Apple Addresses Panther Firewire Issues

[Genie]

When my FW 400 drive went bad (Diskwarrior couldn't even fix it), I copied everything over to an ide drive, and bit-for-bit compared it using Toast's compare feature. The data matched. Of course that doesn't mean that some of it wasn't trashed. But it does mean that you can read from the drive after the damage happens long enough to move your stuff over.

This is making SATA extrnal drives look REAL good.

 

[kangaroo]

On LaCie's support site (http://www.lacie.com/support/drivers/) the following is listed:

Silverlining Updater v6.4.8a

Critical firmware update for d2 and Big Disk FireWire 800 disk drives. Resolve issues with Mac OS X 10.3 (Panther) systems.
Also, updated firmware for d2 FireWire 400 drives. New firmware improves performance

The link to the download is labeled: <MacOS9>.

Being new to the Mac environment...does this mean that in order to properly download/run this updater I must have first booted in 9?

My system: PBG4 15" 1.25 running 10.3 w/LaCie D2 FW800 250

Thanks.

Also...

1) Can we assume that this 'LaCie' updater resolves the problem sited in this topic?

2) Assuming it is true...there's no doubt that data loss is an "issue" as in "Resolve issues with Mac OS X..."but doesn't stating it in such a benign, bland (techno-indifferent) way attempt to undercut the seriousness of the problem?

 

[Makosuke]

Originally posted by kangaroo
The link to the download is labeled: <MacOS9>.

Being new to the Mac environment...does this mean that in order to properly download/run this updater I must have first booted in 9?

Yes, that's exactly what it means, which also means you can't use it, since your machine (nor most to come out of Apple for a while now) won't boot in 9. It's a pretty stupid thing on LaCie's part, but one assumes they'll get an X updater out posthaste.

And NO, I would not automatically assume this fixes the problem--it seems to be more than that simple of a conflict, and in any case since it's a severe issue it'd be a lot safer to wait a few days and see what additional information comes out.

 

[Genie]

I've taken all my drives out of their firewire enclosures and hooked them up to ATA buses.

 

[AhmedFaisal]

This is not an issue of Panther, its the Oxford Chipset that sucks

I experience Data loss on the PC with Linux and WinBlows as well as in OS9/X any given version with the Oxford Chipset FW400 HD enclosure I have. It is clearly visible when I transfer freshly encoded DivX Home Videos onto the drive and back, before DivFix and DivX Tool reported no errors, afterwards they report corrupted data errors. As I said this happens on both WinBlows and Mac. I do not experience this with other FireWire enclosures. The drive is fine since I hooked it to an IDE in my PC and did a surface check which reports no bad sectors. Remember the Graphics Card issue a few days ago which reported that due to a long standing manufacturing error those were unusable in OSX.3? Well I think the same goes for the Oxfords, they were present before but in OSX.3 they really bombed because some stuff about the OS was changed that made the HW Bug surface more.
Cheers,

Ahmed

 

[kangaroo]

Originally posted by Makosuke
Yes, that's exactly what it means, which also means you can't use it, since your machine (nor most to come out of Apple for a while now) won't boot in 9. It's a pretty stupid thing on LaCie's part, but one assumes they'll get an X updater out posthaste.

And NO, I would not automatically assume this fixes the problem--it seems to be more than that simple of a conflict, and in any case since it's a severe issue it'd be a lot safer to wait a few days and see what additional information comes out.

Thanks for the info.

Since I'm in the return period on the LaCie...should I return it and bypass this problem? If so, any recommendations on an alternative drive?

 

[Lancetx]

Originally posted by MacBandit
This is a good thing yes, but it's not Apple acknowledging their problem.

Agreed. But kudos to Apple for quickly getting to the bottom of it and working with the drive manufacturers to get fixes out there and available so fast. As well as LaCie, now both WiebeTech and OWC also have firmware updates posted and available to correct the issue.

 

[mac3dX]

Now, how about the FW400 issue?

2 of my FW400 enclosures no longer work after I upgraded to 10.2.6 on my G4 733. The drives (which are IBM and Maxtor) work fine when installed in the internal drive bays. A friend of mine had the exact same thing happen.

So, after I got my dual G5, I tried again. No luck. Apple's upgrade fried 2 firewire enclosures. Then I bought a new enclosure, put one of the old drives in there, and it's been working flawlessly.

I wish Apple would address this FW 400 problem also.

