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AMD Announces New Mac Pro-Suitable Radeon HD 7970 Graphics Card
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My mac is built for comfort, my PC is built for speed.
I am a 3d graphics artist and would love Apple to catch up and provide decent OpenGL options at a competitive price but they don't seem to be that bothered.
Thus, when I have some really heavy 3D scenes to deal with, or some hefty rendering, out comes the PC because the Mac isn't as nimble.
That said, video, music, image editing and photo management on the Mac is just such a massively more pleasant experience than in Windows. Lots of codecs, reliability and good results, even from free software that came with OSX. It's for those reasons that I say the Mac is built for comfort.
For gaming, I have a PS3 and an XBox which I prefer, despite that my PC is a beast and can handle anything I throw at it. Reason being that I like to sit on the sofa for gaming, and sit at my desk when working. I'm not a frame rate junky and I still think that the current gen of consoles produce amazing results given how old they are.
I guess what I'm saying in a somewhat verbose manner is that all these technologies have their strengths and weaknesses. Arguing over it is pointless really.
I am a 3d graphics artist and would love Apple to catch up and provide decent OpenGL options at a competitive price but they don't seem to be that bothered.
Thus, when I have some really heavy 3D scenes to deal with, or some hefty rendering, out comes the PC because the Mac isn't as nimble.
That said, video, music, image editing and photo management on the Mac is just such a massively more pleasant experience than in Windows. Lots of codecs, reliability and good results, even from free software that came with OSX. It's for those reasons that I say the Mac is built for comfort.
For gaming, I have a PS3 and an XBox which I prefer, despite that my PC is a beast and can handle anything I throw at it. Reason being that I like to sit on the sofa for gaming, and sit at my desk when working. I'm not a frame rate junky and I still think that the current gen of consoles produce amazing results given how old they are.
I guess what I'm saying in a somewhat verbose manner is that all these technologies have their strengths and weaknesses. Arguing over it is pointless really.
True this.
Windows 7 lists "1 GHz/1 GiB" as the minimum (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/products/system-requirements), which higher-end systems from 2000 and mid-range systems from 2002 easily meet.
The older systems likely won't have graphics cards that can support the Aero UI, but they can certainly run Win7.
Microsoft's support for legacy hardware on the desktop is to second to none, and only the clueless would argue otherwise.
Apple, on the other hand, seems to view OS revisions as opportunities to drop support for hardware and force upgrades. Seems reasonable for a hardware company to try to do that if they're interested in quarterly profits rather than customer satisfaction....
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Asking for proof is so lazy. Why not just find proof that sales are increasing? That'd be a really strong argument. But instead, you appeal to his lack of proof, which is a non-point.
This is true. There's a video floating around showing some intrepid guy upgrading his way from Windows 2.0 to 7. It's impressive stuff.
But...
I do think there comes a point. Having legacy support that far back is really more a placebo these days. It gives you a warm feeling knowing you have it if you need, but...well...chances are good you never will. You go into Windows deep enough, and you'll see old icons and files from NT3.1 in there, doing nothing but filling up HDD space. Yeah, you might have a couple of guys in Wisconsin who might need that code to run some old plotter software. But hell, chances are good they're not gonna upgrade to 7 anytime soon. And if they do, they'll use a virtual machine to run their software. So why is it there?
I'm hoping MS building Hyper-V in their consumer OSes will eventually lead the way to a cleaner, more streamlined Windows. They don't have to be as pointlessly ruthless about clearing out the legacy cruft as Apple is. But it would allow for much more flexibility than what they've got now.
Basically, a happy medium between the two extremes.
Bassfingers said:
Holy crap. You fail debate class forever.
No, actually it's not. I don't want to do research to prove him wrong, I'm not going to invest that much of my time. Additionally, several others posted proof of sales increasing yet he continued to say they are decreasing whilst ignoring any requests for proof of what he said. So I too pressed him for proof, twice, with no response.
Errr, it's kind of easier for MS to support older x86 computers given we still use x86 (albeit x86-64) today.
All the PPC macs of course were going to be dropped, thats two different code paths and completely against the idea of OS X in the first place. That is running it on a small set of hardware for higher code optimisation, etc.
And besides, just because W7 runs on a P4 from 2002 does NOT mean it runs well.
