Analytics Suggest 96% of Users Leave App Tracking Disabled in iOS 14.5

[jace88]

Whislt I've defaulted to pretty much saying no to tracking, for a couple of free apps/services with optional ad-free subscription IAPs which I really appreciate their service (not huge corporations either) I'm willing to say yes. Don't know if it really helps them at all but given I haven't paid anything for what they offer (ie I didn't buy any IAPs), but I'd rather they don't go out of business.

 

[chenks]

But surely you must agree people have a right to a choice?

that's a tricky one.

yes people have the choice to simply not use any app at all if they don't agree with the policies of how it runs and funds itself.

however, it's a different matter to say that i don't agree with the policy of the app, but still want to use it, but only under my own terms.

the choice should simply be this - use the app under the terms the app developer dictates or don't use the app at all.
who is it for apple (or any other to decide company) to decide how another company funds itself.

think of it this way, is Apple being the Hooli or the Pied Piper? i think they are being the Hooli.

 

[1258186]

The iPhone was successful on ONE carrier even without apps from the very start. And, as has been mentioned by others, iPhone users are MORE apt to spend money than Android users. So, you may get a few stalwarts that don’t want to support developers, BUT a large number of folks, already familiar with Patreon and other “pay the creator” schemes, will be fine tossing a few bucks a month/year to a developer that provides them with something that they enjoy using.

I mean, since there’s folks that will pay to have their name show on the screen during a live stream, a developer could just stream their coding sessions even LOL!

Most people will probably pay for a few apps and ditch the rest. That will leave a lot of apps will little or no revenue stream. They will have no choice but to close down or focus their efforts elsewhere.

In all the hullabaloo about ad tracking nobody has given a second thought to developers who have suddenly overnight lost most of their income. The likes of Facebook will survive but many small indie developers will not survive.

 

[Seanm87]

that's a tricky one.

yes people have the choice to simply not use any app at all if they don't agree with the policies of how it runs and funds itself.

however, it's a different matter to say that i don't agree with the policy of the app, but still want to use it, but only under my own terms.

the choice should simply be this - use the app under the terms the app developer dictates or don't use the app at all.
who is it for apple (or any other to decide company) to decide how another company funds itself.

think of it this way, is Apple being the Hooli or the Pied Piper? i think they are being the Hooli.

But most apps aren’t even telling people the data they’re collecting. So they’re taking advantage of peoples ignorance.

That to me is wrong. If they were more transparent then it would be fine. Instead they do it sneakily knowing full well most people wouldn’t like it. That’s why Facebook has thrown a hissy fit. Because Apple has shone a light on their business practice for the average joe.

 

[1258186]

Facebook doesn’t get it. We’re not loyal to them.

I wish Apple would make a social network like Facebook was when it first started. No companies, just people.

They did. It was called Ping and it was a monumental flop.

 

[1258186]

Facebook doesn’t get it. We’re not loyal to them.

I realise a lot of Apple users don’t like Facebook (including me) but if you look at the stats they do have a very large, active and loyal user base. Apple has about 1 billion users we are told whereas Facebook has 2.6 billion monthly users and 1.7 billion daily users. Approx 5% of those are fake users or bots but that still leaves a lot of genuine active users. I don’t use Facebook myself but clearly a lot of people do.

 

[jonnysods]

Honestly after updating to 14.5 and then getting some prompts, I was very satisfying to tell the apps that asked to take a hike!

 

[Abazigal]

I realise a lot of Apple users don’t like Facebook (including me) but if you look at the stats they do have a very large, active and loyal user base. Apple has about 1 billion users we are told whereas Facebook has 2.6 billion monthly users and 1.7 billion daily users. Approx 5% of those are fake users or bots but that still leaves a lot of genuine active users. I don’t use Facebook myself but clearly a lot of people do.

One is a free service with low barriers to entry (you just need to create an account), the other is an expensive piece of hardware that people made a conscious choice to buy into in the face of numerous cheaper alternatives.

