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Apple has no good reason not to allow third-party widgets.

M

moonman239

Cancelled
Original poster
Mar 27, 2009
1,541
32
People like to cite battery life as the reason Apple didn't allow third-party widgets in the Notification Center. I say that's not true. If the mere addition of widgets has a significant impact on battery, then so do push notifications and local notifications.

The solution to the battery problem is this. If new data is available, the widget can be updated via a widget service. This is similar to how push notifications are delivered - they are sent to Apple, then to the users' devices.
 
Apple don't allow 3rd party widgets because apple don't want widgets. End of conversation..
 
laudern said:
Apple don't allow 3rd party widgets because apple don't want widgets. End of conversation..
Click to expand...

I think it is a given some type of live information on the homescreen is going to happen in either iOS 7 or iOS 8. Apple can't continue to ignore live info because now people come to expect it given it is now in Windows Phone, Android, and Blackberry. Will they call it "widgets"? Probably not. Will they look like Android widgets? Probably not. But it is going to happen.
 
moonman239 said:
People like to cite battery life as the reason Apple didn't allow third-party widgets in the Notification Center.
Click to expand...

Moon man, I'm a long time AAPL stock holder and have made a lot of money with it. A few months ago, I got my first iPhone (a 4S, off eBay) and am really shocked how far behind Android they are.

I have yet to find anything really neat on iOS that isn't on Android. That's not to say there isn't anything on iOS that's head and shoulders above Android, just I haven't found it in the things I'm interested in using on the phone.

And then there are very annoying drawbacks in iOS like can't change default map app, text message app, dialer app, browser. So I end up using 2 different apps for the same function and get confused which app I'm in... You can't just auto-update your apps, you have to go in and do it manually. You're a nerd if you actually read the release notes... I just hit the update button like every other regular human does, but it's annoying to have one more thing to always be fussing around with on my phone. You can't use Siri to send texts through these free online services like Google Voice... No widgets as you mention. Apps can't set them up as a service, so things like a data usage counter, you have to remember to restart every time you reboot your phone. There are these really great Android apps like llama and Tasker that aren't available on iOS because Apple has elected not to make the API's available...

Probably the best thing I've found is the Twitter apps are better on iOS. I think the Yelp app is better too, but I wasn't using Yelp heavily before I got my iPhone.

There is the issue of "it just works" that's got me holding off on stuff like moving my parents to Android. But the last time I got a new Android phone was their Ginger Bread release. And getting things working like I wanted was a hassle. Now that Android has moved a couple of versions past that, and I'm really annoyed with iOS, I think I'm getting a Galaxy Nexus. Is setting that thing up goes really smoothly, I may just move my parents over there.

Also, I'm waiting to this summer to decide, when iOS 7 comes out. How far behind Apple is in a lot of stuff is really shocking. Now that I got an iPhone, I see why they fired that Scott Forstall guy. I'm waiting to see what Jonny Ives can do before ai move my parents to Android.
 
levander said:
Moon man, I'm a long time AAPL stock holder and have made a lot of money with it. A few months ago, I got my first iPhone (a 4S, off eBay) and am really shocked how far behind Android they are.

I have yet to find anything really neat on iOS that isn't on Android. That's not to say there isn't anything on iOS that's head and shoulders above Android, just I haven't found it in the things I'm interested in using on the phone.

And then there are very annoying drawbacks in iOS like can't change default map app, text message app, dialer app, browser. So I end up using 2 different apps for the same function and get confused which app I'm in... You can't just auto-update your apps, you have to go in and do it manually. You're a nerd if you actually read the release notes... I just hit the update button like every other regular human does, but it's annoying to have one more thing to always be fussing around with on my phone. You can't use Siri to send texts through these free online services like Google Voice... No widgets as you mention. Apps can't set them up as a service, so things like a data usage counter, you have to remember to restart every time you reboot your phone. There are these really great Android apps like llama and Tasker that aren't available on iOS because Apple has elected not to make the API's available...

Probably the best thing I've found is the Twitter apps are better on iOS. I think the Yelp app is better too, but I wasn't using Yelp heavily before I got my iPhone.

There is the issue of "it just works" that's got me holding off on stuff like moving my parents to Android. But the last time I got a new Android phone was their Ginger Bread release. And getting things working like I wanted was a hassle. Now that Android has moved a couple of versions past that, and I'm really annoyed with iOS, I think I'm getting a Galaxy Nexus. Is setting that thing up goes really smoothly, I may just move my parents over there.

