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Apple Calls Out EU for Contradictory App Store Rules Under DSA and DMA
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If your bank permitted its iOS app to be listed on their own website, the Apple AppStore and other AltStore that is the option available by the bank. An “official” tag can be added to denote that it’s not some shady developer and I would go insofar to add that denotation to the Apple AppStore as well. Apps of questionable nature has sneaked into the walled garden time and again.
I haven’t heard one coherent argument from anyone since this whole 3rd party-app store/side loading thing began on how this will actually benefit consumers. I see plenty of issues and problems, but not a single benefit. Makes me think everybody for it are just paid actors working for Tim Sweeney.
We can finally install the full Gecko Firefox with extension support on iOS if installation outside of the Apple App store is allowed
A hospital can be world-class, but if the hospital pharmacy uses unvetted, sketchy suppliers when it buys the medicine and doesn't run background checks on the employees, it doesn't matter how good the facilities are - patients are put at risk. Same deal here.
Android has comparable (maybe even superior) OS-level security features and it allows sideloading. What's the result? Dramatically higher malware rates. Why? In large part because OS security can't protect against social engineering. Scammers create fake apps, buy ads that direct users to sideload them, and trick millions into installing malware. You think scammers aren't going to fake an "official" button on the fake website they set up to trick people into sideloading?
An “official” badge on both AppStore and other AltStores. Pretending that any official store may it be Google, Microsoft or Apple is completely secure is hubris. I would recommend anyone be careful even when downloading from these big tech official stores as things have sneaked in and it can take days to find, report and remove. The system is not perfect and people do need to be cautious and not give a blank pass just because a big tech has its name behind it. Reflect back on tech companies have system issues effecting many business globally, one cannot have blind faith as it’s becomes ripe for abuse.
Super niche and I’m not sure that really has anything to do with third party app stores but still probably the first argument I could entertain.
Apple is not allowing web browsers not using the built-in WebKit view on the App Store.
Also the useful life of older devices could be extended since Apple often mandates developers to move to the latest SDKs (which drops support of older OS versions) in order for the updates to be approved
Because it's a massive, massive security risk. There's a reason Apple disables JIT on WebKit when the phone is on lockdown mode. And it's not because Apple is being anticompetitive against itself.
Apple allowing or not allowing non-webkit browsers has nothing to do with what App store you can procure a browser from and everything to do with the underlying architecture of iOS and the API access it gives to third party-developers. This is what i'm saying about the low bar for coherent arguments. Even ones that seem logical at face value really have nothing to do with the topic at hand.
It's the App Store policy. There's nothing in the software really prohibiting someone to build a browser with alternative engine.
The work in https://developer.apple.com/support/alternative-browser-engines appears to be Apple complying with the embeddable browser rule and trying to build something to narrowly limit the opening up of alt engine browser to EU only apps on iPhone only.
No it was a comparison in that my mum got an iPhone for security 😂😂😂
If you’re world beating at security as you claim instead of using smoke and mirrors then apple could easily answer the questions the European Union are asking
However I suspect it’s to ask probing questions to reveal the nonsense that apple are hiding behind
as what’s all ready been established is its basic code behind certain products and are just using security as an excuse
Well that’s on them
At the end of the day if an individual gets scammed or malware from an app then maybe it’s the individual for falling for it as nobody I know that uses android has had any such problem
Are you saying that Apple’s customers are not responsible that maybe smartphones are to advanced for them?
Bingo. Same thing been happening long ago before all or mostly all having smartphones with thing everyone has. At least a very high percent. More so than even smartphones most likely. Believe it started happening in 2000s. No way to be sure. Just glad it is impossible to be an issue because i never had one too much cost and no reason to.
The main reason it started happening is because no one set protections against it because they did not think was required.
That’s just not true. Apple doesn’t expose the APIs to third-party-developers that would even allow an alternate browser engine to run. Yes this is now allowed in the EU, but. It from anything to do with side loading or other app stores
There is only one way to be close to having hundred percent security. No it does not mean using any fancy software, services, or even bodyguards (like some people in charge do guess CEO to think of an example, average person no)
No one can expect any other to do it either never works.
No one can expect any other to do it either never works.
Wonderful victim blaming there. Who are you comfortable sacrificing so you can have an open ecosystem but don't have to use Android?
- The 75-year-old grandmother who gets tricked by a fake banking app?
- The 12-year-old who downloads a "free Robux generator"?
- The immigrant with limited English targeted by scams in their native language?
The statistics speak for themselves, Android is significantly less safe than iOS because of sideloading and third party stores. You can argue the rate of malware is low enough, and the "benefits" from opening up are good enough that the harm caused is worth it. But you can't argue that Apple isn't safer because it prohibits sideloading and third-party stores. The fact of the matter is Android malware affects millions of users annually. I quoted statistics above. Just because you and your friends and family haven't been hit (or, perhaps have been hit but don't realize it) doesn't mean it's not a massive problem. You're saying "I don't wear a seatbelt and I'm fine, so car accidents must not be real."
