Apple Cracking Down on Developers Spamming the App Store With Duplicate Apps

[cmaier]

I asked you if you've earned a full time software developer salary from App Store revenue since you were the among the "first 400" developers. This is a Yes or No question. If you cannot answer Yes, then your answer is obviously No.

If you don't believe removing the "sort by release date" feature was a "hell of a difference" then you've already implied you haven't earned your bread from App Store REVENUE.

Sure, you have earned a livelihood in from software development, but two points clearly indicate your livelihood is not affected by the covfefe that the app store has become.

It’s not a yes or no question. I don’t earn a salary from software development because I am an independent developer. I receive App Store royalties, not a salary.

If you are asking how my apps are monetized, I charge for them. The more copies I sell, the more money I make.

The “sort by release date,” as you know, was constantly manipulated by developers who would constantly release updates and identical apps. Removing it had little effect on my App Store royalties.

 

[adambadamh]

I must say, I feel like some of this was originally propped up by Apple and the media who for years used the number of apps for a platform as some holy grail metric in determining the success or viability when comparing different companies -- even as those numbers reached levels beyond the number of apps one could consume in a lifetime. It was such a useless metric and this just goes to prove as much.

 

[cmaier]

I must say, I feel like some of this was originally propped up by Apple and the media who for years used the number of apps for a platform as some holy grail metric in determining the success or viability when comparing different companies -- even as those numbers reached levels beyond the number of apps one could consume in a lifetime. It was such a useless metric and this just goes to prove as much.

To be fair to Apple, they’ve been purging stuff from the App Store for years.

2016: https://techcrunch.com/2016/11/15/apples-big-app-store-purge-is-now-underway/
2017: https://venturebeat.com/2017/06/17/...apps-apple-plans-to-purge-from-its-app-store/

And those are just the big ones.

 

[Karllake]

Not to be one of the “whiners” but I think part of this problem is the lack of detailed searching in the App Store, if the main search item is the app name but different people would search using different terms you kind of drive the multiple app problem (to some extent)

I’m constantly disappointed when I search for an app and can’t filter in the way as I can for say amazon results, I wanted a game suitable for my daughter age and found the process hugely lacking.

 

[BuddyTronic]

As an iOS App Dev, I know first-hand what "the main problem" is with the iOS App Store ... first, it was Eddie Cue, & now it's Phil Schiller.

Neither had or has the necessary intelligence OR relevant experience to know how to fix the problems.

Solving NOT just the Duplicate App issue, but the entire iOS App Store issue (i.e., 99% are crap apps, & ONLY 1% are viable & credible), AAPL needs to impose "a new tax," on App Devs.

Very specifically, AAPL should inform ALL App Devs that it will NOW cost them, including me, $300 per app, to keep it in the App Store.

Set the due date for End of March.

A one-time-fee of $300 per app will go along ways towards cleaning up the mess that is the iOS App Store.

I promoted this to Cook & Schiller years ago ... yet, as usual, NO action was ever taken.

I do NOT know why they are IN-capable of fixing the iOS App Store.

The problems are fairly-easily fixed.

That tells me the people running the show aren't of the right Sort.

That could be “it” but I’m not absolutely sure.

I just think that the search function could work a whole lot better just by allowing Boolean search stuff. (Do they? I could be proven wrong here).

My seat of the pants feeling is that search functions used to work much better back in the 1990s On Mac OS. I was a big Eudora Email fan. I got to say that I don’t intentionally learn things this is just my personal feelings

 

[cmaier]

That could be “it” but I’m not absolutely sure.

I just think that the search function could work a whole lot better just by allowing Boolean search stuff. (Do they? I could be proven wrong here).

My seat of the pants feeling is that search functions used to work much better back in the 1990s On Mac OS. I was a big Eudora Email fan. I got to say that I don’t intentionally learn things this is just my personal feelings

I miss pine. Now that was a great email client for searching.