Also, I'm waiting to this summer to decide, when iOS 7 comes out. How far behind Apple is in a lot of stuff is really shocking. Now that I got an iPhone, I see why they fired that Scott Forstall guy. I'm waiting to see what Jonny Ives can do before ai move my parents to Android.
Click to expand...

You will be tarred and feathered for speaking against the great all knowing perfect apple!

Extra features and capabilities on your device is a bad thing, unless apple does it and then it's innovative! People don't want that stuff unless apple does it! That's when is brilliant
 
thehustleman said:
You will be tarred and feathered for speaking against the great all knowing perfect apple!

Extra features and capabilities on your device is a bad thing, unless apple does it and then it's innovative! People don't want that stuff unless apple does it! That's when is brilliant
Click to expand...

This thread isn't going to be anything but a troll fest is it?

Do the admins ever make an attempt to keep the level of discourse at a little higher level here?
 
I agree - widgets would give iOS a fresh look. I'm not sure why they are so against adding it in.
 
moonman239 said:
People like to cite battery life as the reason Apple didn't allow third-party widgets in the Notification Center. I say that's not true. If the mere addition of widgets has a significant impact on battery, then so do push notifications and local notifications.

The solution to the battery problem is this. If new data is available, the widget can be updated via a widget service. This is similar to how push notifications are delivered - they are sent to Apple, then to the users' devices.
Click to expand...

I hate to point out the obvious but push mail and push notifications do have an impact on the battery and it can be very significant depending on how many and signal strength.

Apple even recommends turning them off to save battery.

http://www.apple.com/batteries/iphone.html

tumygupy.jpg
 
Apple has always been a company that does things the way it wants and not necesarily the way you want. They have been very sucessful doing that. There is an article on front page of macrumors and customer statisfaction and how they excel.

I know people who hate android and those that hate apple. Total flexibility is nice but not necessary or wanted by many. All the flexibilty adds complexity, etc. to an OS and although much more exists in a laptop world it doesn't totally exist there and those OS are much larger etc.
 
CTHarrryH said:
Apple has always been a company that does things the way it wants and not necesarily the way you want. They have been very sucessful doing that. There is an article on front page of macrumors and customer statisfaction and how they excel.
Click to expand...

They other day I pulled out my 2 year old Android phone running Ginger Bread and was showing my 65 year old aunt the things it could do that iOS couldn't she instantly wanted one and was like, "OMG!"

Most users are satisfied because they don't know what's out there. The phone does what it does and they aren't able to imagine, "you know, if it just did this!".

But the knowledge is coming to these regular users, just like it came to my aunt. It will take awhile, but it is coming. Apple is behind, they need to catch up.

CTHarrryH said:
All the flexibilty adds complexity, etc. to an OS and although much more exists in a laptop world it doesn't totally exist there and those OS are much larger etc.
Click to expand...

There's a lot of features, if well designed, wouldn't add complexity. And other features that could be turned off by default, only turned on if you install an app that uses them - these would be stuff like new API's Apple could provide.
 
levander said:
They other day I pulled out my 2 year old Android phone running Ginger Bread and was showing my 65 year old aunt the things it could do that iOS couldn't she instantly wanted one and was like, "OMG!"

Most users are satisfied because they don't know what's out there. The phone does what it does and they aren't able to imagine, "you know, if it just did this!".

But the knowledge is coming to these regular users, just like it came to my aunt. It will take awhile, but it is coming. Apple is behind, they need to catch up.



There's a lot of features, if well designed, wouldn't add complexity. And other features that could be turned off by default, only turned on if you install an app that uses them - these would be stuff like new API's Apple could provide.
Click to expand...
Some certainly fall into that category, but there are many out there who simply don't need and/or care for something, and there are still others who might care about some of those things but put more value into some other things that are better (at the very least for them) on the phone they end up going with, even if it doesn't do some of those other ("lesser", at least to those people) things they might want or care about.

That's not to say that there aren't things that could and should be improved and/or added to iOS, for example, but what those things are can and does differ from person to person actually.
 
C DM said:
That's not to say that there aren't things that could and should be improved and/or added to iOS, for example, but what those things are can and does differ from person to person actually.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this is what I figured before I got an iPhone. I'm a software engineer by trade, and am very used to hacking hardware and software to get it to do things I want but it doesn't do out of the box. I overclocked my first PC at 13 years old. I have done so many of these hacks that I'm sick and tired of doing them. I only hack them now if for some reason I can make money off the hack.

