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Brandonjr36

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Sep 12, 2016
1,621
556
Joplin
And yet you're saying what their capabilities and skills ought to be. You've listed how long they've been at this and where they ought to be by this point. You're quite critical about their output. You have expectations for them that aren't being met.

I've never done brain surgery. I'm not a doctor or surgeon. But I don't go around finding medical type forums so I can pretend to know more than actual brain surgeons. I don't criticize their work, their methods or their philosophy. I don't try to inform them about how to avoid certain side effects or how they might shave 20 minutes off that surgery. They know what they're doing, I don't. I leave it at that.

So why is everyone suddenly an arm-chair programmer? Everyone has an opinion of what Apple is doing wrong and how to fix it despite having no practical experience or knowledge.

If you want to tell me how much you dislike iOS and why, that's fine. But if you're going to tell me what their programmers should be doing 10 years into this, you're just going to get a laugh from my end. That's the very definition of an "uninformed opinion".
Your just some random ass dude building software. We’re talking about a multi billion dollar company vs you. They should be able to build stable software. Even from the start.
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors P6
Jan 17, 2013
16,386
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Wales, United Kingdom
So why is everyone suddenly an arm-chair programmer? Everyone has an opinion of what Apple is doing wrong and how to fix it despite having no practical experience or knowledge.
I can give an answer to this. I am a consumer who is aware of the capabilities of competitors so I think it’s reasonable to have certain expectations based on what I’d like to see Apple doing. I pay a lot of money for their products so I do have an opinion on what I’d like to see.

After downloading iOS 11 on my 6S and seeing my battery performance plummet almost instantly, and finding myself nearly running out of battery by 2pm, I felt rather disappointed. I think it’s fair to be under the impression an experienced software company like Apple could thoroughly test a version before releasing it to us. You don’t have to have any experience of programming to have these types of expectations. We are consumers, many of which have been using iOS for several years. It’s not unreasonable or comical to share concerns.
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,491
I know everyone has their take on iOS 11 and how it’s not been very well recepted. But when you look at terms of software in the smart phone industry, you really only have two options. You have android or iOS. With iOS, I look at three values that Apple values: (And yes I realize the below sub-points are opinionated and not all will agree)

1.) Simplicity-Others think iOS is boring and dull and non-customizable, but I actually prefer that and I think others do as well, they just want something that is straightforward without the clutter and complication.

2.) Security- Apple has some Of the most stringent security in terms of encryption and protection. They value this, which means they value my security, which earns my trust.

3.) Stability- Five years of iOS support, with continual updates annually in between to make improvements and refinements. At least compared to Android, where its approximately two years of updates.
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors P6
Jan 17, 2013
16,386
24,130
Wales, United Kingdom
I know everyone has their take on iOS 11 and how it’s not been very well recepted.
But when you look at terms of software in the smart phone industry, you really only have two options. You have android or iOS. With iOS, I look at three values that Apple values: (And yes I realize the below sub-points are opinionated and not all will agree)

1.) Simplicity-Others think iOS is boring and dull and non-customizable, but I actually prefer that and I think others do as well, they just want something that is straightforward without the clutter and complication.

2.) Security- Apple has some Of the most stringent security in terms of encryption and protection. They value this, which means they value my security, which earns my trust.

3.) Stability- Five years of iOS support, with continual updates annually in between to make improvements and refinements. At least compared to Android, where its approximately two years of updates.
I think iOS is boring but it does the job very well for me and is usually very stable. My annoyance with iOS 11 was the three months it took to address the battery issues I had. It was unacceptable really as my iPhone was not up to the job on a few occasions. When out with work I found more than once my iPhone had turned itself off with no battery by late afternoon. They did finally do it but three months is a hell of a long time.

Other than looking at features used, I would never consider Android so it’s off my shopping list. My only concerns, expectations and complaints are with iOS.
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
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I think iOS is boring but it does the job very well for me and is usually very stable. My annoyance with iOS 11 was the three months it took to address the battery issues I had. It was unacceptable really as my iPhone was not up to the job on a few occasions. When out with work I found more than once my iPhone had turned itself off with no battery by late afternoon. They did finally do it but three months is a hell of a long time.

Other than looking at features used, I would never consider Android so it’s off my shopping list. My only concerns, expectations and complaints are with iOS.

iOS is far from perfect, but I look at technology as a whole, and I think Apple does an adequate job with their software. I think smart phones across-the-board have excellent hardware between competitors, but it really comes down to software, and Apple knows that. Android, although improved over the years, will likely never be for me as much as I appreciate iOS. And I was with android years ago, it’s just not my type of preference. When I switched to iOS for the first time, I was astonished how everything was fluid and smooth.
 

