Anyone interested in security etc?

Discussion in 'Apple, Inc and Tech Industry' started by Tonsko, Sep 22, 2010.

  1. Tonsko macrumors 6502

    Tonsko

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    #1
    http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent...et_built_to_attack_irans_nuclear_program.html

    http://www.langner.com/en/index.htm

    Pretty chilling!
     
  2. (marc) macrumors 6502a

    (marc)

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    the woods
    #2
    Read the articles. That code is amazing. Breaching digital certificates is well beyond the abilities of skilled programmers / mathematicians.

    This begs the question why Windows is used in a nuclear reactor. They should use a custom OS or something like OpenBSD, but not Windows...
     
  3. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2006
    #3

    Do you have any idea how much custom software cost to create and maintain.
    If they had gone with a custom OS it makes the cost even higher since now your pool of programmers you have access to is a hell of a lot smaller than it already is. Cost goes up even more on top of the cost of having the custom OS maintained.

    It is all about cost to benefit ratio. The cost of building a custom OS is very high. Benefits gains could easily be less than 0 if you add in all the other programs but security issues that can go with it.


    Custom software is very expensive.
     
  4. Tonsko thread starter macrumors 6502

    Tonsko

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    Aug 19, 2010
    #4
    I think the code only weighed in at around 512kb as well. Serious piece of software.
     
  5. (marc) macrumors 6502a

    (marc)

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    #5
    I thought about an embedded systems approach, you're right that creating a new OS would take too much work. Still, Siemens shouldn't have put Windows in those machines in first place, Windows' insecurity isn't a secret. They should've picked something like OpenBSD from the beginning.
     
  6. Tonsko thread starter macrumors 6502

    Tonsko

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    Aug 19, 2010
    #6
    I think in this case it wouldn't have mattered so much. All systems are vulnerable one way or another, and this was a targeted attack with 4 previously un-seen 0-days. There perhaps would have been 4 OpenBSD (or whatever) 0-days instead.

    The argument for not using Windows in a critical environment though is a strong one, more for reliability (or lack thereof) than anything else.
     
  7. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    Oct 9, 2006
    #7
    real measure of security is counting Zero day exploits and how long until it is patch. In that sense OSX is one of the worse. Microsoft is pretty good at dealing with zero day exploits.

    Also again I am going to point back to my time and money. OpenBSD more than likely would cost more to put in place and find the people to write the custom code for.

    A lot of the software needed to run a plant like that is custom coding. It is a lot easier to find good coders for windows than it is to find people for OpenBSD.
    Embed just would like the horse power they would need.

    The only true secure system is a closed system meaning it is not connected to the out side world in any way. For example the NASA launching system. You can not hack your way into that system nor can you grab the hand off between Florida and Houston or even mission control. Reason being is that entire network is self contained. none of the lines connect to the internet. You would physically have to hard wire yourself in and if you physically tap the line you would quickly be detected.
     
  8. (marc) macrumors 6502a

    (marc)

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    #8
    Well, I think that the extra time and money would be well spent on majorly increasing the security of a nuclear facility.

    By the way, the (targeted) facilities in Iran were not connected to the internet, they were infected with a USB stick.
     
  9. Tonsko thread starter macrumors 6502

    Tonsko

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    #9

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