 

[dombi]

Originally posted by chewbaccapits
How would you know if your drive has this OXFORD bridge?

In the Terminal try to type this:

system_profiler

if you would like to save the file to your desktop type:

system_profiler > ~/Desktop/output.txt

Then find the info in there for your drive.


Good luck,

dombi

 

[Craigy]

Non Oxford Firewire Enclosure

Can anyone suggest a non oxford 3.5" enclosure for my 160gig maxtor drive. Runing a Dual G4 1.25 at the moment and are in the process of replacing this with a G5 and Panther.

 

[railthinner]

bad headlines

For readers of news.com this is presented really awfully, along with some other bad Apple news. Example "Panther glitch erases some hard drives" If this is indeed an issue with the oxford chipset a retraction is in order.

 

[Totalshock]

Re: bad headlines

Originally posted by railthinner
For readers of news.com this is presented really awfully, along with some other bad Apple news. Example "Panther glitch erases some hard drives" If this is indeed an issue with the oxford chipset a retraction is in order.

Why would a retraction be in order? If the Oxford chipset had come into the market after Panther and claimed compatibility with Panther, then I could see it was the vendors' faults, and would be screaming for LaCie (et al) to face the music about now.

But the problem here is that new software which was represented by Apple (either explicitly or implicitly) as ready for prime-time and compatible with the things Mac users are using and doing, clearly is not. I don't see how this can be successfully spun as anybody's fault but Apple's. Don't tell me that somewhere in the interoperability labs in Cupertino, someone didn't plug in a d2 drive to Panther and go "Ooopsie... that's going to be a problem."

 

[Awimoway]

Originally posted by dombi
In the Terminal try to type this:

system_profiler

if you would like to save the file to your desktop type:

system_profiler > ~/Desktop/output.txt

Then find the info in there for your drive.


Good luck,

dombi

All right, here's what System Profiler says about my firewire 400 LaCie drive:

Speed: 400 Mb/sec Speed

LaCie 1394 Disk drive LUN 0:

Capacity: 74.53 GB
Manufacturer: LaCie Group SA
Model: LaCie 1394 Disk drive LUN 0
Removable Media: No
Detachable Drive: Yes
BSD Name: disk2
OS9 Drivers: Yes
Speed: 400 Mb/sec Speed
Unit Spec Id: 24734
Firmware Revision: 3.19
Unit Software Version: 10483

Extra HD:

Capacity: 74.53 GB
Available: 24.46 GB
Writable: Yes
File System: HFS+
BSD Name: disk2s9
Mount Point: /Volumes/Extra HD

I don't see anything about "Oxford 922" and my firmware number is nowhere near 1.02. Does this mean I'm safe? So far I haven't had a single problem with my drive in Panther. Thanks.

 

[MacBandit]

Re: Re: bad headlines

Originally posted by Totalshock
Why would a retraction be in order? If the Oxford chipset had come into the market after Panther and claimed compatibility with Panther, then I could see it was the vendors' faults, and would be screaming for LaCie (et al) to face the music about now.

But the problem here is that new software which was represented by Apple (either explicitly or implicitly) as ready for prime-time and compatible with the things Mac users are using and doing, clearly is not. I don't see how this can be successfully spun as anybody's fault but Apple's. Don't tell me that somewhere in the interoperability labs in Cupertino, someone didn't plug in a d2 drive to Panther and go "Ooopsie... that's going to be a problem."

No the problem is with the chipset manufacturer. Apple made the standard for the chipset and it's obvious that they have not followed the standard to the 'T' in some way or another. Besides if you read this thread completely you will see that this problem is surfacing in 10.2, 10.3, and XP. So the problem is not the 10.3 update.

 

[fatfish]

Getting worried

I too don't know whether I have this oxford chipset, been to system profiler and see no mention of oxford.

Got two FW400 drives with firmware revision numbers 16.0 and GAK8 and a FW800 drive with no firmware revision numberat all.

I have already restarted (a few times) under panther and everything seems OK.

Can I assume if my disks were going to be trashed it would have happened already.

Ive got about 460 Gb of irreplaceable movies on my FW800, so I'm a bit nervous about this.

BTW don't know if it's relevent but non of the drives have OS9 drivers installed.

 

[MacBandit]

Re: Getting worried

Originally posted by fatfish
I too don't know whether I have this oxford chipset, been to system profiler and see no mention of oxford.

Got two FW400 drives with firmware revision numbers 16.0 and GAK8 and a FW800 drive with no firmware revision numberat all.