The-Real-Deal82

macrumors P6
Jan 17, 2013
16,386
24,130
Wales, United Kingdom
iOS is far from perfect, but I look at technology as a whole, and I think Apple does an adequate job with their software. I think smart phones across-the-board have excellent hardware between competitors, but it really comes down to software, and Apple knows that. Android, although improved over the years, will likely never be for me as much as I appreciate iOS. And I was with android years ago, it’s just not my type of preference. When I switched to iOS for the first time, I was astonished how everything was fluid and smooth.
That’s all true and all well and good but when you go from a very stable iOS 10 to instant issues with iOS 11, the romance of how good Apple is with software takes a back seat somewhat. I’m back to having very few issues now though yet I’ve not forgotten how frustrating it was a couple of months back. iOS is not perfect and never has been but I believe certain major issues should be addressed with urgency and acknowledged rather than keeping us guessing whether our iPhones have been bricked or not. I hope iOS 12 doesn’t have the same problem and I doubt it will as usually an update is largely fine.
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
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but I believe certain major issues should be addressed with urgency and acknowledged rather than keeping us guessing whether our iPhones have been bricked or not. I hope iOS 12 doesn’t have the same problem and I doubt it will as usually an update is largely fine.

What certain major issues should be addressed with urgency? Just curious what you’re referring to.
 

mrochester

macrumors 601
Feb 8, 2009
4,522
2,446
Well the issue I experienced and have been talking about. The fact batteries lost two thirds of their daily life after the update with immediate effect. It was pretty widespread too judging by the articles and complaints online.

It probably wasn’t a widespread enough issue for it to be classed as a major issue.
 

Phone Junky

macrumors 68020
Oct 29, 2011
2,431
4,240
Midwest
It’s not only about Face ID. And I’m sorry but how was i suppose to know that feature was trash from the start??

It’s just not consistent. It’s fails about the same amount of time it works. About 50-50, I much prefer Touch ID honestly.
You had 14 days to return the "trash". If it only worked half of the time, as you claim, in the first 14 days, I would have returned it and got something that suited me better.
 

MEJHarrison

macrumors 68000
Feb 2, 2009
1,522
2,723
I can give an answer to this. I am a consumer who is aware of the capabilities of competitors so I think it’s reasonable to have certain expectations based on what I’d like to see Apple doing. I pay a lot of money for their products so I do have an opinion on what I’d like to see.

After downloading iOS 11 on my 6S and seeing my battery performance plummet almost instantly, and finding myself nearly running out of battery by 2pm, I felt rather disappointed. I think it’s fair to be under the impression an experienced software company like Apple could thoroughly test a version before releasing it to us. You don’t have to have any experience of programming to have these types of expectations. We are consumers, many of which have been using iOS for several years. It’s not unreasonable or comical to share concerns.

Thanks for taking the time to answer. That's a great answer. I have no problems with that answer because it's quite sane. You're a customer, you can have opinions. You're a user, you can miss features a competing phone has. You paid a lot of money, so you have the right to be unhappy with your purchase. That's all quite reasonable.

I was responding to someone who is criticizing Apple for not writing software without bugs. That's an unrealistic expectation that will never happen while humans are coders. I was commenting that he must not have any experience with coding or he would realize what an unrealistic statement that is. I took issue not with his opinions, but how he presented them. And his unwillingness to be educated on the topic.
 

boltjames

macrumors 601
May 2, 2010
4,876
2,851
So why is everyone suddenly an arm-chair programmer? Everyone has an opinion of what Apple is doing wrong and how to fix it despite having no practical experience or knowledge.

95% = envy/expensive/hater

5% = defective hardware but too lazy to go to an Apple Store to address it.
 

960design

macrumors 68040
Apr 17, 2012
3,700
1,569
Destin, FL
Apple has really lost there touch. Saw where they weren’t gonna give use any new features in iOS 12 because they want to fix bugs. That BS. I gave a $1000 for a phone to a company that can’t even make a stable software. They have been doing iOS for 10 years now you would think they would be able make a software that’s doesn’t have so many damn bugs. And still be able to give use features. Kinda wish I would’ve bought an lg to be honest.
In your opinion you are correct. Fortunately there are many more choices out there in the this free market world. Good luck and let us know what you find out.
 

