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You obviously didn't understand even my first sentence, so your cocksure ranting is sort of ridiculous. Read it again, or just pretend I don't exist. That'd be fine too.

MAYBE you should have read further than just the word "case", which I used, but not in reference to your sentence, obviously. Then MAYBE your would've come up with real points instead of just an ad hominem attack. But well, it seems, you don't have any.
 
And what if Nixon were to rise from the dead and win the next election? I mean you argue one preposterous argument what about mine?

Its not that preposterous... Opera Mini only does it because their javascript is executed remotely.
 
Unfortunatly that's not the case TODAY.

Almost every video review someone links to about an Apple product is being displayed via Flash.

It's like me telling you you should be driving cars that run on my new fuel, (which may be better in the long term) but there are almost no filling stations that offer it.

Close analogy, but not quite. Let me help: It's as if you were telling me to drive THE CARS THAT YOU SELL that only run on your new fuel, (which may be better in the long term) but there are almost no filling stations that offer it. You may think it is a bad business decision to sell such cars, but it is hardly illegal.
 
I am probably mistaken here but that is not what Apple's policy states. As I recall the wording has more to do with the language that the programs are originally written in than the platform that they are developed on, and it's ability to compile an application for the iPhone OS. Flash is not on the list of languages, which includes C++, Object C, and one or two others (Java?).

That may be but when my company met with the Apple iPhone Dev and iAd teams they told us something completely different. A very grey area
 
See the chart posted previously.

You have still failed to explain what that chart represents (again, it isn't what you think it is) and why it is relevant. This would lead a reasonable person to suspect you don't actually understand what it means.

No, what it means is that if I want to make a mobile application and want to make money with it I'm basically forced to make it work on the iPhone if I want to sell it.

And Apple is applying unfair restrictions to my ability to do so.

Ridiculous. People make money developing for other platforms. The opportunity may be smaller, but the answer to that is to pressure other platform vendors to make something that people *actually want to use*.

Who says what's "fair"? Is it unfair that Apples does not support VBasic? Why or why not?

You all keep missing that this isn't Microsoft in 1998. We're not talking about an environment of backroom deals and bribery that have established lock-in across all of the business and 92% of the consumer world. We're talking about a consumer gizmo that is preferred among some percentage of the very small population of people that buy this particular sort of gizmo (smartphones). You don't have any particular "right" to anything about it, because nobody is being forced into it. A few million people out of the 6.5 billion on earth have bought one for whatever reason. Not analogous in any way to nearly 100% of the computer market being forced to make the "choice".
 
That wasn't the point, MS forced out the competition by integrating IE into the OS and made it free. Back in the day Netscape was a paid product. So what was the point in using another browser if one came free with the OS, even if Netscape became free? Also at the time IE4 was really good, it was only until MS had wiped out all the other browsers had the problems started to set in.

Ohhh, now we get to see how many posteres here understand the difference between the Flash compiler program ban and just having Flash run on the iPhone.

I hope it's a small percentage, but I'm not too optimistic...

Thank you. You two actually have a grasp on the situation.
 
Please read US. v Microsoft and the 5 arguments that the US government put forth. Here's a tip it had something to do with Microsoft's share of the computer OS market and how they integrated IE into Windows.

I actually have read it - it doesn't apply here.

At the time of the lawsuit, Microsoft had 95% of the market. They used that market power to dictate to the OEMs that they could not preinstall Navigator on their computers. That's called using monopoly market power to destroy a competitor. You can still develop for Android and Blackberry using this compiler. In one way, Apple is limiting its number of apps, and all this huge amount (?) of Adobe apps will now go to competitors, which Microsoft did not have.

Can I develop for Android using Apple's tools, and Objective-C? No, I didn't think so.
 
Its not that preposterous... Opera Mini only does it because their javascript is executed remotely.

That's not my point though - Apple isn't forcing people to use only Safari - only webkit based browsers (there are a bunch of them in the store). That's what I was calling preposterous.
 
What happens when the iPhone OS is the number one OS after it surpasses Symbian, etc? Does Apple then have the choice to put all these restrictions on the developers?

Being number one wouldn't be sufficient for an antitrust case. Symbian is currently the worldwide number one but far from a monopoly (I'm sure you would agree) In case iPhone OS attains a monopoly in the smartphone market (I hope this will never happen), things are very different.
 
This is what I dislike most about these discussions. It always resorts to bashing. If you disagree fine. Can't we all be adults and have civil conversations.

I apologize if your delicate sensibilities were offended, but when you're dreaming up clearly ridiculous conspiracy theories in order to bash the corporate-hate-target de jur, you can't be expected to be treated like a "civilized adult". Apples compiler toolkit of choice is open and used by many platforms. They are moving towards it, not away from it. You're wrong, which is no crime, but you're wrong in the service of making unfounded assertions of some sort of personal bad intent, so...
 
