formats. Heck - real player still exists, wmv, and lots of other formats which aren't as widely used. To "suppose" that Flash is dying ANYTIME soon is ludicrous.

C'mon… realplayer? Are you being serious? That was one of the worst things that ever happened to the internet. If you're making an argument supposedly in favor of Flash by comparing it to realplayer, then I'm sorry but your opinion can't be relevant.

 

[samcraig]

C'mon… realplayer? Are you being serious? That was one of the worst things that ever happened to the internet. If you're making an argument supposedly in favor of Flash by comparing it to realplayer, then I'm sorry but your opinion can't be relevant.

How old are you? Seriously? RealPlayer - while not the best - was extremely pervasive and useful on the web for audio (especially) and video playback and was used as much as streaming WMVs way before streaming flash was popular.

One of the worst things to happen to the internet? Hyperbole again.

And I really don't care whether or not YOU think my opinion is relevant. Who made you the authority? Keep thinking you know more than anyone else if it helps you sleep at night.

 

[t0mat0]

How old are you? Seriously? RealPlayer - while not the best - was extremely pervasive and useful on the web for audio (especially) and video playback and was used as much as streaming WMVs way before streaming flash was popular.

One of the worst things to happen to the internet? Hyperbole again.

And I really don't care whether or not YOU think my opinion is relevant. Who made you the authority? Keep thinking you know more than anyone else if it helps you sleep at night.

No reason that PC World voted it the Number 2 of the Top 25 Worst Tech products of all time?

http://www.pcworld.com/article/125772-8/the_25_worst_tech_products_of_all_time.html

A frustrating inability to play media files--due in part to constantly changing file formats--was only part of Real's problem. RealPlayer also had a disturbing way of making itself a little too much at home on your PC--installing itself as the default media player, taking liberties with your Windows Registry, popping up annoying "messages" that were really just advertisements, and so on.

And some of RealNetworks' habits were even more troubling. For example, shortly after RealJukeBox appeared in 1999, security researcher Richard M. Smith discovered that the software was assigning a unique ID to each user and phoning home with the titles of media files played on it--while failing to disclose any of this in its privacy policy. Turns out that RealPlayer G2, which had been out since the previous year, also broadcast unique IDs. After a tsunami of bad publicity and a handful of lawsuits, Real issued a patch to prevent the software from tracking users' listening habits. But less than a year later, Real was in hot water again for tracking the habits of its RealDownload download-management software customers.

To be fair, RealNetworks deserves credit for offering a free media player and for hanging in there against Microsoft's relentless onslaught. We appreciate the fact that there's an alternative to Windows Media Player; we just wish it were a better one.

 

[Night Spring]

If you are somebody that views forums, social media websites and news sites all day then yes Flash is only really used for video and banners. There is a lot of sites out there however that are built with Flash that people don't look at everyday but they are still created in Flash. I'm talking about media companies, photographers, cartoon networks, car companies, clothing companies and pretty much any company that wants to offer more of a rich interactive experience other then menus bars and web links.

I've seen the type of sites I think you are talking about, and I avoid them as much as possible because they are slow, hard to navigate, and I often can't read any print such pages have, because the print is part of graphics images and not independently scalable. While I appreciate the intention and effort of the designers of such sites to provide a "rich interactive experience," unfortunately most of the time I find such sites barely usable. Granted, the problem may not be inherent in Flash, and more a problem with site design philosophy. But it's a major reason why I don't care for Flash.

 

[VenusianSky]

I've seen the type of sites I think you are talking about, and I avoid them as much as possible because they are slow, hard to navigate, and I often can't read any print such pages have, because the print is part of graphics images and not independently scalable. While I appreciate the intention and effort of the designers of such sites to provide a "rich interactive experience," unfortunately most of the time I find such sites barely usable. Granted, the problem may not be inherent in Flash, and more a problem with site design philosophy. But it's a major reason why I don't care for Flash.

I visit and purchase stuff from this Flash-based site all the time: www.axisrecords.com. Works pretty well IMO. It's fast and navigation is a breeze. As you said, I think it is all in the design.

 

[samcraig]

C'mon… realplayer? Are you being serious?

