Apple Details 17" MacBook Pro Battery Replacements, Same Day Service at Apple Retail

[Veri]

I've yet to see anyone in an airport carrying around 24 hours worth of batteries, even 12hours worth is not likely to be seen.

When out and about, I carry two healthy Dell batteries most of the time. So I start off with as much runtime as the 17" MBP. Now, I keep my batteries in cool storage (a sealed container in the fridge, for you techies) when not in use, so they last for ages; how long will it be until the MBP's battery has no more runtime than one of mine? And these batteries each cost less than $90 each.

In summary: Two replaceable four-hour batteries offer more flexibility and cost-effectiveness than one sealed eight-hour.

The last time I went through O'Hare there where thousands stranded, many with their laptops out, not a one of them appeared to be doing significant work.

My head is conjuring up a chapter on research techniques covering the complications of interviewing a statistically significant number of tired, irritable people to determine whether they're doing real work or just messing about ;-). You know, just playing about to relieve stress is permitted too...

Some may of wanted to but the environment certainly wasn't suited to it.

An unexpected delay is probably a more difficult environment to concentrate than a predictable journey with a lot of time to work en route that would otherwise be idle waiting/travelling time.

So, based on logic, not what Apple says, if you remove the support for removable batteries and use the volume savings for more battery cell material, then it would stand to reason that you would get a longer time per charge.

The world is not black and white. Even an internal battery will have a degree of protective casing. The extra space taken up by the casing of an external battery will make negligible difference, especially on the scale of a 17" laptop. There are lots of daft things you could do to slightly increase space, like removing the real time clock and syncing time with a timeserver every power-up, but it'd take a leap of RDF to rationalise it.

Have you ever used well-built palmtops from the '90s, such as the Psion 3a or the Toshiba Libretto? These tiny things supported easily accessible, replaceable batteries.

I wonder what will happen with a unibody mac if the battery swells.

Good luck on convincing Apple that the $180 should include cover for the damage it did to your mainboard after 4 years .

Apple wants to reduce the amount of time before you think: "$179? I might as well just put that money toward a new Apple." And if you don't, you have to pay indulgences anyway. It's as simple as that. If you were in the business of making money, wouldn't you do it, if you could get away with it?

 

[seedster2]

A fixed battery in a professional machine is a bad idea. It's proven to be a bad idea in my experience with the iPhone 3G as it can barely last a full work day executing normal business activity - a swappable battery would be nice

there are some issues that apologists are overlooking

- If the apple were confident about the battery's performance they would offer a free replacement service if the battery didn't last the advertised cycles or time, whichever came first

- I use my MBP for work, I dont want to send away just to replace a battery. It's trivial and unnecessary downtime.

- 8 hr estimates were achieved doing non intensive tasks. I doubt the majority of 17 buyers only do word documents and surf the net on the most power conservative modes

- If something does go wrong with your battery I hope it doesnt damage the rest of your lappy before you can bring it in for service (e.g bloat or leakage)

- This is Apple's way of testing the market. If people dont speak up now, it's bound to trickle down to the other models.

 

[impierced]

- This is Apple's way of testing the market. If people dont speak up now, it's bound to trickle down to the other models.

You're forgetting the MacBook Air started this "trend". Apparently, those that did speak up were not heard or (more likely) Apple just wasn't listening.

 

[hagjohn]

Having to send in your computer to replace a battery is dumb. If I upgrade my macbook, I certainly woudn't even look at a laptop that doesn't have a replaceable battery.

 

[hayesk]

Seems almost three times as expensive as the battery for the older 17" notebooks. "Decent" is something else in my book - especially when there is no option for the customer to change the battery him- or herself.

Where can you buy a new 17" MacBook Pro battery for $60? Please enlighten us. Apple's batteries are $129. Considering the extended battery life, the price seems fair.

Usually, a battery will need to be replaced after one year of regular usage. Let's see how long those new batteries will last and if the 179$ charge will still be regarded as "decent" in a year from now.

This is new battery technology. Your estimate doesn't apply.

And let's also wait for what the "low-end" MacBook customers will say once Apple will introduce non-replaceable batteries to that series.

