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This would be great to have real Firefox on iOS. Unfortunately if this happens I expect Chrome (and Chromium derivatives) to eat up Safari’s market share and further solidify Chrome as the new IE6. A browser monoculture is bad for the web.
 
This is silly. Context matters. You keep using words that have specific meanings in an antitrust contexts while speaking about antitrust matters and then using alternate meanings and shifting references. We've gone through all this before, so I'll drop it here.

I never brought up antitrust laws or regulations. My comment was specifically in response to someone's post stating that (if Apple decides to drop WebKit requirement) it would be "great from a competition standpoint" but there was the possibility of Chromium becoming more dominant on mobile OS. I basically agreed and said if the latter happened, at least it would be due to more of an open market decision rather than one dictated by a dominant company.
 
Never seems to work that way. The free market is a bit of a myth. Take netscape. It was a superior browser to IE, yet it got killed because IE had all the market share. Right now chromium browsers are very dominant. This move could kill WebKit development making safari a worse experience, further shrinking any advantage it might have had. Anyway, I’ll never use any Google products. If a business wants me to use a chromium browser to access their services, they will probably not get my business. Right now I’ve only found a few who wrote their code in such a way as it isn’t functional on safari, but they wont get my business. If this happens, more will follow. 🤷‍♂️

Apple is a much larger company than Netscape was, and has many more customers around the world using not only Apple products but Windows, Android, etc. products. If Safari is a "great" browser, it should be able to do reasonably well (I'm not necessarily suggesting it can become #1) in the market.

One reason Netscape got "killed" was because Microsoft was giving away IE for "free" while Netscape was largely charging for Navigator at the time. Safari, Chrome, etc. are already free so that shouldn’t be a factor.

I would like to see Safari available on Windows, Android, etc.
 
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But Netscape lost market share because not web developers designed their pages to with internet explorer in kind making Netscape an increasingly worse experience hastening its demise. Again the “free market” approach doesn’t always work. As a matter of fact it quite often creates monopolies. Leaving WebKit as the browser engine in iOS is just jolting back the dam of chromium becoming the new internet explorer.
 
I've got mixed feelings about this. I'm less resistant to it than some of the other proposed changes to the Apple ecosystem, but I see two edges to this sword: on the one hand, I like the idea of improving browser experience through differentiation and competition. Web services are meant to be standards based so competition in the browser space should improve the experience. On the other hand, many web services aren't fully cross compatible and this makes it more likely that a variety of services and webapps drop support for Safari, not just on mobile but also on desktop without mobile motivating compatibility.

I use Safari for almost everything on Mac. For work, I'm forced to use Chrome because many tools are only truly compatible with Chrome. If Safari on mobile crumbles, I think it'll be harder to hold the line on my personal devices as well.
I think this will force Apple to improve Safari and Appstore experience or they will become extinct. Good for all, I think.
 
Speak for yourself. I wouldn't call it a choice, but picking the least bad option out of ... two.
Fair enough... But I'd point out that Apple has dozens of competitors if we're still talking about mobile devices.

And picking and choosing are synonyms. :)
 
Yeah we know how that turned out

the-homer-inline4.jpg

The Apple Car lol. /s

Y'all know if Steve was alive to see the Apple Car launch he'd so bite this saying 'And this is what it looks like ...' punchline.
 
But Netscape lost market share because not web developers designed their pages to with internet explorer in kind making Netscape an increasingly worse experience hastening its demise. Again the “free market” approach doesn’t always work. As a matter of fact it quite often creates monopolies. Leaving WebKit as the browser engine in iOS is just jolting back the dam of chromium becoming the new internet explorer.

Netscape lost share for a few reasons but it was at least initially driven by that fact that Microsoft was giving away IE for "free" while Netscape was largely still charging for Navigator. Because of this, IE share grew rapidly (and Navigator share declined rapidly) and it became more practical for web designers to design to an IE standard rather than a "dying" Netscape standard. By giving away IE for free, Microsoft also managed to kill Spyglass's business which had been selling Mosaic browser licenses to companies. When most of your profits come from charging for a product, it can be extremely difficult to compete against a company giving away a similar product for free.

However, various "issues" of the 1990s don't exist quite the same today which is why Microsoft (which still has a significant share of the desktop OS market) doesn't have a browser with around 95% share like they once did. Edge's desktop browser share is around 11% globally and 14% in the U.S.
 
One reason Safar is not competitive is because updated versions are not available on major desktop and mobile platforms. You can’t expect Safari to be able to compete with Chrome, for example, if current versions aren't even available on Windows and Android.
iphone is a major mobile platform. it's consistently being updated.
Mac is a major desktop platform.