The reasons are at an operating system level. If you want to know more about it, watch this video, it's fascinating.
http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Chec...haraj-Shimming-the-World-Dreaming-in-Assembly
Also, I posted a comment early about running Windows 7 pretty well on a 2002 Dell with a mobile Pentium 4 processor. One core, pretty pathetic processor when compared to a core 2 duo. Here's a video of that 2002 laptop.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV2OIMyhnYQ
It also had 768mb of ram.
No Aero, but it looked much better than XP.
I even ran CoolIris on it, and it ran perfectly. Not bad for a 2002 laptop woth 768mb or ram.
I'm right with you dude, even though I don't own a Mac Pro presently. I have to say though, bragging about recently upgrading to a couple of three year old cards doesn't exactly help your, and my position.
I was talking to a system admin a while back and a number of apps that work perfectly on XP don't work on W7 anymore, and even if these apps are upgraded (Tends to be paid upgrades which is ££££) then even some of those don't work properly.
Unfortunately back compatibility is a massive pain in the backside, and personally I like the fact Apple ditched PPC (Although I'm abit more dubious about the original Core chips - Lion seems to run fine on them *shrug* - probably a stepping stone before all 32 bit support is removed).
I *still* run XP next to W7, because there are games (Medal of Honor) and a few other little apps which simply refuse to run properly on W7 x64.
However there are no apps which run under PPC which I use anymore, because they have all been x86'ifed.
Well, comments about consoles does fit in the thread where Mac gamers are chiming in about GPUs and outdated tech specs. You dont have to be a forum snob. It's just as relevant as people griping about the price of the card.
The general feel so far says yes you can, although the real pressing question that goes above price and backward compatibility is whether or not it will have TB as it would give older Mac users a state of the art port.
I can't stand green people that think everyone should just fork out $1,000s to actually be green. Most people even in rich countries can't afford to save the environment beyond recycling.
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Haha, my argument? Exactly what argument is that? Go back to sleep
Nostromo said:
Haha, my argument? Exactly what argument is that? Go back to sleep
You didn't make the initial argument, however, your statement that "asking for proof is lazy" is quite dubious. Burden of proof is always on the person who states a fact. We shouldn't have to disprove or prove what other people post. They have to back up their own argument.
Since you you state that as a fact, I'll need to see proof before proceeding any further.
In fact, I've installed Windows 7 on a 6 year old Pentium 4 desktop with 512MB of RAM and it's not laggy what most of us (including myself) think. In fact, it's smooth as butter.
As for gaming. I have an Xbox 360 because my laptop (see my sig) can barely play some games. It can tolerate Valve games like Left 4 Dead 2, Portal 2 etc. but it barely can even run the first Crysis. I'm waiting out for the 2012 iMac which will be guaranteed to have Ivy Bridge and AMD Radeon 7xxxM (still better than the 6xxxM GPUs) or even GeForce 6xxM GPus.
Michalos, Alex. 1969. Principles of Logic. Englewood Cliffs: Prentice-Hall. p 370 - "usually one who makes an assertion must assume the responsibility of defending it."
Did you miss the part where it's a 433 pages long book ?
ISBN-10: 0137094027
I doubt the guy sees any irony in stating something and then probably spending a chapter justifying it. Or maybe you're just arguing to argue again. Anyway, it seems you're quite immune to facts, so I don't know how you fit in this discussion at all.
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No wonder apple lost interest in mac pro production. Bunch of kids with dorito fingers quarrelling over what game runs better on what. Apple if your listening... pros actually use your machines!!! We're just too busy working on them to chime in on these forums all the time. I've worked in so many graphics departments in NYC and most of us use mac pros. Don't abandon the users that helped your growth!
No wonder apple lost interest in mac pro production. Bunch of kids with dorito fingers quarrelling over what game runs better on what. Apple if your listening... pros actually use your machines!!! We're just too busy working on them to chime in on these forums all the time. I've worked in so many graphics departments in NYC and most of us use mac pros. Don't abandon the users that helped your growth!
I think Apple knows the validity of your statement.
Most pros don't visit this forum. Like you say, they are too busy trying to make a living.
I work 35 hours a week + overtime.
Yet I can find time to waste on Macrumors. Are you saying my job is not a professional career ?