Most "low-end" users I know have never replaced their battery.

I also doubt that frequent long-distance travelers will be happy with non-replaceable batteries. And by long-distance I mean something like Seattle to Düsseldorf or Frankfurt to Grand Junction (which usually took me between 18 and 24 hours to get there, long hours of waiting at the airports included).

Long flights typically have on-board power to plug in to. Airports have electrical outlets all over the place (where do you think the janitors plug in their vacuum cleaners?)

This new "feature" sucks about as much as the dropping of FireWire in the "consumer" notebook line sucked. Apple is losing perspective.

I though this thread was about batteries?

 

[impierced]

Apple should either OEM or partner with a company like APC to make external batteries with magsafe adapters.

Solves the airline/extended run problem for those who are concerned about it.

Completely agree with you. I'm amazed that Apple still hasn't licensed out their MagSafe connector.

This, however, hasn't stopped others from hacking together their own solution:

http://mikegyver.com/IdeasnProducts/extbattery/index.html

http://www.batterygeek.net/SearchResults.asp?Cat=78

http://www.quickertek.com/products/macbook_air_charger.php

 

[Sir Cecil]

The 17" battery is limited to one year warranty, with or without Apple Care.

 

[hayesk]

The casing around a removable battery replaces the outside of the case, which is always going to be there.

Wrong. One side of the casing replaces the outside of the case. The other five sides still need to be there in removeable batteries. Not to mention laying out the motherboard for a large electrical connector, and increasing the case thickness to account for the latch.

If the battery is sealed, the casing around the cells can be much thinner (since they're not going to leave the inside of the machine). It could even be tape.

 

[seedster2]

You're forgetting the MacBook Air started this "trend". Apparently, those that did speak up were not heard or (more likely) Apple just wasn't listening.

I didnt include the AIR because with the size constraints it was more palatable. Also, the battery wasn't touted to last longer because of its fitment.

 

[gmacc]

Apple DID state that you can have the battery replaced same day at an Apple store, or ASP, so those of you that have a store around you, or a service provider then it would be same day.
As far as Batteries being covered by Appplecare, they are not covered unless they are defective ie: not holding a charge, and not able to be charged.
I work for a ASP, and know this to be the case.
Notebook Owners
Your one-year warranty includes replacement coverage for a defective battery. You can extend your replacement coverage for a defective battery to three years from the date of your notebook purchase with the AppleCare Protection Plan. However, the AppleCare Protection Plan for notebook computers does not cover batteries that have failed or are exhibiting diminished capacity except when the failure or diminished capacity is the result of a manufacturing defect. For MacBook Air owners, Apple offers a battery replacement service. You can purchase replacement batteries for late models of Apple notebooks directly from the Apple Store.

 

[kornyboy]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5G77 Safari/525.20)

I wonder if AppleCare covers the $179 fee.

I think that it should if the battery is deemed in need of replacement during the warranty period. I would hope that Apple would honor this.

 

[~Shard~]

This sounds reasonable to me, but I know many users would still prefer to have the option themselves of changing out their own battery, having a backup they can swap in if required, etc. Ah well, you can't please everyone.

Other than faulty batteries, I'm not sure if this will be a big deal anyway - although there are those users who run the same hardware for as long as they possibly can, I would argue that a majority of users will probably be buying a new laptop within the 5-year lifespan of the battery, so instead of replacing the battery they'll probably just replace their MacBook Pro entirely.

Now the other factor here is whether or not the reported 8 hour charge and 5 year life are accurate - I guess time will tell.

 

[kornyboy]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5G77 Safari/525.20)

The battery is probably pretty easy to replace. I doubt we will be seeing anyone replacing it on their own though. From the way that it was presented, it appears to be a very custom battery which would be difficult to buy from anyone other than Apple.

 

[Ja Di ksw]

Gradual decline

Why are people talking about the battery suddenly dying a #x charge? All the batteries I've had on my laptop (3, sigh), slowly go worse and worse over time. Yes, the battery may start out at 8 hours (or actually 7 if you get the better processor), but then in a year it will be down to 5. Then in two years down to 2:30. Then in three years down to an hour (Yes, those are just examples and no one really knows what it will do).

