Americans, something has been bugging me.

[snberk103]

....

My holiday next year (wait, it's now this year!) is to the US East Coast. I'll play the tipping game (ie tip lots of strange people) even though I think it's stupid.

I wish you could see my cousin's husband in action. They are born and bred New Yorkers, and are relatively well off. When we go out with them, on our visits there, he seems to tip everybody. Taxi drivers, doormen, waiters, maitre-de, etc. But he is smooth.... he seems to have a endless supply of dollar bills in his pocket (could be bigger bills, I don't know?) and there is just a little elbow touch, and they both look to the side, and their two hands sort of kinda come near each other. And I know he is tipping... but I have never actually seen a bill pass between them. That comes from a lifetime of tipping in NY.

Me.... I'm digging around for a small bill, trying to figure out if this is a $1 or $2, or $5 occasion... and by the time I'm ready to clumsily hand it over the recipient is likely to be already onto his next customer. My advice is to have a supply of $1s in your pocket, separate from your spending money, and to have one in your hand before you receive the service. Being cool at tipping is definitely easier said than done....

 

[Vudoo]

As mention, it all depends on the establishment. I prefer to be billed at the very end. If a place asks for payment after each drink, then I usually will open up a tab with my credit card even if I only have two drinks. When I was in Vietnam, some clubs asked for payments immediately and some waited until the very end as well.

As for tipping, I'm not a fan of the system but I adhere to it. 10% for below average, 15% for average and about 20% for above average and this adheres to buffets as well. Also keep in mind that restaurants tend to pool tips so stiffing one person can affect every waiter/waitress working there. So if I really get bad service, I will ask if the tip is pooled or not to make my decision on how much to tip.

When I was in Vietnam, even though tipping is not required, I felt I was obligated since the income level is so much lower than the US. There is a reason why Americans are known to be the best tippers, it's become part of our culture.

 

[Mac'nCheese]

I wish you could see my cousin's husband in action. They are born and bred New Yorkers, and are relatively well off. When we go out with them, on our visits there, he seems to tip everybody. Taxi drivers, doormen, waiters, maitre-de, etc. But he is smooth.... he seems to have a endless supply of dollar bills in his pocket (could be bigger bills, I don't know?) and there is just a little elbow touch, and they both look to the side, and their two hands sort of kinda come near each other. And I know he is tipping... but I have never actually seen a bill pass between them. That comes from a lifetime of tipping in NY.

Me.... I'm digging around for a small bill, trying to figure out if this is a $1 or $2, or $5 occasion... and by the time I'm ready to clumsily hand it over the recipient is likely to be already onto his next customer. My advice is to have a supply of $1s in your pocket, separate from your spending money, and to have one in your hand before you receive the service. Being cool at tipping is definitely easier said than done....

If we switch to dollar coins, he's gonna have to learn some new moves.

 

[snberk103]

If we switch to dollar coins, he's gonna have to learn some new moves.

It'll certainly get a bit more noisy! We (Canada) switched to dollar coins (and two dollar coins) a long time ago. I wonder if it's easier to keep track of the tip pocket. Coin = $1 or $2 (easy to tell apart by feel) and bill = $5. That way you can just bring out 'exact change', as it were.

Community I live in nobody gets "tipped" directly. Either we add it to the restaurant bill or in the 'karma cup' on the counter. I guess the exception would be bartenders...

 

[dec.]

I've never such a thing. So yes, Quebec may be the exception (we are in almost every area after all...). Here we tip 15% minimum if not more.

I've never heard the same about other parts of Canada either. Actually I'm used to paying 20% here in Ontario (and all other parts of Canada when I visit) as general guideline.

 

[sviato]

You are expected to tip in the US. Servers are paid below minimum wage here. You are allowed to tip nothing, but this is a very strong statement of your displeasure with the food and service and an indication that you will never be returning.

This is simply the way things are done here. You're allowed to be annoyed by it, but please try to understand the reasons behind it.


Incidentally, the best tippers are usually people who are/have been in service.

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

I'm not employing them, so why am I paying a per drink wage? Or rather, why am I required to? I tip when service is good. If I get a lot of drinks then I'll tip too, usually 10-15%. But if you open 1-2 beers for me then are you really expecting much compensation?