No reason that PC World voted it the Number 2 of the Top 25 Worst Tech products of all time?

http://www.pcworld.com/article/125772-8/the_25_worst_tech_products_of_all_time.html

Thank you for missing the point anyway. The issue wasn't whether or not RealPlayer is or is not good on the web. But leave it to you two to belabor that point to shy away from the actual topic of FLASH. What I said was "And there is room for multiple formats. Heck - real player still exists, wmv, and lots of other formats which aren't as widely used. To "suppose" that Flash is dying ANYTIME soon is ludicrous."

And a variety of formats do exist and are pervasive on the web. Flash isn't going to go away because of the iPad anytime soon. Those that think otherwise are not being realistic or honest with themselves - even if you despise flash.

 

[Night Spring]

I visit and purchase stuff from this Flash-based site all the time: www.axisrecords.com. Works pretty well IMO. It's fast and navigation is a breeze. As you said, I think it is all in the design.

That's probably one of the better designed flash sites I've seen, but the fonts are still too small for me to read comfortably for any length of time. I'm afraid this site won't get any business from me, even if I were interested in the type of music they offer.

 

[smetvid]

I've seen the type of sites I think you are talking about, and I avoid them as much as possible because they are slow, hard to navigate, and I often can't read any print such pages have, because the print is part of graphics images and not independently scalable. While I appreciate the intention and effort of the designers of such sites to provide a "rich interactive experience," unfortunately most of the time I find such sites barely usable. Granted, the problem may not be inherent in Flash, and more a problem with site design philosophy. But it's a major reason why I don't care for Flash.

I really appreciate your feedback and sadly I do agree with you. This isn't so much a violation of Flash itself but giving people unlimited creative license to "Think different" The same abuses will happen with CSS3 and HTML5 as well. Give somebody tools to do crazy things and they will do crazy things. I teach web design at a college and also getting my Masters right now in Web design and the main focus is usability and bringing it back to designers. Flash is not a bad thing but people need to tone it down a little bit. Sort of like when computer based editing became the norm for people and they abused cheesy transitions and effects. This was a huge abuse with the Newtek Video Toaster.

Right now rich media is in a very experimental infancy and it will take some time to grow. The odd thing about some of these Flash sites is that those agencies a lot of times win design awards for those off the wall designs. Companies keep buying it up because it brings in a new market of young people who like to look at "flashy" things instead of read text.

Not everybody is going to love the rich media websites and they are not designed for everybody to love them. They target a niche market unlike Facebook or the New York Times which has to appeal to as large a group as possible. I am a designer and I hate some of the Flash sites out there and I also wouldn't go near them if somebody paid me to. There are however a lot of sites that do work and the sales for those companies keep going up so something must be working. The web is turning into a form of TV advertising. Some over the top Flash content is no different the over the top TV commercials that try to be different and stand out.. It gets people interested even if it is only some of the people. Getting some people to buy a product is better then no people because the website is boring.

I hear you about the text size issue as well. The sad thing is that there could be a way to deal with it but a lot of Flash designers get lazy and don't want to think about it. In fact it would be pretty easy to write a tiny bit of code that would allow the user to change the text size.

 

[blackNBUK]

I visit and purchase stuff from this Flash-based site all the time: www.axisrecords.com. Works pretty well IMO. It's fast and navigation is a breeze. As you said, I think it is all in the design.

That is one of the better all Flash sites that I've seen but it still has some usability problems. I can't find any way of selecting text for Copy-and-Paste, which is real problem should you want to use their address or some dates from the calendar. The method of scrolling in the store is not immediately obvious and there is no support for my mouse-wheel. I also wonder what screen-reader support they have.

 

[skndrdmr]

Adobe's Flash CS5 can export to HTML5!! for devices like iPad!

The effort involved in creating some of the the stuff you can do in seconds in flash is massively frustrating - masking is a good example of that, simply adding all the elements to the canvas is another

there's also easy access and to and control of drop shadow, tweening, blend modes, blurring etc

Flash is very useful and the costs for creating anything comprable in canvas / javascript are easily double that of creating them in flash which is a hard sell to clients