Love your signature. I wonder if you participated in a similar discussion in 1998 when Apple forced you to not have the ability to use your Floppy Disks and use only USB Keyboards, Mice and Printers (FYI as of March 31 2010 Sony Discontinued Floppy Support).

Apple didn't ban you from using an external floppy drive...

Close analogy, but not quite. Let me help: It's as if you were telling me to drive THE CARS THAT YOU SELL that only run on your new fuel

If you're fuel had a 99% market share and you were preventing people from using a general fuel that probably would be anti-competative.
 
What Apple could do is to certify apps that have been programmed according to their standards. Uncertified apps still could be installed displaying a warning that this is not an app officially supported by Apple, and that installation may result in instability, decreased performance and increased power requirements, possibly even damage to the phone by overheating.

While I agree with that idea, its good really. I don't see apple doing that. They prefer doing it their way and forcing everyone else to bend to their will. By approving apps they basically force developers to comply and not use anything but apple states.

I see little flexibility in apple these days which is why this wouldn't work.
 
At the time of the lawsuit, Microsoft had 95% of the market. They used that market power to dictate to the OEMs that they could not preinstall Navigator on their computers. That's called using monopoly market power to destroy a competitor. You can still develop for Android and Blackberry using this compiler. In one way, Apple is limiting its number of apps, and all this huge amount (?) of Adobe apps will now go to competitors, which Microsoft did not have.

Can I develop for Android using Apple's tools, and Objective-C? No, I didn't think so.

*Sigh* you did so much work and you missed the point - MS had a 95+% market share and they used that monopoly (as legally defined BTY) to tightly ingrain internet explorer to give it a critical advantage and contractually prevented OEM manufactures from making deals with other companies to bundle other web browsers with their systems. That was the problem.
 
Being number one wouldn't be sufficient for an antitrust case. Symbian is currently the worldwide number one but far from a monopoly (I'm sure you would agree) In case iPhone OS attains a monopoly in the smartphone market (I hope this will never happen), things are very different.

Apple has a monopoly on mobile Application sales though.
 
Can I develop for Android using Apple's tools, and Objective-C? No, I didn't think so.

That's like saying can I cook a fish to make a hamburger. (Bad analogy I know)

My point is, you can use anything you want to develop for the Android if the tool is built for it. If someone made a compiler from Objective-C to Java or whatever, then yes... you can use Objective-C to build for Android.
 
MAYBE you should have read further than just the word "case", which I used, but not in reference to your sentence, obviously. Then MAYBE your would've come up with real points instead of just an ad hominem attack. But well, it seems, you don't have any.

And you still haven't supported any of your assertions. It never ceases to amaze how people throw around unfounded, ignorant assertions and then get high and mighty and start yelling "ad hominem" when someone asks them to justify it.
 
If I can't make enough money to justify developing an app, then I shouldn't make that app. It's just that simple.

There's nothing here.
 
Love your signature. I wonder if you participated in a similar discussion in 1998 when Apple forced you to not have the ability to use your Floppy Disks and use only USB Keyboards, Mice and Printers (FYI as of March 31 2010 Sony Discontinued Floppy Support). I don't remember such a fuss at that time. If Adobe was so interested in what Apple is doing they should have gotten the hint back in 1997 when Apple first put the writing on the wall. If all those out there want the missing features including Flash jailbreak your Apple device and don't expect any support if said device continuously takes a dump. I would hope Apple would be able to Tie Serial Numbers with OS and installed apps and if your device is running unauthorized OS or apps, just kindly apologize and mention that Apple doesn't support non authorized OS's and apps then hangs up. This will reduce support to less one minute and the support people can then go help customers with TRUE device problem not User induced problems.

Thank you. In 1998 I was relearning computers after a 10+ year blank since my TI-99/4A BASIC days. At college many years of windows frustration followed, and then work years of windows frustration after. I programmed games for the PS3, built websites for a living, was proficient in a wide range of creative apps but I never owned a PC for one reason or another. Back at school, what I could get for my money then was way below what was provided. In the lab I met OSX and Project Builder and played with Carbon a bit (Cocoa was too scary then and I wanted to leverage my plain-old-C).

Then last year I bought a 24' iMac and I've been very happy since then. I have everything I need. My iPhone works great too.
 
Thank you. In 1998 I was relearning computers after a 10+ year blank since my TI-99/4A BASIC days. At college many years of windows frustration followed, and then work years of windows frustration after. I programmed games for the PS3, built websites for a living, was proficient in a wide range of creative apps but I never owned a PC for one reason or another. Back at school, what I could get for my money then was way below what was provided. In the lab I met OSX and Project Builder and played with Carbon a bit (Cocoa was too scary then and I wanted to leverage my plain-old-C).

Then last year I bought a 24' iMac and I've been very happy since then. I have everything I need. My iPhone works great too.

Wow, I'd be happy with a 24 foot iMac too.
 
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