I have already restarted (a few times) under panther and everything seems OK.

Can I assume if my disks were going to be trashed it would have happened already.

Ive got about 460 Gb of irreplaceable movies on my FW800, so I'm a bit nervous about this.

BTW don't know if it's relevent but non of the drives have OS9 drivers installed.

The way to find out if you have the Oxford chipset is to go to the Firewire drive manufacturers website and look for documentation on your specific drive. If it doesn't mention the chipset there then you need to email or call them and ask them.

 

[railthinner]

Re: Re: bad headlines

Originally posted by Totalshock
Why would a retraction be in order?"

I'm not sure how much more plain I can make this -- "IF." !!

If there is no glitch in Panther and it's the oxford chipset: news.com absolutely needs to correct their error.

If there is a glitch in Panther: news.com stands correct in their headline.

In my opinion (yes just an opinon here) The headline is irresponsible in either case, because it has not yet been determined exactly what the cause of the problem is. At least not at the time that was published.

 

[Genie]

Re: Non Oxford Firewire Enclosure

Originally posted by Craigy
Can anyone suggest a non oxford 3.5" enclosure for my 160gig maxtor drive. Runing a Dual G4 1.25 at the moment and are in the process of replacing this with a G5 and Panther.

iocombo is selling a sata enclosure for about $60. It has a pata to sata bridge card. I've been thinking about getting it.

 

[Fitzcaraldo]

I had an issue with a disappearing (fw400) drive in 10.2. after a forced re start. When trying to mount this laCie D2 80GB I got the "Corrupt volume message... Not having OSX disk tools I mounted the volume in OS9 with silverlining (laCie Driver) and ran a repair from there (directory was stated as the error) with OS9 disk utility. The disk was fine an NO data was lost.

What I have an Issue with is the whole spectrum of NO advice from Apple re disc integrity and Tools... This has been an issue from day one of OSX an I don't feel I am wrong in saying that user data is by far the most valuable asset in a system and apple should assure its customers?

This is not an area where I care about competative products...

 

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by Fitzcaraldo
...........What I have an Issue with is the whole spectrum of NO advice from Apple re disc integrity and Tools... This has been an issue from day one of OSX an I don't feel I am wrong in saying that user data is by far the most valuable asset in a system and apple should assure its customers?

This is not an area where I care about competative products...

Could you reword or expand on that paragraph. I'm not totally sure what you are saying you want.

 

[kangaroo]

LaCie responds

i contacted lacie and they said they hope to have a panther update available this week.

 

[nlz]

CD burners, too?

Well that's just great. I just tried burning my first CD on my external Formac FW400 drive... and got my first "sense key" hardware failure ever. The drive just reset itself in the process.

I've had the drive for quite a while (it's still 16x), so I don't think it has the mentioned chipset.

From my experience, Panther broke several of features I use, and the finder crashes on me regularly when dragging multiple files with preview thumbnails activated. Not the best update i've seen from Apple.

 

[MacBandit]

Re: CD burners, too?

Originally posted by nlz
Well that's just great. I just tried burning my first CD on my external Formac FW400 drive... and got my first "sense key" hardware failure ever. The drive just reset itself in the process.

I've had the drive for quite a while (it's still 16x), so I don't think it has the mentioned chipset.

From my experience, Panther broke several of features I use, and the finder crashes on me regularly when dragging multiple files with preview thumbnails activated. Not the best update i've seen from Apple.

Did you do a clean install or an update install?

I have had reason since installing to drag hundreds of files at once with the preview option and my only observation is that it's much faster than 10.2.

So far no problems for me whatsoever with 10.3. A few system haxies are broken but I hardly consider that Apples fault.

Also if your read this thread clear through you will see that the firewire issue is not with Apple or 10.3 but with that chipset. That chipset is having problems with Mac all versions of the Mac OS from 9-10.3 and with Windows XP.

 

[Genie]

I'm having no Panther problems- adn LOVE Expose´!

But I did disconnect all of my Firewire hard drives and move them to ATA bus-es until this whole thing is verified over...

 

[wdlove]

Re: LaCie responds

Originally posted by kangaroo
i contacted lacie and they said they hope to have a panther update available this week.

I'm suprised that Lacie had this problem. Lacie is the product that is sold at my local Apple Store. It was highly recommended by the staff. All the problems with Panther and the G5 are very discouraging.

Genie, I'm not sure what you mean by move them to ATA buses?