 

[MacBH928]

Its amazing although Apple has strict rules... still you see shovelware and spyware apps.

I try to avoid the forum comments here lately. It's become just full of negative people complaining about everything. Many years ago these forums weren't so full of negative folks...

Guess its really true, humans are more motivated online to be negative than positive .

Well its different, back then probably Apple fans were on these forums. Now Apple has gotten a lot bigger, and many of them are Apple customers.

Also, back then Apple was way ahead with their stuff. Like the iPhone and unibody laptop...etc. It was the time when Jobs revealed new stuff and people gave it a standing ovation. Now even MacRumors is preferring the Surface 2 at least on the hardware level.

 

[cmaier]

Its amazing although Apple has strict rules... still you see shovelware and spyware apps.



Well its different, back then probably Apple fans were on these forums. Now Apple has gotten a lot bigger, and many of them are Apple customers.

Also, back then Apple was way ahead with their stuff. Like the iPhone and unibody laptop...etc. It was the time when Jobs revealed new stuff and people gave it a standing ovation. Now even MacRumors is preferring the Surface 2 at least on the hardware level.

This place was pretty damned negative about the iPhone, if you recall.

 

[Timemaster]

I asked you if you've earned a full time software developer salary from App Store revenue since you were the among the "first 400" developers. This is a Yes or No question. If you cannot answer Yes, then your answer is obviously No.

If you don't believe removing the "sort by release date" feature was a "hell of a difference" then you've already implied you haven't earned your bread from App Store REVENUE.

Sure, you have earned a livelihood in from software development, but two points clearly indicate your livelihood is not affected by the covfefe that the app store has become.

To be fair a question like that can be kind of hard to answer.
For example I make a full time salary working only ask an iOS developer and I have for several years. Now it is not my app but a company I work for. The one one where I cut my teeth as a developer had a full team of us only working on one app and I can promise you that you have never heard of it and it is a nitch field but brings in enough money to justify paying full time a team of 8 when you counted QA, design, our manager and devs.

 

[cmaier]

To be fair a question like that can be kind of hard to answer.
For example I make a full time salary working only ask an iOS developer and I have for several years. Now it is not my app but a company I work for. The one one where I cut my teeth as a developer had a full team of us only working on one app and I can promise you that you have never heard of it and it is a nitch field but brings in enough money to justify paying full time a team of 8 when you counted QA, design, our manager and devs.

It’s also not a salary if you are working for yourself and not for a company. Not to mention that it really was none of his business where my money comes from.

 

[Timemaster]

As an iOS App Dev, I know first-hand what "the main problem" is with the iOS App Store ... first, it was Eddie Cue, & now it's Phil Schiller.

Neither had or has the necessary intelligence OR relevant experience to know how to fix the problems.

Solving NOT just the Duplicate App issue, but the entire iOS App Store issue (i.e., 99% are crap apps, & ONLY 1% are viable & credible), AAPL needs to impose "a new tax," on App Devs.

Very specifically, AAPL should inform ALL App Devs that it will NOW cost them, including me, $300 per app, to keep it in the App Store.

Set the due date for End of March.

A one-time-fee of $300 per app will go along ways towards cleaning up the mess that is the iOS App Store.

I promoted this to Cook & Schiller years ago ... yet, as usual, NO action was ever taken.

I do NOT know why they are IN-capable of fixing the iOS App Store.

The problems are fairly-easily fixed.

That tells me the people running the show aren't of the right Sort.

Oh good god that would not fix the issue. Instead it would make the bar higher for entry. Lets be honest that 99 a year fee is already someone painful and hard for me to justify in my own expense because the only items I throw up are some of simpler apps that I do to show off some skills and special one off I did for my brother and a few of his teacher friends. It will never make revenue but I have to pay a 100 a year to have it up in the store.
This compared to Play store I can put up any app right now from the $25 fee I paid in 2012. I have a full developer account.