MarkX

macrumors 65816
Sep 10, 2015
1,128
1,354
Fochabers, Scotland
And yet you're saying what their capabilities and skills ought to be. You've listed how long they've been at this and where they ought to be by this point. You're quite critical about their output. You have expectations for them that aren't being met.

I've never done brain surgery. I'm not a doctor or surgeon. But I don't go around finding medical type forums so I can pretend to know more than actual brain surgeons. I don't criticize their work, their methods or their philosophy. I don't try to inform them about how to avoid certain side effects or how they might shave 20 minutes off that surgery. They know what they're doing, I don't. I leave it at that.

So why is everyone suddenly an arm-chair programmer? Everyone has an opinion of what Apple is doing wrong and how to fix it despite having no practical experience or knowledge.

If you want to tell me how much you dislike iOS and why, that's fine. But if you're going to tell me what their programmers should be doing 10 years into this, you're just going to get a laugh from my end. That's the very definition of an "uninformed opinion".

Well said
 
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Raist3001

macrumors 65816
Mar 5, 2012
1,127
880
Right behind you
I was responding to someone who is criticizing Apple for not writing software without bugs.
I agree, that is an unrealistic expectation as no one can program with 100 percent accuracy. However, if I may, in my opinion, the last best iOS release was iOS 6. Since then, each iteration of iOS has introduced bugs that have been compounded over time. The most prevalent being the dropped frame rates. They are much much less today, but my point is that it seems that apple may be ignoring certain things, like the single sign on issues with AppleTV.
 

Brandonjr36

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Sep 12, 2016
1,621
556
Joplin
Thanks for taking the time to answer. That's a great answer. I have no problems with that answer because it's quite sane. You're a customer, you can have opinions. You're a user, you can miss features a competing phone has. You paid a lot of money, so you have the right to be unhappy with your purchase. That's all quite reasonable.

I was responding to someone who is criticizing Apple for not writing software without bugs. That's an unrealistic expectation that will never happen while humans are coders. I was commenting that he must not have any experience with coding or he would realize what an unrealistic statement that is. I took issue not with his opinions, but how he presented them. And his unwillingness to be educated on the topic.
It’s not about a couple bugs the whole damn iOS 11 software is trash. It’s the whole thing not just a couple bugs.
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95% = envy/expensive/hater

5% = defective hardware but too lazy to go to an Apple Store to address it.
Well considering I have a new iPhone on the way now since I’m 2 and half hours from the closest Apple store. This will be my 4 iPhone X. Since the others either had dust under the lens or had issues. “Imagine that” but anyway waiting a new one since this pos won’t make any calls now.
[doublepost=1522858683][/doublepost]
In your opinion you are correct. Fortunately there are many more choices out there in the this free market world. Good luck and let us know what you find out.
Oh I’ve had lg before. Had the lg g2 when it came out this iPhone X isn’t half the phone that even that old one was.
[doublepost=1522858773][/doublepost]
I agree, that is an unrealistic expectation as no one can program with 100 percent accuracy. However, if I may, in my opinion, the last best iOS release was iOS 6. Since then, each iteration of iOS has introduced bugs that have been compounded over time. The most prevalent being the dropped frame rates. They are much much less today, but my point is that it seems that apple may be ignoring certain things, like the single sign on issues with AppleTV.
Not saying it has to be 100% but it definitely should be better then what it is now. Considering apple has been doing the same **** for 10 years now.
 
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mrochester

macrumors 601
Feb 8, 2009
4,522
2,446
It’s not about a couple bugs the whole damn iOS 11 software is trash. It’s the whole thing not just a couple bugs.
[doublepost=1522858612][/doublepost]
Well considering I have a new iPhone on the way now since I’m 2 and half hours from the closest Apple store. This will be my 4 iPhone X. Since the others either had dust under the lens or had issues. “Imagine that” but anyway waiting a new one since this pos won’t make any calls now.
[doublepost=1522858683][/doublepost]
Oh I’ve had lg before. Had the lg g2 when it came out this iPhone X isn’t half the phone that even that old one was.
[doublepost=1522858773][/doublepost]
Not saying it has to be 100% but it definitely should be better then what it is now. Considering apple has been doing the same **** for 10 years now.

I wonder how and why some people have such a bad experience yet others with the same device and OS have such a good experience? My iPhone X has been excellent since I bought it and iOS 11 is great. It would be an interesting study to find out why it’s so bad for you.
 
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