I'm wondering, did you know in advance what you can and can't do with your expensive device? If you did, why the purchase? If you did not why hadn't you returned it?
Ah the generalizations is pure gold, a non-techie 75 year old grandma who has no clue what she is doing but still has a phone who knows for what reasons. I have news for you scammers use a multitude of methods to scam seniors and some are as simple as a phone call, maybe we should monitor private citizens phone calls too to intercept potential scams.
Ah another classic the naive 12 year old, the bigger threat here is underage exploitation and that happens on gasp Apple AppStore vetted apps like Fb, IG and Snapchat, let’s put monitoring software on these adolescence phones rather than just not give them a phone to protect them from physical safety vice cyber safety that is much more lucrative with sextortion issues.
That’s a good one if an immigrant with limited English speaking skills can easily change the language of many websites and stores to what their are comfortable.
This fear mongering is just that people too afraid to take responsibility for their actions.
True story a friend who is a senior got his Facebook account hacked via a phishing email, I guess we need Apple to monitor emails as well. 🙄😒🤔
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So, you are saying that the EU requiring Apple implement security measures to protect consumers is wrong? It should just be an open sewer and blame the consumer for the spread of contamination?
Apple consumers are a mix, like every other customer base. Just because your friends don't know they have spyware on their phone doesn't mean they don't. Even if they are savvy enough to understand the hazards of a wide-open computing platform and fool themselves into thinking they can protect themselves, doesn't mean they can. Apparently, the EU thinks protections are necessary. Apple thinks the protections are necessary. The EU is just logically inconsistent.
Why do you advocate creating attractive nuisances and hazards? I guess if you want to play with lawn darts, you can go to the EU.
This is not a hardware limitation issue it’s an arbitrary software limitation placed by Apple for no other reason other than to funnel developers and customers to obtain their app fix from the Apple AppStore. The fear is real on Apple’s part it seems their feel their are unable to compete in an open market place but throw in boggy-man words like privacy, scams, security etc to scare naive customers.
I guess device hacks like Pegasus and others have been lost in the history of sweep it under the rug and don’t lift it to peek at failures of the past and unknowns of the future the hubris is comical.
Some of these device hacks were deployed via iMessage and WhatsApp and these are vetted by Apple.
Ah confirmation bias at its best. 🙈🙊🙉
There are pros and cons to both at the end of the day the option should be the choice of the customer. If you don’t want to use an AltStore, no one is forcing anyone to do so but to remove choice tells me that Apple feels it’s your parent while profiting from the scare mongering and naive customer base.
The burden of explaining why this is necessary should fall on those advocating for the change that takes away a safe, secure model for the less safe one. Forcing Apple to add third-party stores and sideloading doesn't add choice - it eliminates it and shifts the cost of your preference of "use an open OS, but not Android" onto the very people who deliberately chose the safer default, while completely disregarding millions whose preference is to not have Apple open. Why does your desire outweigh mine? You have an open option you can switch to today. Those who want a closed ecosystem won't have that option when Apple is forced open.
And when there is a major malware issue on iOS, you know who they're going to blame? It isn't going to be the EU. It isn't going to be those selfishly putting their desires over what's best for the majority of Apple's users. They're going to blame Apple. "Apple said iPhones can't get viruses but mine did." And it won't be Apple's fault, but Apple is who will get the reputational damage. The EU will clutch its pearls and say "HOW DARE Apple say it is our regulation's fault, Apple just should have implemented it better" and people on MacRumors will say "It's your fault, you shouldn't have been tricked into installing a sketchy app." But that's whose fault it will be: the EU and those selfishly putting their desires over others'.
No, it's to protect users. Apple competes just fine. Just because you've convinced yourself Apple is spreading FUD doesn't make it true. Look at the statistics. They don't lie. To repeat from upthread:
- Here's a 2023 survey paper citing McAfee data reports 2.34M mobile malware cases, of which only 389 were on iOS.
- App Security Project quoted Nokia Threat Intelligence report that found that Android devices were responsible for 47.15% of observed malware infections (Windows/ PCs for 35.82%, IoT for 16.17% and iPhones for less than 1%), with third-party app stores being a key vector due to lack of security vetting.
- Zimperium found that users who sideload are 80% more likely to have malware on their phones.
- Tom's Guide reported that users of alternate apps stores had up to 19 times higher probability of encountering malware compared to the PlayStore
- Certo Software says sideloaded apps have a 200% higher chance of containing malware
No one needs any of that if is easily possible to see the actual mobile device live while in use. Which happens all the time. No not talking about at restaurants or stores.