Also on these company's doing it the $300 would be chump change. They would still flood it. It fixing the underlining issue. Apple already cracks down on a companies that crank out tons of the same apps over and over again for legit reasons. The legit reason is it is the same app but they want multiple different branding for different clients. All use the companies back end but what it looks like in front of it to user it would help.
AKA white label apps.
[doublepost=1551365312][/doublepost]

It’s also not a salary if you are working for yourself and not for a company. Not to mention that it really was none of his business where my money comes from.

true. He was wondering if you make the same as a full time software dev off of it. Not that it is his business but lets face it a lot of people make money only doing iOS work at a full time salary. I can promise you if the places I work at did not make enough money to justify forking paying salary they would be none of doing it full time.
You like I know that software developers are not cheap. Our time is very expensive.

 

[first-to-tea]

The App Store vetting process has really become very lax. And that’s a problem for customers.
[doublepost=1551375035][/doublepost]My concern is around copyright infringement. What is Apple doing about copyright infringement?

 

[cmaier]

The App Store vetting process has really become very lax. And that’s a problem for customers.
[doublepost=1551375035][/doublepost]My concern is around copyright infringement. What is Apple doing about copyright infringement?

When they are made aware of copyright claims they address it.

 

[developer13245]

It’s not a yes or no question. I don’t earn a salary from software development because I am an independent developer. I receive App Store royalties, not a salary.

If you are asking how my apps are monetized, I charge for them. The more copies I sell, the more money I make.

The “sort by release date,” as you know, was constantly manipulated by developers who would constantly release updates and identical apps. Removing it had little effect on my App Store royalties.

Now you're distracting this discussion with semantics, but still not answering the question. The royalties your apps generate fund the salary you ultimately draw from the business - this of course depends on how your business is organized and how you account for expenses, etc.... But the royalties are revenue - that's the important point.

But, you haven't answered the basic question which was: Do you earn a the equivalent market rate for a software engineer from the App Store? To answer this question you need to consider if the royalties you earn from your apps minus business expenses leaves enough in your business accounts to pay yourself the market rate for a software engineer. This is not a hard question to answer for someone in your position (40 years of experience). So if we believe you the only possible explanation for your spin is you probably don't.

I'm in the exact same arrangement you are. I've had apps in the store continuously since 2008, which is over ten years now. By early 2009, I was able to generate enough revenue from app sales to pay myself a full time software engineer salary, even after accounting for business expenses. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case, and it hasn't been for about five years now. I've been able to do consulting work through my entity to generate enough revenue but consulting revenue is not relevant to this discussion.

In essence your case actually proves my point which is: The app store is not working for small developers. Both you and I have been were there in the beginning, yet neither one of us created a viable growing business. Yes, others have had better success, but not in a very long time. Yes, there are Venture Capitol funded startups that have turned out well, but a lot that have gone nowhere. VC funded entitles that entered the iOS ecosystem cannot be compared to self funded efforts like yours and mine. VC opens doors, the lack of it closes them - this was/is "Designed in California" by Apple.

I had a "pipeline" of new app ideas, upgrades to existing apps that were selling well, and even was able to discuss buying another small developers apps to integrate with my "portfolio / business plan". None of those plans came to fruition because the App Store could not generate enough revenue due to its forced policies, specifically related to monetization. Along the way I also paid for 3rd party graphic artists, and other "support services" that I had hoped to eventually hire in at some point. All the 3rd party resources I used expected my business would take off, and all were as befuddled as I was when Apple went in the wrong direction and forced small developers to grind to a near halt.

So I believe you do what you do and that's fine for you. But an industry is not considered successful unless it grows. If Apple (or any company) only generates consistent revenue without year to year growth, its stock would tank. Apple has failed to realize the policies it forced by fiat on App developers inhibited growth of the mobile app software industry. Without that growth, new ideas have stopped entering the ecosystem, and without them Apple will descend to a commodity vendor. Apple cannot survive as such a vendor.