THE POINT is that it will slowly get worse and worse, and Apple might tell you that your battery that last 3:30 is still good and a replacement isn't covered, and then you have to send off your battery, wait a few days without any computer, and pay almost $200 just b/c you wouldn't swap it out. Much better had they done a slightly worse batter (say 7 or 6 hours, depending on processor) that you could mess with yourself. 7 hours is still a long time, I don't need an extra hour at the cost of not being able to swap it myself.

 

[impierced]

I didnt include the AIR because with the size constraints it was more palatable. Also, the battery wasn't touted to last longer because of its fitment.

The size constraint was Apple's justification for it not being removable. Anyone who's taken off the base screws of an Air and taken out the battery could easily make the argument that Apple could've make the battery removable - like the 17, but they chose not to.

The point is, Apple started this trend of non-removable batteries for their laptops with the Air, and it appears as though they mean to continue with it.

 

[VoR]

Wrong. One side of the casing replaces the outside of the case. The other five sides still need to be there in removeable batteries. Not to mention laying out the motherboard for a large electrical connector, and increasing the case thickness to account for the latch.

If the battery is sealed, the casing around the cells can be much thinner (since they're not going to leave the inside of the machine). It could even be tape.

I hardly went into huge detail in my post I was just simplifying the description and saying that you're not necessarily losing space by having an external removable battery. Their advertising blurb states 40% space wasted, which should ring alarm bells for anyone.
All batteries are going to require the same sized connector and how often do you see them held together with anything other than a thin layer of plastic?
You didn't quote it, but what would the disadvantages be of sliding the battery in the side of a unibody case? They've already juggled around the internals, same connector, same cell laminate, no latches/structures needed to hold it in place - It looks like an anally retentive aesthetics decision to me.

 

[~Shard~]

THE POINT is that it will slowly get worse and worse, and Apple might tell you that your battery that last 3:30 is still good and a replacement isn't covered, and then you have to send off your battery, wait a few days without any computer, and pay almost $200 just b/c you wouldn't swap it out. Much better had they done a slightly worse batter (say 7 or 6 hours, depending on processor) that you could mess with yourself. 7 hours is still a long time, I don't need an extra hour at the cost of not being able to swap it myself.

Fair point. Yes, Apple says the battery will last 5 years, but what if that ends up being only holding a 1 hour charge at the 5 year mark? And furthermore, will Apple replace your battery regardless as long as you're willing to pay the fee, or will they have conditions?

 

[omegaphil6]

First of all... 5 years from now when this machine needs it first replacement, the computing world will be alot different. in 5 years all macbooks may have no removable batteries with new technology that enables 15 hours of usage. Will those battery replacements utilize this future technology? Will anyone really NOT purchase the new 17" macbook because of fears of the battery not holding a charge 5 years from now? Does anyone who owns an ibook from 2003-2004 era still have the original battery in it? Will the price still be $179 5 years from now? Since the machine will be out of warranty ANYWAY, wouldnt NewerTech or some other company have a replacement battery service themselves available for less than Apple's? I guess what i am trying to say is, if Apple really has a nonremoveable battery that will last for 5 years before needing to be replaced, then the fact that its nonremovable is irrelevent. ITS GOOD FOR 5 YEARS! THAT IS AMAZING. 5 years from now, this machine will not be in the spotlight and will be just like any old Macbook/ibook today.

 

[Beau10]

Please point out in the Apple documentation where this is stated.

My evidence is that they do cover batteries in the 2nd and 3rd years.

Ian

Like everything with Apple if you yell loudly enough you may get a solution.

But the fact of the matter is Apple handles warranty claims based on a 1/300/80 warranty (< 1 year, >300 cycles, < 80%... it will be replaced). This isn't explicitly stated on their website, but is their internal policy as has been noted many times on this website, the apple forums, etc.

The core duo macbook pros got an _extension_ for 2 years due to their unique issues.

http://www.apple.com/support/macbook_macbookpro/batteryupdate/

"or MacBook and MacBook Pro systems with Intel Core Duo processors, this program extends repair coverage on the battery for up to two years from the date of purchase of the computer...with a battery cycle count (as shown in System Profiler) of less than 300."