Doesn't seem like their low wage should be my problem. I'll tip if I enjoyed the service (which, tbh, at most places is less than stellar). If tipping is so required and expected now than just change the ********* model and charge more upfront for drinks and food.

 

[GoCubsGo]

What is the point in a minimum wage if people get paid under it? Bit ridiculous if you ask me. As is not including the tip in the price in the first place. Just as well I'm not going back. I don't want to get shot.

You don't want to get shot? That's a horribly narrow-minded way of looking at America. I'm sure I could come to your country and risk being shot as well. It's disgusting that you would even think that way.

Tips to me are a way of life. I am American born and raised. California wait/bar staff earn minimum wage, not below. I want to say Washington does as well but I don't recall. Regardless of base pay I have a sliding scale for tipping. 10% if you absolutely ****ed up. Whether you were rude, just ignored me, or anything else that could have been avoided. 15% if you did the bare minimum. That is if you took my order, brought me a drink and food, and then the check. 20% + for anything more. Bar staff gets the same regardless. I'm a very nice person and often wind up talking to staff; I will always do well by them. I rarely, if ever, find myself giving less than 20%. To me it is not as though I feel like I'm required, I simply feel as though these folks do rely on tips and I absorb the cost to tip in the cost of a meal as far as I'm concerned.

 

[theautopilot]

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

I'm not employing them, so why am I paying a per drink wage? Or rather, why am I required to? I tip when service is good. If I get a lot of drinks then I'll tip too, usually 10-15%. But if you open 1-2 beers for me then are you really expecting much compensation?

Doesn't seem like their low wage should be my problem. I'll tip if I enjoyed the service (which, tbh, at most places is less than stellar). If tipping is so required and expected now than just change the ********* model and charge more upfront for drinks and food.

It's crazy I agree. In the UK, while tipping is expected more in cabs and restaurants etc, its seen as a gesture of gratitude. If people work hard, are friendly and do a good job, then they will probably get a tip. But a tip is generally seen as a privilege you earn, not a right. It's seen as a bonus, not a wage. That said, they are low paid jobs here too (minimum wage applies though) and I know most servers do make a good living from tips. People who say the serve is poor in be UK are wrong IMO, but it depends where you go.

 

[zioxide]

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

I'm not employing them, so why am I paying a per drink wage? Or rather, why am I required to? I tip when service is good. If I get a lot of drinks then I'll tip too, usually 10-15%. But if you open 1-2 beers for me then are you really expecting much compensation?

Doesn't seem like their low wage should be my problem. I'll tip if I enjoyed the service (which, tbh, at most places is less than stellar). If tipping is so required and expected now than just change the ********* model and charge more upfront for drinks and food.

If you're not tipping them, then serving you the next time "shouldn't be their problem."

The system here is what it is. Don't make the little guy suffer because you don't like the system. After nearly 5 years in the industry, I never met a single person who liked the system, but the people working in these jobs don't exactly have the power to change it.

A bartender or server's paycheck after two weeks is barely enough to cover taxes. My checks when I was bartending, for 75-80 hours (biweekly check) were usually between $40-$50 depending on the amount of taxes taken out. So after taxes, that's a pay of $0.50 an hour.

Here in the US, tips ARE the server's and bartender's salary. The cash they take home from tips is essentially the only pay they get. It's a stupid system, but it's the system we have... welcome to capitalism. The only people with enough power to change this don't work in restaurants, so it will never change.

 

[NutsNGum]

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

This times a million.

----------

but the people working in these jobs don't exactly have the power to change it.

That's the American Dream, right there.

 

[yg17]

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

I'm not employing them, so why am I paying a per drink wage? Or rather, why am I required to? I tip when service is good. If I get a lot of drinks then I'll tip too, usually 10-15%. But if you open 1-2 beers for me then are you really expecting much compensation?

Doesn't seem like their low wage should be my problem. I'll tip if I enjoyed the service (which, tbh, at most places is less than stellar). If tipping is so required and expected now than just change the ********* model and charge more upfront for drinks and food.

You can tip a dollar on the bottle of beer (which is what I would do) for a total of $7, or we can get rid of tip all together, pay servers at or above minimum wage, see drink prices increase as a result, and pay $7 for the bottle of beer.

