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Apple CEO Tim Cook Writes Op-Ed in Support of U.S. Employment Nondiscrimination Act
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I'm not bothered at all. What gave you that impression?
No need to be defensive, I just want to better understand the origins of your opinion on work.Sorry, but that is your belief, not mine, and it shouldn't be forced on anyone just because it's the old way. Times have changed over the last 20 years and the onus is on the owner (hence the naming connection) – as they are the ones who benefit the most.
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And there it is. The fear that anything less than active punishment of individual failure and difference, will lead to national weakness and ruin. That only when anyone can loose everything (for being different in this case), will everyone perform at their best. Only then can the group, can the nation, be the strongest possible.
Nice job with the negative reinforcement.
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I'm not bothered at all. What gave you that impression?
Sorry, not being defensive - just curious as to why my work ethic is worthy of note. Providing that a person does not leech off others, I don't particularly care what work ethic is in play. Some people are content to make enough to see themselves through each week. However, Earlier experiences have taught me that income can stop at any time, for any number of reasons, so I thought it best to earn what I could, while I could - just in case.
But that is in the past - I've long retired to enjoy what's left of my life.
I see him as just another "End of Days" believer.
A secular version of the End of Days perhaps, but it's essentially the same thing.
Repent! Repent!!!
Envy - pure and simple. Owners should benefit, as they are the ones who take the risk.
With all due respect, that's a matter of perception. I could easily make the argument that you are stealing from your workers if you are looking to pay them the least amount as possible (as noted from an earlier post from you in this tread) and not what they are actually worth, not providing the loyalty to them they would to you (if a current good employee came "out" you would like the right to fire them) and all this while expecting them to put work first before family.
It's great that you are a business owner and it's commendable that you offer employment to others in crappy economic times but you don't have the right to demand more than fair pay for fair work relationship. Anything outside of the purview of work is not yours to dictate and you are not king. You answer to others, be they government, banks, partners... whatever. Just like the rest of us, there are rules we need to follow. Sometimes the existing ones become out of date in how they relate to the masses. This is one of these times. Sometimes it impedes some from how things have been done up till now, but that is a small price to pay to correct the larger impediments that is happening and have been happening to a larger, mainly ostracized group that constantly gets overlooked. Like I said – in the end all this does is give you better candidates for employees, it's not like you are forced to watch gay people make out at work or anything. They come in, do their work and go home. This just prevents them from getting fired one day if it comes out who they go home to – so they still have a job as being Gay isn't illegal. You just think it's icky. That is not good enough in this day and age.
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Even so, the next war will get rid of much of those recent gains that you hold so precious. Be it China, Russia, or Islam, none will support libertines.
Actually, I'm part of the 'privileged class' - though not part of the top 1%. Which means I am am paying for the privilege of living in a social democracy. I am happy to be living in a society where I am healthier, happier, and wealthier, and more educated.
Europe is, for the most part, a Social Democracy. Which is not the same as Socialist.
Generally speaking citizens of the Social Democracies live longer, are more educated, are healthier, are happier, and - if you don't count the top 1% - wealthier than other nations. Including the ones that are more 'free market'.
Yeah, not so much. Christian Teaching doesn't use the full quote from Leviticus to justify it's stance. It's an interesting quote when you read the original statement in full.
No theft is involved where agreement is reached - by both parties.
Your opinion on the changing of laws is precisely that. My opinion differs, in that I prefer the old laws. They are just opinions, and I try to live by mine, while you appear to be living according to yours.
Agree to disagree seems to be the logical way out.
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I do not consider it a privilege to live under Democracy, aka Ochlocracy, and I object to paying so much as a farthing for its upkeep.
Social Democracy is Fabian Socialism - same end.
The condition of other people is not my concern - it's theirs.
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Not if I can spend it all, and I am trying.
I wouldn't employ them for the harmony of my workplace. Since the likelihood of a workforce would be of mixed colour/gender, if I ask them if they can work harmoniously with the established work crew and they say no, they they are not qualified. There is no confusing the issue, it's just getting away from you.
The Bible doesn't say don't hire gays. Anywhere. And after that little bit in the New testament about Jesus, it says not to hate anyone. At most, it says "don't be Gay", at worst *it says they should all be killed. Is your not hiring them your middle ground?
The irony of that first line is amazing. Like owning something gives you the right to do what you like with it. I own a car, if cutting through the sidewalk is faster than the traffic in front of me why can't I do that? I own it? It's my right! I own my house, if I want to tear it down and rebuild without the proper licences, following safety codes or labour laws, it's my right too, correct? I own it! It's my right!