 

[cmaier]

Now you're distracting this discussion with semantics, but still not answering the question. The royalties your apps generate fund the salary you ultimately draw from the business - this of course depends on how your business is organized and how you account for expenses, etc.... But the royalties are revenue - that's the important point.

But, you haven't answered the basic question which was: Do you earn a the equivalent market rate for a software engineer from the App Store? To answer this question you need to consider if the royalties you earn from your apps minus business expenses leaves enough in your business accounts to pay yourself the market rate for a software engineer. This is not a hard question to answer for someone in your position (40 years of experience). So if we believe you the only possible explanation for your spin is you probably don't.

I'm in the exact same arrangement you are. I've had apps in the store continuously since 2008, which is over ten years now. By early 2009, I was able to generate enough revenue from app sales to pay myself a full time software engineer salary, even after accounting for business expenses. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case, and it hasn't been for about five years now. I've been able to do consulting work through my entity to generate enough revenue but consulting revenue is not relevant to this discussion.

In essence your case actually proves my point which is: The app store is not working for small developers. Both you and I have been were there in the beginning, yet neither one of us created a viable growing business. Yes, others have had better success, but not in a very long time. Yes, there are Venture Capitol funded startups that have turned out well, but a lot that have gone nowhere. VC funded entitles that entered the iOS ecosystem cannot be compared to self funded efforts like yours and mine. VC opens doors, the lack of it closes them - this was/is "Designed in California" by Apple.

I had a "pipeline" of new app ideas, upgrades to existing apps that were selling well, and even was able to discuss buying another small developers apps to integrate with my "portfolio / business plan". None of those plans came to fruition because the App Store could not generate enough revenue due to its forced policies, specifically related to monetization. Along the way I also paid for 3rd party graphic artists, and other "support services" that I had hoped to eventually hire in at some point. All the 3rd party resources I used expected my business would take off, and all were as befuddled as I was when Apple went in the wrong direction and forced small developers to grind to a near halt.

So I believe you do what you do and that's fine for you. But an industry is not considered successful unless it grows. If Apple (or any company) only generates consistent revenue without year to year growth, its stock would tank. Apple has failed to realize the policies it forced by fiat on App developers inhibited growth of the mobile app software industry. Without that growth, new ideas have stopped entering the ecosystem, and without them Apple will descend to a commodity vendor. Apple cannot survive as such a vendor.

Ok - I still don’t understand what you are trying to ask, but you seem to be focused on market rate, which I take it to mean that the amount I make per hour is equivalent to what I would make if I was employed as a coder for a company? I have never been employed by a company specifically as a programmer (though programming has been a component of my job, for example when i was designing chips at AMD), so I don’t have any idea what programmers working for companies get paid. All I know is my ROI is worth it.

 

[MacBH928]

This place was pretty damned negative about the iPhone, if you recall.

I don't recall, I wasn't a member in 2007... but I recall the public was negative about the iPad the reason being people were expecting OS X in tablet form. They got a huge iPhone. They still don't have OS X in tablet or touch form.

They were expecting something, and Apple delivered something else. It took sometime for people to get it.

 

[developer13245]

Ok - I still don’t understand what you are trying to ask, but you seem to be focused on market rate, which I take it to mean that the amount I make per hour is equivalent to what I would make if I was employed as a coder for a company? I have never been employed by a company specifically as a programmer (though programming has been a component of my job, for example when i was designing chips at AMD), so I don’t have any idea what programmers working for companies get paid. All I know is my ROI is worth it.

Again, if you consider your ROI is "worth it", but you cannot correlate that to a market reference, then your entire perspective of the app store is not relevant to anything outside your own situation. What ever you did in the past (design chip sets, etc...) isn't relevant either, because chip design has nothing to do with the App Store. I know some people who have apps in the store and consider their effort "a hobby". But their situation, and also yours, is not relevant. The basis of your lack of understanding of these concepts is becoming very clear.