And that's what I figured people were complaining about with the iPhone, stuff that really didn't matter. But after I got my iPhone, it's behind in so many ways, maybe not everything that bothers me is going to bother the next person, but it's so restrictive, there's gonna be something or other that bothers almost everyone. Or is going to bother almost everyone as more and more people find out about Android.

C DM said:
there are still others who might care about some of those things but put more value into some other things that are better (at the very least for them)
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was expecting to find things about the iPhone that were a lot better than how things worked on Android. I am really, really surprised I haven't found anything yet. Well, I found a couple of small things, as stated above..

But like you say, maybe I just use my phone different and other people have found stuff on iOS they like 10 times better. But whatever these things are, they're not that prevalent because I make pretty heavy use of the phone.

All these people saying they don't want to add features because it drains battery... I got about the same battery life out of my old Atrix 4G that I'm getting out of my iPhone 4S.

I'm gonna go read reviews of the Galaxy Nexus that I'm thinking about switching to. Hopefully there's something wrong with that phone that I'm not getting.
 
levander said:
All these people saying they don't want to add features because it drains battery... I got about the same battery life out of my old Atrix 4G that I'm getting out of my iPhone 4S.
Click to expand...

Just to point out the obvious (again in this thread) but the Atrix 4G has a battery that's 23-28% larger (depending on webpage I look at 1800-1990 mah) then the 4S and it gets the same battery life? That's not good.

Secondly, it doesn't....

emuvare6.jpg


anemete2.jpg


Third the Atrix 4G was renowned for battery issues. XDA even has a fix, that requires root of course. Here's an article about it.

http://www.xda-developers.com/android/fix-for-motorola-atrix-4g-battery-issues-finalized/
 
moonman239 said:
People like to cite battery life as the reason Apple didn't allow third-party widgets in the Notification Center. I say that's not true. If the mere addition of widgets has a significant impact on battery, then so do push notifications and local notifications.

The solution to the battery problem is this. If new data is available, the widget can be updated via a widget service. This is similar to how push notifications are delivered - they are sent to Apple, then to the users' devices.
Click to expand...

Yeah that would work maybe...
Apple piece meals the developement so it could well be on the cards to allow push with payload. Which sounds like how iCloud works.

I'd also like to push upgrade that makes a RSS store that is cloud synced to your devices. Yes similar to google reader but with a documented API so many apps can use it.
 
moonman239 said:
People like to cite battery life as the reason Apple didn't allow third-party widgets in the Notification Center. I say that's not true. If the mere addition of widgets has a significant impact on battery, then so do push notifications and local notifications.

The solution to the battery problem is this. If new data is available, the widget can be updated via a widget service. This is similar to how push notifications are delivered - they are sent to Apple, then to the users' devices.
Click to expand...

I agree, also widgets(weather, stock) in the Notification Centre update only when you pull it down. They don't constantly update in the background.
 
I just love the expectations people have and are disappointed when a company doesn't do it their way. If you don't like apples products then why are so many here? Go to an android board. Apples products are reliable, secure and work as designed. I have rarely ever had concerns and they were all resolved with updates. Could their be tweaks? Sure. But nothing is built perfect in this world. Apple targets a certain type of user. They are worlds ahead of the game in hardware. Their product just looks better.
 
charlituna said:
Because its true. Apple is under no legal or moral obligation to do 99.9% of the things folks on boards say they must or even should. So if Apple doesn't want it, they won't. No other reasons needed.
Click to expand...

This is half true. Apple is under no obligation to add a feature if they don't want to. On the other hand, people are under no obligation to give Apple money for their products if they find them lacking.

So you have to think which is more important to Apple. Many of the features Android enjoys do consume a goodly bit of battery life. If they were to try to go for feature parity, they wouldn't have nearly as big of an advantage on that front. If there's one thing Apple prides itself on, it's the battery life of their devices.

Thing is, which would people prefer? Having a streamlined device that lasts 6 hours on a charge, or having a more flexible, capable device that lasts 4 and a half?
 
Ask them what you need to fix an iphone, the most common answer,

"take it to the genius bar", "return to apple for warranty".

I say ***** that ***** and fix it yourself, I like to see people with the I can FIX anything attitude now that's the right way of thinkin.
 
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