 

[alfonsog]

Does anyone who owns an ibook from 2003-2004 era still have the original battery in it?

I have an iBook G3/600 from 2001 and I have only changed the battery once. I keep waiting for the iBook to die so I can justify a new Macbook. It was my first mac as well! (Anyone want it?)

And anyone that continuously travels transcontinental flights and needs a 17" can certainly afford first class or would be upgraded (lots of frequent flyer miles.) And certainly will upgrade to the next version of the 17", way before battery fatigue or failure. And certainly isn't Apple's key demographic for sales of this beast!

 

[island]

This new "feature" sucks about as much as the dropping of FireWire in the "consumer" notebook line sucked. Apple is losing perspective.

I am betting that out of a 100 people, 95 will be happy having 7-8 hours of battery life with wireless enabled on a 17" powerhouse.

 

[snberk103]

:
Originally Posted by seedster2
- This is Apple's way of testing the market. If people dont speak up now, it's bound to trickle down to the other models.

You're forgetting the MacBook Air started this "trend". Apparently, those that did speak up were not heard or (more likely) Apple just wasn't listening.

Or, just perhaps..... despite the few vocal claims that the "end of the world was nigh" ... people decided that the benefits of the non-accessible battery out-weighed the inconveniences?

Between the 2 of us, my wife and I own 4 laptops (only because we have each upgraded from an old one to a new one, and keep the old ones around because - well they still work fine). My wife travels for work. Between the two of us we own not a single spare battery. Nor, have we ever thought that owning one would make any sense. We could even share the cost of a spare battery between two machines..... still don't need one.

There will be external battery solutions for the new MBP for those that need the extra power. People will get a new machine when the inevitable occasional battery goes bad and swells and damages the laptop. The world will go on.

 

[jellomizer]

$129 for a current replacement battery so I suppose $179 is not bad. Having read on the internet about the battery "bulge" problem - the non replaceable battery might not be a bad thing...

Having had the battery "bulge" problem I still want a user replaceable battery, Heck I want it more. When my battery failed on me. I went to the store that had apple batteries (Apple Store, Best Buy, CompUSA (when it was still in business), etc...) bought the battery before I started work swapped the battery and continued my day. Having to wait a day, to use my computer (or 3-4 days if I am not near an Apple store) is very very inconvenient, and costly.
They expect 5 years on the average but it could be 2 years or 8 years, until you need a replacement.

It is a part that needs to be replaced so let us replace it. I don't care if it saves 1/4 inch of thinkness on my 17"laptop. Even if it lasts twice as long as my normal battery, the cost of being out of commission is higher then the replacement battery.

 

[AidenShaw]

Long flights typically have on-board power to plug in to.

And very frequently they don't. Power in coach is relatively rare, and I have an upcoming trans-Pacific flight where the business-class cabin doesn't have power. (4 legs to the journey - power in b-class on 3 of the flights)

You can go to http://www.seatguru.com and look at cabin layouts. Only a few airlines have any configurations that have power to all coach seats. Most have no power. (Usually when a plane is reconfigured (remodeled) the new cabin will have power to some or most seats in coach.)

Airports have electrical outlets all over the place (where do you think the janitors plug in their vacuum cleaners?)

The janitors at most of the airports that I visit must have 30m extension cords on their vacuums - since sometimes that's how far apart the outlets are.

Clearly, this varies from airport to airport. I recently did a two hop trip. First waiting area had a surface mount wiring channel added around the entire perimeter of the room, with an outlet every 2m. Second area had all the seats in the middle of the room, with one outlet for 150 people.

 

[jellomizer]

Or, just perhaps..... despite the few vocal claims that the "end of the world was nigh" ... people decided that the benefits of the non-accessible battery out-weighed the inconveniences?

What are the real benefits that out-weigh the inconvenience of not using your computer for minimum 1 day. I am sorry, not having access to my computer for a mostly unscheduled, day/week is not tradeoff. Even for twice battery life, and longer run time. It is a 17" MacBook Pro. These things are supposed to be portable workstations not ultra light MacBook Airs, Give me a thicker PC that I can fix quickly and keep going.