I think what it ultimately comes down to is a clash of business models. Apple sees improved privacy as a key differentiator which can help it sell more hardware, which is at odds with Facebook's bread and butter business. Imagine having built your business around certain assumptions, which Apple has now thrown into utter disarray at the flick of a switch.

At the end of the day, this speaks to the power of owning and controlling your own ecosystem, and why Apple will not relinquish their iron grip without a fight.

 

[I7guy]

I have lots of free apps on my iPhone. Of those I would only be willing to pay a subscription for a handful of apps. Make no mistake, lots of iOS apps will disappear because the developers have insufficient revenues to keep going. The iPhone has been so successful largely because of the number of free apps available. Without those free apps on iOS, Android suddenly becomes a much more attractive place for developers and users who want free apps. This policy sounds great but it could backfire spectacularly if developers start abandoning iOS.

If devs start abandoning iOS where will they go? Windows? Android, where it’s a race to the bottom?

 

[usagora]

"Allow Apps to Request To Track"

Toggle off = You do not allow apps to "request" to track you, which some users interpret as meaning apps cannot track you at all and some users interpret as meaning apps can track you but cannot request to track you.

The users in bold have it right:

If an app asks to track your activity - Apple Support

App Tracking Transparency allows you to choose whether an app can track your activity across other companies’ apps and websites for the purposes of advertising or sharing with data brokers.

support.apple.com

If you turn off "Allow Apps to Request to Track" in privacy settings, you'll stop seeing prompts from apps that want to track your activity. Each app that asks for permission to track while this setting is turned off will be treated as if you tapped Ask App Not to Track.

 

[return2sendai]

The users in bold have it right:

If an app asks to track your activity - Apple Support

App Tracking Transparency allows you to choose whether an app can track your activity across other companies’ apps and websites for the purposes of advertising or sharing with data brokers.

support.apple.com

Starting to get this now.

Toggled on, I’ve opened each app, some of which I hadn’t opened since before the update, and a few have asked for permission to track, which I’ve enjoyed declining.

Additionally, some apps don’t work anymore and I get a ”This app needs to be updated” pop up. But when I search for the app in the App Store….it‘s no longer listed….

 

[Carlanga]

The default is for tracking to be disabled when iOS 14.5 is installed. So in reality this is "4% of users have opted in to having apps ask whether to track or not". 96% of users have just done nothing.

How many of those 4% did it because they understood what it was and not because of user error?
-----
In the end if you want people to be tracked then the people expect free stuff that is worth it.

 

[cmaier]

that's a tricky one.

yes people have the choice to simply not use any app at all if they don't agree with the policies of how it runs and funds itself.

however, it's a different matter to say that i don't agree with the policy of the app, but still want to use it, but only under my own terms.

the choice should simply be this - use the app under the terms the app developer dictates or don't use the app at all.
who is it for apple (or any other to decide company) to decide how another company funds itself.

think of it this way, is Apple being the Hooli or the Pied Piper? i think they are being the Hooli.

Fair, as long as the policy is clear to the user before the user uses the app. But, then, apple also has the right to ban apps that have policies which contradict its own rules for the App Store.

 

[chenks]

Fair, as long as the policy is clear to the user before the user uses the app.

how many of us read the Ts&Cs before creating an account or using an app?
i'm sure it's all there in the very small print.

 

[cmaier]

how many of us read the Ts&Cs before creating an account or using an app?
i'm sure it's all there in the very small print.

When was the last time you installed an app that made you actually read and accept T&C before you could run it?

In the end, Apple’s solution makes a lot of sense. Make the user affirmatively agree to be stalked.

 

[threesixty360]

Can companies not create another identifier rather than just use the inbuilt apple one?

Big companies like Facebook could easily use there apps (Fb, IG and WhatsApp) to create some kind of identifier for any device. I’m sure google could do similar.

is this really a magic bullet to stop tracking?

 

[chenks]

When was the last time you installed an app that made you actually read and accept T&C before you could run it?