End result is the same. I don't know why people get so worked up over it.

 

[zioxide]

You can tip a dollar on the bottle of beer (which is what I would do) for a total of $7, or we can get rid of tip all together, pay servers at or above minimum wage, see drink prices increase as a result, and pay $7 for the bottle of beer.

End result is the same. I don't know why people get so worked up over it.

Exactly. Sometimes people just want something to complain about.

 

[snberk103]

You don't want to get shot? That's a horribly narrow-minded way of looking at America. I'm sure I could come to your country and risk being shot as well. It's disgusting that you would even think that way.

Sorry Jessica, I normally agree with you... but even leaving aside the recent tragedy which is a rare, the stats are that being in the US means you are much more likely to be shot than any where else in the industrialized world. It is still very remote possibility... but when people consider the benefits of visiting, they also weight the risks. And that risk is much higher in the US. The poster you are replying to comes from the UK with 0.25 firearm deaths per 100,000 people. The US rate is over 10 deaths per 100,000 people.... or over 40 times more risky than in the UK.

...Regardless of base pay I have a sliding scale for tipping. 10% if you absolutely ****ed up. ....

And that is also where we disagree. A tip is for the service. If you totally F'ed up... you did not provide service... you get no tip from me. I tip well if my evening has been a good one. I tip minimally otherwise. I don't tend to hit the middle ground.

---

A servers can fix the system. They can simply refuse to work for establishments that don't pay a fair wage. Supply and demand. If the establishment can't get good staff at poverty wages, then they will offer better wages to attract good staff. That is how capitalism is supposed to work.

 

[GoCubsGo]

Sorry Jessica, I normally agree with you... but even leaving aside the recent tragedy which is a rare, the stats are that being in the US means you are much more likely to be shot than any where else in the industrialized world. It is still very remote possibility... but when people consider the benefits of visiting, they also weight the risks. And that risk is much higher in the US. The poster you are replying to comes from the UK with 0.25 firearm deaths per 100,000 people. The US rate is over 10 deaths per 100,000 people.... or over 40 times more risky than in the UK.

And that is also where we disagree. A tip is for the service. If you totally F'ed up... you did not provide service... you get no tip from me. I tip well if my evening has been a good one. I tip minimally otherwise. I don't tend to hit the middle ground.

---

A servers can fix the system. They can simply refuse to work for establishments that don't pay a fair wage. Supply and demand. If the establishment can't get good staff at poverty wages, then they will offer better wages to attract good staff. That is how capitalism is supposed to work.

That is perfectly acceptable and the numbers are there; however, show me the numbers that correlate to this idea that a tourist is going to be shot and tourists are at great risk. It was an incredibly narrow-minded comment and the assumption that a tourist is in grave danger regardless is absurd.

I'm ok with agreeing to disagree and that poster can skip visiting the US if he wants; there will be no love lost there. I know the numbers when it comes to deaths associated with guns, I just don't share the same opinion about the dangers tourists may face.

 

[dukebound85]

You can tip a dollar on the bottle of beer (which is what I would do) for a total of $7, or we can get rid of tip all together, pay servers at or above minimum wage, see drink prices increase as a result, and pay $7 for the bottle of beer.

End result is the same. I don't know why people get so worked up over it.

As an aside, 6 bucks for a bottle is high to begin with when you can get a 6pack of that very brand for 6-7 bucks

At bars, I can understand tipping for drinks that take time to make, but for literally grabbing a bottle and handing it to me seems a bit out of hand for tipping (yet I do it anyways..)

 

[mobilehaathi]

So let me get this straight, I'm already paying $6 for a bottle of beer, which is over priced but I'm at a bar so it's acceptable, but now I have to add money on top to pay the person who opened said bottle because their employer doesn't pay them enough to open this bottle?

Yes.

I'm not employing them, so why am I paying a per drink wage? Or rather, why am I required to?

Welcome to the US? It is completely messed up, but that is how it works here.

I tip when service is good. If I get a lot of drinks then I'll tip too, usually 10-15%. But if you open 1-2 beers for me then are you really expecting much compensation?

Are you implying people in the service industry don't deserve a living wage? I don't think that's too much to ask.

Doesn't seem like their low wage should be my problem.