In fact Windows and Mac still make up the majority of Desktop/Laptop OS platforms. Bundling all the 250+ currently active Linux distro's may come in at 20% globally as a out of thin-air estimate. Unsure how inaccurate and widely inaccurate I am though.


Name me five things as web standard that cannot be done on iPhone Safari?
 
iphone is a major mobile platform. it's consistently being updated.
Mac is a major desktop platform.

In fact Windows and Mac still make up the majority of Desktop/Laptop OS platforms. Bundling all the 250+ currently active Linux distro's may come in at 20% globally as a out of thin-air estimate. Unsure how inaccurate and widely inaccurate I am though.

Name me five things as web standard that cannot be done on iPhone Safari?

Again, one reason Safari is not competitive in the overall browser market is become the latest versions are not suitable/supported in major segments of the desktop (Windows) and mobile (Android) OS markets where browsers are used.
 
Cmon, let me download Steam and my Steam library on Xbox. It’s the same CPU architecture, same system kernel and same Direct X APIs so should be easy to run a virtualisation layer to let my PC games run on an Xbox.

If iOS is going to be forced to allow side loading and third party app stores then same should go for Xbox and PlayStation.
And don’t forget the Microsoft and Sony “taxes” built into the price whether you buy it through their online store or a brick and mortar one.
 
It was an English man. Happy to educate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Berners-Lee
World Wide Web is different from the Internet. Internet came out of the Arpanet US military project from the late 1960s.

Also, keep in mind the World Wide Web was developed on the NeXT computer which is American technology. #checkmate

Also, the first true web browser was Mosaic, which again is American technology.
 
I don't want a monoculture in browsers, which is basically what Chrome is on the desktop. There needs to be diversity and you have to keep Google in check or they will run rampant with their browser. If they do end up allowing this, I hope it means Apple will at least have the right to review Google's privacy behavior of its apps and disable tracking.

Apple could easily just tell the EU, look, its our platform, stop with your stupid biased behavior because your continent has not created nothing impactful on the world. Android is already the dominant mobile OS, users have choice if they don't like iOS. If you want to side load to your hearts content, choose the platform with three billion devices in use.
Nothing impactful?

Looks like you need to revisit some history 😂
 
World Wide Web is different from the Internet. Internet came out of the Arpanet US military project from the late 1960s.

Also, keep in mind the World Wide Web was developed on the NeXT computer which is American technology. #checkmate

Also, the first true web browser was Mosaic, which again is American technology.
The invention of the computer is British. Which means NeXT wouldn’t happen without it #checkmate
 
This would be great to have real Firefox on iOS. Unfortunately if this happens I expect Chrome (and Chromium derivatives) to eat up Safari’s market share and further solidify Chrome as the new IE6. A browser monoculture is bad for the web.
Apple should revive Safari for Windows (and maybe even do Safari for Android). People want their bookmarks and passwords syncing across all of their devices. For people with a mix of non-Apple devices, Chrome is the de-facto browser they will pick. Apple need to realize this.
 
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Again, one reason Safari is not competitive in the overall browser market is become the latest versions are not suitable/supported in major segments of the desktop (Windows) and mobile (Android) OS markets where browsers are used.
Apple should revive Safari for Windows (and maybe even do Safari for Android). People want their bookmarks and passwords syncing across all of their devices. For people with a mix of non-Apple devices, Chrome is the de-facto browser they will pick. Apple need to realize this.

Exactly, if we go by statcounter.com’s GlobalStats of worldwide overall operating system market share then Safari is available on less than 1 in 4 (23.3%) devices worldwide.

Meanwhile Chrome (Blink engine) is available on just shy of 4 of every 5 devices (78.69%) if we include Webkit-on-iOS Chrome then it’s on 98%+ of all devices.

B53E95AC-CABC-4C45-853C-1D2320BEA9F3.jpeg
 
Apple should revive Safari for Windows (and maybe even do Safari for Android). People want their bookmarks and passwords syncing across all of their devices. For people with a mix of non-Apple devices, Chrome is the de-facto browser they will pick. Apple need to realize this.
Bookmarks and passwords sync with Chrome on Windows through iCloud. Safari for Windows never had significant market share.

But your post emphasizes my earlier point that the most likely outcome of this regulation is that Chrome just gains more market share. Yet another case of the government punishing Apple to benefit the market leader.
 
Apple should revive Safari for Windows (and maybe even do Safari for Android). People want their bookmarks and passwords syncing across all of their devices. For people with a mix of non-Apple devices, Chrome is the de-facto browser they will pick. Apple need to realize this.
This would just remove another lock in feature for keeping people on Mac.

The one big thing keeping from switching to android at the moment is keychain.

It’s just too convenient and too much hassle to change
 
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