In the end, Apple’s solution makes a lot of sense. Make the user affirmatively agree to be stalked.

they all make to click "accept".

 

[chenks]

Can companies not create another identifier rather than just use the inbuilt apple one?

of course they can.
does anyone really think that this is going to permanently stop the practice?
all it will do is stop the current method.

 

[threesixty360]

of course they can.
does anyone really think that this is going to permanently stop the practice?
all it will do is stop the current method.

I thought so. If anything this will end up boosting FB even more. As they probably have the apps that are used most by any iPhone user. So if a smaller ad company needs to track it maybe easier to ask FB to identify users for them.

 

[cmaier]

they all make to click "accept".

no they don’t. And the ones that do don’t actually show you “you will be tracked even when not using the app” clearly.

In any event, it’s moot. There’s absolutely nothing wrong, regardless of an app’s own T&C’s, with apple forcing apps to also ask express permission. Just like facebook has the right not to allow me to use its service if I don’t agree with its T&C’s, so, too, does Apple have the right not to let developers use its services if they don’t agree to Apple’s T&C’s.

 

[chenks]

no they don’t. And the ones that do don’t actually show you “you will be tracked even when not using the app” clearly.

In any event, it’s moot. There’s absolutely nothing wrong, regardless of an app’s own T&C’s, with apple forcing apps to also ask express permission. Just like facebook has the right not to allow me to use its service if I don’t agree with its T&C’s, so, too, does Apple have the right not to let developers use its services if they don’t agree to Apple’s T&C’s.

i wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with anything you said or will say. however which apps don't make you accept their Ts&Cs before creating an account? every place i've had to create an account has made me tick a box to say i agree to the terms.

however, apple need to tread very carefully when it comes to "the right not to let developers use its services", as we can see unfold at the moment in various legal cases against them (and against google).

the cynic in me doesn't believe apple are doing this for the good of their customers, but rather doing it for the good of themselves. i'm pretty sure apple is doing lots of tracking of their iOS users and they'd rather keep it all to themselves than have other people get access to it, it's just they the public spin on it makes out that facebook (and others) are the enemy and apple are the saviours.

 

[joelt999]

The 4% are predominantly employees of Google, FB and Amazon

 

[09872738]

Opting in to every app that asks, don't want to go back to the early internet where every ad was a viagra ad.

Problem is: Facebook does not only draw conclusions from harvested data for the pure purpose of targetted advertising. They are e.g. able to predict whom you are going to vote for better than your relatives. Remember Cambridge Analytica? They collect any any data they can get ahold of and draw conclusions about you, who you are and even your beliefs way beyond ads.

 

[Dr_Dre]

1) It doesn't prevent ads, it prevents tracking outside of the app ostensibly to serve "better" ads but with a lot of other data gathering going on as well.

2) Ads aren't a necessary result of the internet. It's what companies have found to be the best way to support their internet efforts. But it's not the only way. For years there was advertising supported TV. But we also had public television (supported by donations and taxes) and pay television (supported by subscription fees), which still exists. It is quite possible for a site to charge for use/viewing instead of a free price in exchange for ads. Further, one of the strongest reasons why companies adopt the free/ads model is because of the incentives to grow a network, which is a lot easier to do at first when it is "free".

No it does not prevent ads but it gives you irrelevant ads that you would never click on, this causes the site or company to shut down or start charging you for content.

Do you honestly think MacRumors would exist if they did get paid for their clicks 🧐

 

[cmaier]

No it does not prevent ads but it gives you irrelevant ads that you would never click on, this causes the site or company to shut down or start charging you for content.

Do you honestly think MacRumors would exist if they did get paid for their clicks 🧐

Macrumors can show relevant ads by simply showing ads related to macs, apple, iphones, technology, etc. Macrumors does not need to pay facebook to tell it that, based on everything i browse anywhere on the web, I’m a professional hand model who is married, enjoys reading about Yugoslavia, has a penchant for underwater sports, voted libertarian in the last election, believes in aliens, and whose wife is about to give birth to triplets.