Well, in the US it is your problem when you go to a restaurant or bar.

I'll tip if I enjoyed the service (which, tbh, at most places is less than stellar).

Do you expect your feet to be washed before or after your drink is brought to you?

If tipping is so required and expected now than just change the ********* model and charge more upfront for drinks and food.

Oh, why didn't anyone think of this before: just change the system! This comment is both naive and clever (depending on who says it). It is naive to think the servers actually have the power to change that system. The comment is clever in that it suggests the servers can easily make a change if they wanted to and therefore deflects the blame and anger onto the prime victims.

Your anger is understandable, but you seem to have misdirected it.

 

[zioxide]

A servers can fix the system. They can simply refuse to work for establishments that don't pay a fair wage. Supply and demand. If the establishment can't get good staff at poverty wages, then they will offer better wages to attract good staff. That is how capitalism is supposed to work.

And then what? Live in a cardboard box on the streets?

 

[phuocsandiego]

Would love to stay out of the US... However too many of your home grown companies need my services.

Then you should really thank your lucky stars & stripes and not be so damn condescending to Americans or America. Ignorant foreigners bug the **** out of me as much as ignorant Americans.

 

[mrsir2009]

A servers can fix the system. They can simply refuse to work for establishments that don't pay a fair wage. Supply and demand. If the establishment can't get good staff at poverty wages, then they will offer better wages to attract good staff. That is how capitalism is supposed to work.

In theory that would work. But in reality it is very doubtful that someone wouldn’t come along and take the jobs anyway. For it to work, everyone has to do it, and it is doubtful that even a significant number will. Why? Because they need a job to survive, and if they won’t work for that money, someone else will.

 

[KnightWRX]

You can tip a dollar on the bottle of beer (which is what I would do) for a total of $7, or we can get rid of tip all together, pay servers at or above minimum wage, see drink prices increase as a result, and pay $7 for the bottle of beer.

End result is the same. I don't know why people get so worked up over it.

Not to mention the other problems that will arise :

- Tips will still be around, so some people will pay 8$ for the bottle.
- Waiters jobs will be that much more in demand because minimum wage + tips will be much better than plain jane minimum wage.
- Jobs without tips will be left vacant, resulting in lowered service from businesses that depend on them.

So frankly, I think we've achieved a balance here with the lower minimum wage for tipped jobs and higher for non-tipped jobs.

 

[ECUpirate44]

So what % is everyone accustomed to tipping their bartender?

 

[mobilehaathi]

So what % is everyone accustomed to tipping their bartender?

If I'm paying with a CC, I give 15-20%. If I'm paying with cash on an individual drink basis, $1-$2/drink. At places I frequent, sometimes upwards of 30%, but I'm usually getting lots of free stuff. I always tip on the total + tax, so I usually end up tipping beyond what I think I am anyway.

 

[theautopilot]

A servers can fix the system. They can simply refuse to work for establishments that don't pay a fair wage. Supply and demand. If the establishment can't get good staff at poverty wages, then they will offer better wages to attract good staff. That is how capitalism is supposed to work.

Actually it's capitalism that's caused this, not what's going to fix it.

In fact minimum wage is essentially a socialist idea.

 

[mobilehaathi]

Actually it's capitalism that's caused this, not what's going to fix it.

In fact minimum wage is essentially a socialist idea.

I don't disagree with you, but we're about to plunge into PRSI territory again.

 

[designs216]

How can the servers be paid less than the minimum wage? What's the point in a minimum wage if its not the minimum?

This is a thought provoking thread! Good points on both sides of the issue.

Back in the post college days when I was a waiter on the weekends at a bar & grill-type restaurant, the manager justified the sub-minimum wage like this: the difference in our hourly rate and the true minimum wage was the price servers paid the house for entrepreneurship and the chance to make good money in a short time with relatively little training. We were paying for the privilege of subletting the space/customers in their restaurant. The gig is similar to other 100% commission jobs in this way. The government pretty much assumes that the part of one's wage not mandated by law will be made up by tips.

In the restaurant where I worked, bartenders were at the top of the pecking order. The best and most experienced servers ended up here and this is where one could make the most money.

As a result of my time in the service industry, I know exactly what they go through and thus I'm usually an excellent tipper.