You do not have more right that your employees just because you are the employer. As owner, you get the rewards of a strong business (profits, future stability), control of what you do/create and who you take on as clients. Of course you also have control of who you can hire but only as it applies to work, you don't own them nor dictate how their lives should be. If it gets in the way of work (simple knowledge doesn't count), fire them. But if it doesn't? You do not have that right. Even if you want it or have been getting away with it. If you are then you should be stopped and this will do it.
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Here, here!
Do you also refuse to hire people who wear mixed fabrics or eat shellfish? Because the bible doesn't like them too much either.
Then your stand point makes far more sense to me now. It is completely selfish and totally in keeping with your libertarian ideas.
I how ever was brought up to believe that it was my duty, to build on the foundations that my parents had provided, a better future for my children. When I look at my grand children I see the future hope, and I will do my best to nurture it.
Looking always back to the past, is to live a very swallow life.
He's using religious language (means), but it seems to be in service to something larger which is not (end).
The problem seems to be that we spent 50 years fighting a [cold] war of ideology (our ideas and philosophies are stronger and more worthy than their ideas and philosophies). That war is now over, but the ideologies remain, as do the fears that not following them will still lead to loosing. It's a powerful concern and one that isn't going away anytime soon.
Victims of our own rhetoric.
As the owner of now 2 successful businesses, I agree the risk is massive and it doesn't hurt that the reward also be so. But why do the rewards need to include diminishing the liberties of those who help make the rewards possible (and who are also taking risks)?
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I for one am happy that this thread proves the US isn't the only country with right wing extremists. Interesting, I wonder if a right winger from the UK is against universal healthcare. ShaunUk can you answer that? British teabaggers, would ya look at that....
No one is telling you what to think, just like if someone doesn't like/trust blacks/muslims/jews/hispanics/asians/whathaveyou, go right on ahead. Think and feel that way. This issue is when that gets put into action. Your thoughts aren't allowed to manifest into action against other people, just as my disbelief in god shouldn't impede you belief system, you church and the ability to pray in it and congregate will never be diminished. Have all the thoughts you want, but they shouldn't effect other people's lives.
Express it all you want, but you don't have the right to take right from other. Yours don't supersede others. You want to have those beliefs, then the onus is in you to find the glance that lets you believe what you want in the society you live in. That society is speaking now and they are saying gay right are civil rights.
a) Both China and Russia treat their women as well as in the West - if not better. My experience of both Chinese and Russian women is that they are more assertive and confident than women in the UK and US. Now sure that is largely based on their most vibrant cities but still...
b) Islam isn't a cohesive force. I can't really see Iran and the Middle East allying over anything (except possibly the destruction of Israel - but they have nuclear weapons).
This is a thread about work, which you are very active in, so of course your views about work are noteworthy.
Not envy at all. Respect. I have had a few opportunities to be self employed and chose not to due to personal reason/situations. I'm happy with that choice as I work hard for my employer and I am rewarded for my dedication with fair treatment (as is my Gay friend two desks over). However owners DO benefit more than the employees (and yes, as they should) but that benefit should not manifest its self in pulling someone's livelihood because of your old-world beliefs when we don't live in that era anymore.
Why do you assume that anyone who disagrees with you is a right wing extremist? I'm neither right wing nor extremist.
This is the problem. You cannot except that some people have a different view. Some people chose to live their life according to their faith. Why should I accept gay rights or gay marriage or whatever they come up with next when I fundamentally disagree with it. That would make me a hypocrite.
I'm in favour of universal healthcare and use the NHS myself even though I could afford to use private healthcare. I don't know enough about Obama Care to judge.
Freedom of expression is a precious gift for those of us fortunate enough to have it and you would do well to remember that however much you disagree with someone.
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You think? Read the news. Many around the world would disagree with you. The silent majority will probably keep their views to themselves and smile but they and I will never accept it no matter how many laws you pass.
You are free to believe anything you like, but if your actions cause discrimination or offence, then hiding behind you beliefs, will not help you against the full force of the law in any western European country.
I think you are wrong most of Europe is quite at ease with equal rights for gays, gay marriage is gaining ground all around Europe.
Nothing wrong with having your own view, society is a melting pot that "takes all kinds", as they say. The thing is since we live in a society that "takes all kinds", we need to co-exist with each other even though we won't agree on things from time to time. Employment is one of theses areas we need to make concessions to be accepting and tolerant to a reasonable degree to continue to functionally co-exist. Your freedom to think, feel and believe is not in jeopardy and is still intact (so far as demonstrated in these boards it seems to be becoming more and more the minority, but your right non the less) however actions within the confines of a co-existing society need to be tempered. Mine do, just like yours does. Some days it sucks because we feel we should have and behave how we want, regardless of the impact on others (in some cases we may even think "why are they fighting this, this has worked in the past and should continue to do so") but the fact of the matter is we don't have the rights to impose on others. Think and feel as you wish, but theses thoughts and feeling should effect others day-to-day.